Who wants an offline/single player mode after CoH has ran it's course?
By
Anti_Proton,
Posted on: 2009-09-21 23:10 in Suggestions and Ideas
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Mmmmmmaybe. Anyone who set out to do that would have an awful lot of work to do, though, just getting it presentable. I mean, unless they've done a huge overhaul to the engine since I stuck my head in a couple years ago, the character animations, facial models, etc. are deep, deep in the Uncanny Valley, and the game world in general looks like one of those NASA animations of what the Moonbase was supposed to look like circa 1975. |
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
Actually, I would say quite the opposite from a technological point of view. It's the ultimate online sandbox, and would definitely make an easy place to start developing your own MMO.
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In case you didn't realize, the animations and facial textures are entirely player made (except for a couple default ones), along with most everything else in the game.|
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
Mmmmmmaybe. Anyone who set out to do that would have an awful lot of work to do, though, just getting it presentable. I mean, unless they've done a huge overhaul to the engine since I stuck my head in a couple years ago, the character animations, facial models, etc. are deep, deep in the Uncanny Valley, and the game world in general looks like one of those NASA animations of what the Moonbase was supposed to look like circa 1975.
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Their prim system also received an upgrade several years ago to include "sculpted" prims which can be of an arbitrary shape, allowing the more complex objects using less pieces.
Not to mention, gives the user access to a VERY powerful scripting system- and by that I don't mean client side... I mean server side, it's even possible to integrate with web APIs.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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Well, that would definitely explain the unmistakable imprimatur of Sturgeon's Law on the whole affair. |
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
In case you didn't realize, the animations and facial textures are entirely player made (except for a couple default ones), along with most everything else in the game.
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But yeah, given that, I can definitely see how it could be a great development tool for someone who knew what he (or she) was doing. In fact, with that in mind I'm slightly surprised that 2L hasn't become the Quake Engine of the MMO world - or maybe it has, I haven't been paying a lot of attention to who's developing what in that regard lately, other than to watch with bemusement as Jack Emmert sets out to make an MMO out of the license with the least MMO-appropriate premise I can think of off the top of my head. Watching the development of a game you know isn't going to work is a bit like watching a car accident in slow motion.
SL is a lot like the internet... there's a load of crap everywhere, and some stuff that'll give your nightmares... but there's some stuff that's actually pretty amazing.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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I think if we stopped calling Second Life a game (and "game" is inherent in the MMORPG acronym), we'd all be happier with it and have a much easier time understanding each other. I'm not sure WHAT I would call it, besides a business, but it is decidedly not a game any more so than printer paper and a packet of colour markers. And believe me, I've made more than a few games out of those.|
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
In case you didn't realize, the animations and facial textures are entirely player made (except for a couple default ones), along with most everything else in the game.
Their prim system also received an upgrade several years ago to include "sculpted" prims which can be of an arbitrary shape, allowing the more complex objects using less pieces. Not to mention, gives the user access to a VERY powerful scripting system- and by that I don't mean client side... I mean server side, it's even possible to integrate with web APIs. |
That's not a BAD thing, mind you. To each his own, but presenting it as a game tends to have a lot of people go "Huh?"
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Asherons Call was my all time favorite game started it in beta and was there for 7 years awesome would go to an AC 3 in a sec. have to admit I wasnt an AC2 fan tho but AC3 would sooo be there if it was an up to date version of the original.tc
As someone who used to spend a lot of time on MUCKs and MUSHes - IMO, 2L is a lot like those just with graphics. Which means occasional islands of neat building and/or coding surrounded by vast tracts of trash and idiocy. Lots of people getting together to talk, play mini-games, show off their flashy imaginary clothing, and pretend to bump the naughty bits of their pretty and/or furry avatar together with other like-minded sorts.
It's not the Future, though it's a decent rendition of the Metaverse for this time and tech level. Mostly what it is is a whole bunch of people stumbling around without a clue, trying to fulfill certain basic desires - companionship, money, sex. And isn't that basically what real life is?
My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
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I never called it a game |
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I think if we stopped calling Second Life a game (and "game" is inherent in the MMORPG acronym), we'd all be happier with it and have a much easier time understanding each other. I'm not sure WHAT I would call it, besides a business, but it is decidedly not a game any more so than printer paper and a packet of colour markers. And believe me, I've made more than a few games out of those.
That's not a BAD thing, mind you. To each his own, but presenting it as a game tends to have a lot of people go "Huh?" |
SL is something that games can be built upon, though. I think a decent analogy would be to say that second life is to a game as paper is to art. It itself isn't one, but many exist within... and it can be used for many other things as well, whether that's just to have a virtual business or what have you (I've actually heard of a few artists that have created stuff in SL, some of it was rather impressive!).
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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Isn't real life what we try to AVOID by playing games, though? I run into that a lot with people I know when it comes to leisurely activities, because I tend to complain about and dislike a lot of things in my games that I do every day in real life. But my response tends to be that if I wanted real life, I'd shut down my PC and walk outside. Since I'm cooped-up in here, I must want something else.|
Originally Posted by Megajoule
It's not the Future, though it's a decent rendition of the Metaverse for this time and tech level. Mostly what it is is a whole bunch of people stumbling around without a clue, trying to fulfill certain basic desires - companionship, money, sex. And isn't that basically what real life is?
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That's what confounds me about Second Life. I can understand shipping off to a game that's vastly different than real life where I can... Well, see pretty pictures, essentially. But what is the appeal to leading, essentially, a second life inside a computer game that is essentially a mirror of the life you lead offline? I guess I could ask the same about The Sims, but at least that game is a little more goal-oriented (level up stats, progress through your job, make bigger house) so it kind of works. But I guess that appeals to my love of construction, and even that doesn't last long.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I dont think a Singleplayer CoH will ever come out imo
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That's the main point to me.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
It's better than nothing.
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Apparently I'm not going to get tired of this game. (Who knew?) At some point, the game in its current form won't exist. I understand completely that it's more fun to team with other people and I prefer that....as long as it lasts.
The question is, "what about later?". I'm definitely interested in "better than nothing".
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If The Sims sppeals to your love of construction and SL doesn't... you've obviously not looked much at SL |
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Isn't real life what we try to AVOID by playing games, though? I run into that a lot with people I know when it comes to leisurely activities, because I tend to complain about and dislike a lot of things in my games that I do every day in real life. But my response tends to be that if I wanted real life, I'd shut down my PC and walk outside. Since I'm cooped-up in here, I must want something else.
That's what confounds me about Second Life. I can understand shipping off to a game that's vastly different than real life where I can... Well, see pretty pictures, essentially. But what is the appeal to leading, essentially, a second life inside a computer game that is essentially a mirror of the life you lead offline? I guess I could ask the same about The Sims, but at least that game is a little more goal-oriented (level up stats, progress through your job, make bigger house) so it kind of works. But I guess that appeals to my love of construction, and even that doesn't last long. |
SL is an entirely player constructed world. Inside of which, people have created loads of different games (including a variety of combat systems), as well as many other things.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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Because it's not just a mirror (or not a true one). It's a "life" where you can satisfy all the desires that go unfulfilled in this one, albeit only as images and lines of text on a monitor. You can be beautiful (or the other gender, or furry, or whatever). You can own and wear clothes that would be extremely expensive (or outright impossible) in reality. You can dance, in a very limited fashion, even if you have two left feet or no rhythm in RL. You can have hawt imaginary sex with no consequences. You can build, you can create, you can fly.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
But what is the appeal to leading, essentially, a second life inside a computer game that is essentially a mirror of the life you lead offline?
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You're right that no one would play "Cruddy Apartment and Minimum Wage Job: the Game." The draw is escapism. If SL's a mirror, it's the Mirror of Erised. It shows you the life that you (have been programmed by the media to) want to have.
My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
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Whoa nelly!|
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
If The Sims sppeals to your love of construction and SL doesn't... you've obviously not looked much at SL
SL is an entirely player constructed world. Inside of which, people have created loads of different games (including a variety of combat systems), as well as many other things. |
Unless what I've heard is completely off I don't think the comparison to the Sims and Second Life is all that correct.
Doesn't 2L need you to put real life money into it to get anything done in it? Unlike the Sims?
Also I would think the construction and family building tools in the Sims would be easier to use "from the get go".
If what I've seen and read is correct, then I can easily see how someone who likes the Sims may not like something like 2L, as 2L seems to be waaaaay more advanced than the simplicity of the Sims.
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Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
I would like that as an option in the now actually, just for fun, teaching new player friends the ropes, etc.
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If you want to own your own property, or buy items from others, you'll need the in-world currency. One method is to purchase it with real money. Other methods include selling your creations or working, etc. | Doesn't 2L need you to put real life money into it to get anything done in it? Unlike the Sims? |
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| Also I would think the construction and family building tools in the Sims would be easier to use "from the get go". |
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| If what I've seen and read is correct, then I can easily see how someone who likes the Sims may not like something like 2L, as 2L seems to be waaaaay more advanced than the simplicity of the Sims. |
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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The Sims has a point - earn money, build up with it. Second Life does not. That's the point, ironically. It's a sandbox game, and I HATE sandbox games with a passion. You could have the best sandbox game in the world, I'll still get bored with it within the span of 15 minutes. If I'll be making my own fun, I might as well shut down the game and open up Word to work on one of the myriad of pending stories.|
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
If The Sims sppeals to your love of construction and SL doesn't... you've obviously not looked much at SL
SL is an entirely player constructed world. Inside of which, people have created loads of different games (including a variety of combat systems), as well as many other things. |
When I say "construction," I don't mean just making stuff, I mean LITERALLY construction. A while ago I got myself a Crane Simulator game out of somewhere, and I rather enjoyed coming to an empty lot at mission 1 and leaving behind a full-size two-storey house, created piece by piece. I didn't design it, I just put the pieces together, the same thing I've been doing with Lego since I was something like 10. But always with the manual.
In fact, that's one reason I dislike base building - it's far, far, FAR too much work if I want to make something decent, adjusting little details and making minor changes. It's also why I dislike the character editor of Champions Online - it's so complicated and so involved that it turns me off. It's just too much work.
Amusingly, that's also why I gave up on the Sims. When it was one game, it was cool. When it was a few expansions, that was all right. When it was a zillion expansions, it was not cool, and now that it's per-piece micro transactions, forget about it. One of the things that's quintessential to me in any game is the actual GAME. A game that's just a world, possibly with meaningless mini-games, is not something I would call a game or something I would play.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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pfffft! Legos were most fun when you chunked the manual!| But always with the manual. |
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| A game that's just a world, possibly with meaningless mini-games, is not something I would call a game or something I would play. |
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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I think we'll just have to disagree here.
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I've been told that numerous times, and I know for some people just taking the bricks and making their own creations is the best part. For me, it's torture. I'm a creative person, but I'm creative with words and numbers, not objects.|
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
pfffft! Legos were most fun when you chunked the manual!
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All games are just worlds with meaningless mini-games
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Interestingly, City of Heroes is the least virtual-world-like MMO I've seen, though I haven't played Guild Wars. Yes, technically, you have an open world, but it's separated into zones defined by activity, and the actual game that is the G in the acronym actually takes place in out-of-world instances. It's not as "game-like" as it could be, but as MMOs go, it's about as close as it gets while still retaining a consistent world.
That's why I'd like to buy a single-player version of this game if and when it goes bust - because unlike just about any other MMO I'm aware of, City of Heroes CAN be played as a single-player game if you put your mind to it.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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It may get lonely, but I wouldn't mind it at all.
As far as size, I think the earlier poster overestimates what the server code (on a single person server) would be like - the server doesn't have to deal with graphics and the like, just call out to the client what's where.
Would I play a single player COH...
I'd play if they released the server for others to run, yes. COH as is now, single player, probably not for very long.
Now, give me a SP game *in the COH universe* (with the character customization, etc. that we know and love,) quite possibly.
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Considering the vast majority of the client's installation size consists of textures, it's highly unlikely it'd require too much additional disk space (hell, since it probably runs on *nix, you could probably fit the entire server + a minimum linux install into a 2 gig virtual machine).
| As far as size, I think the earlier poster overestimates what the server code (on a single person server) would be like - the server doesn't have to deal with graphics and the like, just call out to the client what's where. |
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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I want to say they'd mentioned it was running on Windows. Can't cite it at the moment though.
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Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
Considering the vast majority of the client's installation size consists of textures, it's highly unlikely it'd require too much additional disk space (hell, since it probably runs on *nix, you could probably fit the entire server + a minimum linux install into a 2 gig virtual machine).
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That explains why they take the server down so much |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
I want to say they'd mentioned it was running on Windows. Can't cite it at the moment though.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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We've been saving Paragon City for eight and a half years. It's time to do it one more time.