best primary for Time corruptor?
By
Call Me Awesome,
Posted on: 2012-03-22 07:50 in Player Questions
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Dual Pistols does have some apparently good powers, but I'm not really looking for weapons sets.(concept reasons)|
Originally Posted by Granite Agent
I have a 50 Fire/Time corr. I see my SG mates playing 50 Time/DP Defs. I went Fire for the reason above. But in DP's favor, it has a nice short-recharge Tier 9 nuke/PBAOE that seems to synergize well with the other PBAOE. Sometimes it feels that while I am plinking away using Fireball and Rain of Fire (and Fire Breath), they are doing more PBAOE using this nuke. *shrug*
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Dual Pistols also doesn't seem forthcoming enough with the detailed info on the swap ammo powers.
Edit:
I just noticed the forum join date for you, Carnifax, and Granite here. I feel "old"(as far as how long I have played) and yet I'm the one askign a lot of questions.
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Illusion time troller is wonderful I have a 50 that is rocks and is fun to play.
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Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
Thanks. Any idea how much -recharge that takes to reach?
And to further derail the thread, now I'm also considering a Time controller after looking at the very nice Gravity changes and looking at Electric Control for the first time. I also wonder how well Illusion Control works with Time.(no IOs again so obviously nowhere near perma PA, so how is it without Phantom Army?) I'm leaning towards Gravity for concept and because I love the graphics, but Illusion is very nice and cool and Electric seems possibly powerful. I may have to just make both a corruptor and controller with Time Manipulation. |
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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IOed?|
Originally Posted by Darth_Khasei
Illusion time troller is wonderful I have a 50 that is rocks and is fun to play.
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I really can't rely on Phantom Army.
Even before I lost IO access by unsubscribing with Freedom, I made it a point to avoid powers that "needed" to be perma to make a difference but I just couldn't get them there easily enough, along with powers that just have stupidly long recharges(hello AoE holds).
I can't rely on powers that are down more than 30 seconds between up time, so I work without them and learn new ways. It tends to make me better, but it makes a lot of sets worse.
If I'm going with Illusion, I'll be relying on Phantasm, Spectral Terror, Blind and, the always fun confuse, Deceive. The knockback in Phantasm and his decoy won't always be helpful, and the set really lacks AoE damage to go with Time's aggro-hungry ways.
It would be a purely concept and cool look pairing, while still working great for cautious play(Time's Juncture and Distortion Field not used).
Yes, I want it all, sadly.
I want power enough to relatively safely take on groups of enemies in melee, hence Time Manipulation.
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Phantom Army doesn't need to be perma, and if I was running an SO only build then Time would be my first port of call due to the tasty self-recharge the tier 9 has. And both TJ and DF would work nicely really nicely with it. You'll be safe in melee anyway once you start stacking Spectral and TJs -ToHit. And Phants Decoy doesn't do knockback, unless that's changed recently, only Phantasm himself does. |
Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
IOed?
I really can't rely on Phantom Army. Even before I lost IO access by unsubscribing with Freedom, I made it a point to avoid powers that "needed" to be perma to make a difference but I just couldn't get them there easily enough, along with powers that just have stupidly long recharges(hello AoE holds). I can't rely on powers that are down more than 30 seconds between up time, so I work without them and learn new ways. It tends to make me better, but it makes a lot of sets worse. If I'm going with Illusion, I'll be relying on Phantasm, Spectral Terror, Blind and, the always fun confuse, Deceive. The knockback in Phantasm and his decoy won't always be helpful, and the set really lacks AoE damage to go with Time's aggro-hungry ways. It would be a purely concept and cool look pairing, while still working great for cautious play(Time's Juncture and Distortion Field not used). Yes, I want it all, sadly. I want power enough to relatively safely take on groups of enemies in melee, hence Time Manipulation. |
Electrical Control is a nice set, but it's a low damage one. Jolting Chain does poor enough damage, it's a soft control power primarily.
IO license is $2 or 140-160 PP's, which is a deal.
Having said that I understand if you want to go SO only period. I leveled it on a mainly SO build and it was not perma PA at that time and I did fine. Certainly not the beast it is with IO's but that is a given as NO build is as good with SO's only vs an IO build.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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I forgot that Spectral Terror debuffed to-hit. I think the decoy uses the same attacks as Phantasm, but I'm not sure or sure if they do knockback.|
Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
Phantom Army doesn't need to be perma, and if I was running an SO only build then Time would be my first port of call due to the tasty self-recharge the tier 9 has. And both TJ and DF would work nicely really nicely with it. You'll be safe in melee anyway once you start stacking Spectral and TJs -ToHit. And Phants Decoy doesn't do knockback, unless that's changed recently, only Phantasm himself does.
Electrical Control is a nice set, but it's a low damage one. Jolting Chain does poor enough damage, it's a soft control power primarily. |
It's still low AoE damage compared to even other low AoE damage sets, and low single target I believe.
At least Jolting Chain has a quick recharge, but I wonder how it really is in practice. It looks like it will really add up, depending on how many jumps it does and if it can hit the same target multiple times.
The Gremlins also get Jolting Chains, and the Electric Control set really seems like a safe one for AoE madness.
How would you rate Electric Control compared to Gravity?
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I refuse to pay for the license on principle, especially as I would be stuck paying $2 every month forever and ever and ever....("This is the song that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friends...." |
Originally Posted by Darth_Khasei
IO license is $2 or 140-160 PP's, which is a deal.
Having said that I understand if you want to go SO only period. I leveled it on a mainly SO build and it was not perma PA at that time and I did fine. Certainly not the beast it is with IO's but that is a given as NO build is as good with SO's only vs an IO build. |
)SOs and HOs are less of headache as well.
Illusion is pretty good too. I just find it a more cautious set than Time Manipulation seems to encourage.(meaning less likely to dive into a huge group)
Ok, I'm even less decided than I was at the start.
I've been looking at the numbers an graphics for all these sets.
It is just such a hard choice.
Radiation = fast damage, defense debuffs, not much to boost survivability but damage is fun
Illusion = really cool concept and look, slow damage really, no AoE, cautious confuser, kockback in pet is bad for Time
Electric = built to mix it up in melee, good AoEs but low damage, less endurance issues
Gravity = really cool concept and look, good damage, knockback is bad for Time, repel in the melee prone Singularity isn't good for time, Propel is one of the coolest powers ever
They all have their advantages but all have disadvantages too. It's so hard to choose.
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One of each it is so!|
Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
Ok, I'm even less decided than I was at the start.
I've been looking at the numbers an graphics for all these sets. It is just such a hard choice. Radiation = fast damage, defense debuffs, not much to boost survivability but damage is fun Illusion = really cool concept and look, slow damage really, no AoE, cautious confuser, kockback in pet is bad for Time Electric = built to mix it up in melee, good AoEs but low damage, less endurance issues Gravity = really cool concept and look, good damage, knockback is bad for Time, repel in the melee prone Singularity isn't good for time, Propel is one of the coolest powers ever They all have their advantages but all have disadvantages too. It's so hard to choose. |
I don't believe Singy is melee prone any more though
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Since when?|
Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
One of each it is so!
I don't believe Singy is melee prone any more though |
And sadly, I do not have the room for that many characters. I have room for 2 for sure, but have other characters that I do not want deleted filling the other slots.
Also, I think that is too many characters to play. I need to keep it down to 2 so I don't get tired of not being max level so fast, especially when I want to take my time to learn the set and enjoy some of the story in the game.
When did Singularity get a fix for "gotta melee" fever?
I really want to know.
Which set do you rate higher, assuming SOs and without a secondary?
Gravity or Illusion?
I'm probably going to make one of each, saving Radiation/Time for another time when I am more willing to play a more risky character, or can free a 3rd slot.
Electric just looks a bit too busy, odd to slot compared to everything else I have played and much too low damage even compared to Illusion that has no AoE.
Illusion does have the nice Spectral Terror to keep me safe and debuff to-hit.
Gravity just has the coolest looking powers(especially Propel), one of the best pets in Singularity, pretty good damage and an AoE immobilize at least.
I just wonder which is best between Illusion and Gravity because I have 2 name ideas and want the best name for the best set.
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Best? Dunno. Which of the two would I pick (I have both at 50 with other secondaries), Illusion. The recharge + PAs is overwhelmingly tempting. But then I'm waiting for Traps proliferation before I play Grav again.
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Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
When did Singularity get a fix for "gotta melee" fever?
I really want to know. Which set do you rate higher, assuming SOs and without a secondary? Gravity or Illusion? I'm probably going to make one of each, saving Radiation/Time for another time when I am more willing to play a more risky character, or can free a 3rd slot. Electric just looks a bit too busy, odd to slot compared to everything else I have played and much too low damage even compared to Illusion that has no AoE. Illusion does have the nice Spectral Terror to keep me safe and debuff to-hit. Gravity just has the coolest looking powers(especially Propel), one of the best pets in Singularity, pretty good damage and an AoE immobilize at least. I just wonder which is best between Illusion and Gravity because I have 2 name ideas and want the best name for the best set. |
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Why waiting for Traps?|
Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
Best? Dunno. Which of the two would I pick (I have both at 50 with other secondaries), Illusion. The recharge + PAs is overwhelmingly tempting. But then I'm waiting for Traps proliferation before I play Grav again.
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I do like Illusion's safety, while Gravity is mostly left to be vulnerable without confuse. Though I have been relatively safe with Gravity before as well.
I think the only thing for sure that is rough is the endurance cost of Superior Invisibility, especially if I will be running Time's Juncture.
It's still a tough choice. lol
Edit:
It's probably a little easier to play Illusion/Time fully due to Illusion being less busy as a primary compared to Gravity, but I don't know.
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Traps has quite a bit of control to add to Gravity's somewhat lacking toolkit for that purpose. A single target Immob + Slow, AoE slow field, AoE -tohit/-damage/stun, and... whatever you want to call Poison Trap (mechanically it's an AoE hold, but it's actually a lot more complicated in practice). It also has status protection/+defense, some AoE damage, and insane -resist debuff potential. All in all it complements Gravity (and, really, controllers in general) very well.|
Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
Why waiting for Traps?
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RE:Power Boost + Farsight, yes, it is possible for Farsight to be balanced with and without Power Boost.
Balance in gaming is based on player choice. The choice you make by taking (or not taking) Power Boost with Farsight is this: You either do it and specialize more heavily in defensively buffing your teammates, or, you don't, and instead you pick up more utility or damage (or both!) with your Epic power picks.
Game balance is not an A =/= 2xA equation, it's far more complicated than that because there thousands of variables involved and every choice you make or don't make changes them. In your argument you would have to consider Power Boost + Farsight versus, say, Indomitable Will + Farsight, which gives you significantly more psi defense and Status Protection.
Yes, Farsight has very obvious synergy with Power Boost; it is not the only power to do so, it was discusses heavily in beta and wasn't changed (they can easily flag a power to ignore boost effects if they want to, and they have done so in the past when they felt the need). It is not, however, the only choice, and I have seen many, many Time Manipulators choose another option, which is perfectly indicative of balance in practice.
Edit: Figured I'd answer a few more of your questions.
Electric Control/Time Manipulation is extremely effective, yes; I love mine to death, but it is a combo you sort of need to be in the mood for, because it does very little damage solo. Mine is Elec/Time/Primal, and he is extremely safe to play and can really control a battlefield absurdly well.
Jolting Chains is somewhat deceptive. The average damage and DPA listed in the real numbers are the absolute maximum total damage it can deal, when all targets are added together. Normal AoEs show these values per target, but because of Jolting Chain's mechanical nature, that doesn't happen. The actual values per target are 1/16 the displayed (meaning, yes, it does very little damage).
It does rapidly recharge and knockdown every hit though, which is great. If you're willing to buy a single SBO, the proc from Devastation (Ranged Damage, Chance to Hold) is amazing in it, and can't ordinarily be slotted in a multi-target power, but, again, because Chains work in unique ways, it has great synergy here.
@Draeth Darkstar
Virtue [Heroes, Roleplay], Freedom [Villains], Exalted [All Sides, Roleplay]
Code:
I24 Proc Chance = (Enhanced Recharge + Activation Time) * (Current PPM * 1.25) / 60*(1 + .75*(.15*Radius - 0.011*Radius*(360-Arc)/30)) Single Target Radius = 0. AoE Non-Cone Arc = 360.
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It's in the i22 patch notes, so pretty recently.
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Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
When did Singularity get a fix for "gotta melee" fever?
I really want to know. |
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I don't know about Singy but Phantasm still just loves to run in and say hello... just like his AI's been borked for the last couple of issues. Cast Phanty and engage a mob; he will take a shot from range, summon his decoy and then LEEEROY JENKINS! right into melee. Plan to slot for recharge because you're going to need to resummon his suicidal butt frequently.
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Originally Posted by Hopeling
It's in the i22 patch notes, so pretty recently.
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COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
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1) It can't be balanced, between different ancillary pool powers, when the difference Power Boost makes is so HUGE.|
Originally Posted by Draeth Darkstar
RE:Power Boost + Farsight, yes, it is possible for Farsight to be balanced with and without Power Boost.
Balance in gaming is based on player choice. The choice you make by taking (or not taking) Power Boost with Farsight is this: You either do it and specialize more heavily in defensively buffing your teammates, or, you don't, and instead you pick up more utility or damage (or both!) with your Epic power picks. |
Is it not huge? Then it would be balanced, but we all know it is huge or it wouldn't even be a topic of discussion.
2) Yes, balance is where all choices look as equally valuable as possible(such as one power compared to its copy with a different visual effect but same numbers, that is absolute balance).
Power Boost + Farsight makes every other choice look "less valuable"(some would say "gimped" and "stupid") in comparison.
That is the problem.
The fact that I have to "refuse to take Power Boost, despite its clear advantage" is an indication of the imbalanced performance of the combination.
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I must have glossed over this:|
Originally Posted by Hopeling
It's in the i22 patch notes, so pretty recently.
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| Singularity once again prefers to stay out of melee range of foes if possible. |
He doesn't even have any melee attacks or any aura like Singularity's repel aura.
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This is my second account. My first account has played since the original CoH beta ;P
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Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
I just noticed the forum join date for you, Carnifax, and Granite here. I feel "old"(as far as how long I have played) and yet I'm the one askign a lot of questions.
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Update:
I settled on illusion/Time for the primary character I want.
I ruled out Gravity and Electric Control for the secondary character.
Electric is cool and powerful, but it's slow and safe just like Illusion. Illusion has some benefits over Electric, though. I just didn't want two slow and safe characters, especially if they're only good in similar situations. Gravity just didn't fit with Time other than concept. Gravity is just lacking both good AoE damage and an AoE that actually stops enemies form attacking.
I'm going to go with a corruptor for the other character, but I'm still unsure which attack set to use. I'm definitely leaning towards Radiation Blast, though.
The really cool thing is that I have been looking at the numbers for Time Manipulation far more closely than before.
Time Manipulation is actually better than Radiation Emission, in my opinion anyway. It gets the same damage debuff in that the Rad toggles get and half the to-hit debuff plus slows to keep enemies inside the area somewhat easier and a defense buff. The debuffs are not tied to easily ended enemy centered toggles either. It also has a better heal than Rad, in my opinion.
I really should have gotten Time Manipulation before, especially when it was on sale.
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This is all just your subjective opinion, and it is obviously not shared by all members of the community or the powers team.
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Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
1) It can't be balanced, between different ancillary pool powers, when the difference Power Boost makes is so HUGE.
Is it not huge? Then it would be balanced, but we all know it is huge or it wouldn't even be a topic of discussion. 2) Yes, balance is where all choices look as equally valuable as possible(such as one power compared to its copy with a different visual effect but same numbers, that is absolute balance). Power Boost + Farsight makes every other choice look "less valuable"(some would say "gimped" and "stupid") in comparison. That is the problem. The fact that I have to "refuse to take Power Boost, despite its clear advantage" is an indication of the imbalanced performance of the combination. |
@Draeth Darkstar
Virtue [Heroes, Roleplay], Freedom [Villains], Exalted [All Sides, Roleplay]
Code:
I24 Proc Chance = (Enhanced Recharge + Activation Time) * (Current PPM * 1.25) / 60*(1 + .75*(.15*Radius - 0.011*Radius*(360-Arc)/30)) Single Target Radius = 0. AoE Non-Cone Arc = 360.
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LOL|
Originally Posted by Draeth Darkstar
This is all just your subjective opinion, and it is obviously not shared by all members of the community or the powers team.
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I guess your definition of "balance" doesn't match the English language, or any other language's word that means the same.
FYI, the developers do try to balance things. They are watching Power Boost for issues, as they have said.
my two cents:
everyone likes fire because it's the 'best' in terms of game effectiveness.
sure it 'only' has damage, but as I'm fond of saying Death is the Ultimate Debuff. Match Fire with a secondary that provides its own survivability &/or debuffs and welcome to Easy Mode. The Goat is a fire/dark, and he's pretty amazing solo or in a group. His trip to 50 was more of a waltz than anything else- admittedly he was kitted out with really nice IO's the whole way, but the combo is deadly regardless.
Now just because it's the 'best' doesn't mean it's the most fun. My characters generally start with a theme that sounds fun to me, and barring the powersets absolutely falling flat or exhibiting zero synergy I always have fun. The Goat didn't end up fire/dark because I heard it was l337 but because he was a demon from beyond space & time- fire made sense, and so did dark.
For instance, AR gets a bad rap but is a fun corrupter primary. AOE, AOE & more AOE. Beanbag is a great mitigation power. Couple it with a control/mitigation heavy secondary and it's a lot of fun.
So what's best?
Fire is best.
What's going to be the most fun for you to play?
We have no idea!
Roll up something that sounds fun and go to town.
The game isn't so difficult you can't enjoy playing even an underperforming set.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
I'm going with Illusion/Time and Radiation/Time.
I'll consider other sets some other time, but these seemed to be the most synergistic and fun with the coolest concepts and graphics.
They're all 3 great sets as well.
Now, if only I had more slots. Time is a slot hungry beast with all those very nice powers and the recharge demand on some.
Face it, fire is the best everything else depend on personal restrictions is next. So pick one with the secondary effects "you" want and be done with it. Not rocket science here.