not having a aoe immob might suck.
I guess you can Terrify then use Hurricane to position?
perma jump is ---> /up 1
Quote:
I was thinking of mass hypnosis - since it will only be used to solo. Although the damage caused by gales would negate sleep. |
Originally Posted by Hindenburg
not having a aoe immob might suck.
I guess you can Terrify then use Hurricane to position? |
On the other hand its rare that I see orange numbers go off above gales. Is that a bug or is the damage so stupidly low its not worth reporting?
Life is one big practical joke that we as the human race have yet to see the punchline to. Once you work that out the rest is easy.
Quote:
The damage for Gale is stupidly low. Gale is a pretty worthless power other than as an occasional "get out of my face" power. I almost never use Gale once I have Hurricane on any of my Stormies.|
Originally Posted by Ace_of_Hearts
I was thinking of mass hypnosis - since it will only be used to solo. Although the damage caused by gales would negate sleep.
On the other hand its rare that I see orange numbers go off above gales. Is that a bug or is the damage so stupidly low its not worth reporting? |
As you said, Mind/Storm lacks synergy, but both sets are so good that you can make it work . . . I have one at 39.
I mostly use Mass Hypnosis as a Containment setter for Terrify. Freezing Rain then messes up the fear effect, but is so good otherwise that it is still worth using.
I find telekinesis pretty worthless . . . the only power in Mind that isn't all that effective. However, you should try playing around with it to see if you can find strategies for making it effective. I still have it on my Mind/FF, so I can play around with it, but I don't have it on my Mind/Storm.
I prefer to use Hurricane and Super Speed to "herdicane" to get foes into a corner or cul-de-sac. The I can pull out Freezing Rain, Lightning Storm and Tornado, and take foes down one-by-one with my attack chain of Dom-Mez-Lev. I tend to use Confuse (and Mass Confusion) a lot to protect myself from aggo.
LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
Quote:
*any*/Storm can do what you describe IMO. As the other poster mentioned it will be difficult to keep them clustered and use tornado without a -KB power like an immobilization.|
Originally Posted by Ace_of_Hearts
Mind control is one of my favourite powersets and for a while now I've been thinking of pairing it with storm. I know there is not a lot of synergy between the two powersets because Freezing Rain does not get on well with Mass Hypnosis and Terrify but, tbh, thats one of the reasons why I'm attracted to it.
My theory is that a mind storm MAY make a very good controller for positional control (in otherwords use the map to your advantage). That is to use telekinesis, hurricane and gales to round up mobs and pin them down in a corner or against a wall THEN use freezing rain, tornado and thunder storm to take them out (with a little help from the ST attacks in Mind control). I understand that grav/storms can use what I call positional control to great effect. Was just wondering if mind/storms could do the same. Anyway all that is just theory and I've never actually tried it. Has anyone here tried this method of play? If so is it VERY difficult to pull off? I suspect I will need a lot of practice but I would only use this tactic for solo play and play more conventionally in teams. |
TK is a shadow of what it used to be. With it's long recharge and high endurance cost I don't see it being a significant contributor to the positioning you describe.
The thing that stands out the most concerning your proposed play style is do you intend to position the mobs without mezzing them? If so i hope you plan on building for DEF. Without mezzing and defense you will get creamed if you attempt this. (you didn't specify in your description so I didn't want to make the assumption that you would mez prior to herding)
Quote:
I'm not that daft! |
Originally Posted by Saltyhero13
The thing that stands out the most concerning your proposed play style is do you intend to position the mobs without mezzing them? If so i hope you plan on building for DEF. Without mezzing and defense you will get creamed if you attempt this. (you didn't specify in your description so I didn't want to make the assumption that you would mez prior to herding)
|
I figure that either mass hypnosis or terrify would cause the initial mez to the mobs, then use herding tactics to get them locked into a corner with hurricane and then take them out with a combination of freezing rain, tornado and lightning storm.
Just re-reading the paragraph is making me realise how SLOW soloing a mission would be using this tactic but as I mentioned above the playstyle is just an experiment on my part during solo missions. I wouldnt attempt it in a team.
Life is one big practical joke that we as the human race have yet to see the punchline to. Once you work that out the rest is easy.
Just remember that any repositioning of the mobs will also wake them up, it doesn't have to cause damage. For instance the repel in Hurricane or TK will both wake up sleepers.
TK *used* to be a very useful tool... But when they dropped it to *5* max targets and didn't reduce the incredible end cost they pretty much gutted it. It's sad, because it was one of the few powers that really required player SKILL to be effective, now I'm not really sure it's worth it. And I was a HUGE TK proponent back when I was originally lvling up Arg (Mind/Kin). It's still handy for stacking mag on things like Paragon Protectors with MOG up, or holding a tough boss ASAP, but it's a pale, pale shadow of it's former self.
Very sad. :-(
Arg
Mesmerize > Thunderclap as the opener. It will not wake Lieutenants I dont believe.
Power Boost > Total Domination > Freezing Rain > Energy Torrent > Terrify for moments when TD is up. Most likely only at very high levels.
Mind/Cold is a reasonable alternative to Mind/Storm if you team a bit.
I have a level 50 Mind/Storm. I've always found that the variety of different types of control, even when they don't have great synergy, will keep the bad guys bewildered, off balance, and vulnerable to being taken out or severely weakened. So, I say go for it. I loved playing mine up. But I will say that I didn't specifically focus on positional control or map tactics so much as I just focused on chaos and/or alternating and/or mixing different types of effects.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
Quote:
Forgive me! You were very specific in how you planned on placing the mobs but you never discussed how you would mez them. I figured you would miss my edit note. Haha!|
Originally Posted by Ace_of_Hearts
I'm not that daft!
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ace_of_Hearts
I figure that either mass hypnosis or terrify would cause the initial mez to the mobs, then use herding tactics to get them locked into a corner with hurricane and then take them out with a combination of freezing rain, tornado and lightning storm.
|
Unless its a chaotic playstyle you are going for, I think that you will drive yourself crazy without -KB from an Immobilize. Tornado will scatter anything you cluster every time you use it. -KB would make Hurricane a little more forgiving to use too.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ace_of_Hearts
Just re-reading the paragraph is making me realise how SLOW soloing a mission would be using this tactic but as I mentioned above the playstyle is just an experiment on my part during solo missions. I wouldnt attempt it in a team.
|
Overall I think a well played *any*/Storm can achieve the effect you describe. Its not necessarily exclusive or any better in a pairing with Mind/.
I do wonder if TK + Hurricane can somehow stack on big game like AVs?
Quote:
That's what I was going to say - I haven't played Storm, but I play FF a lot and it's really time-consuming to get every mob exactly where you want it, especially in outdoor maps where there aren't a lot of prime locations for herding. It'll be very slow work, but it's definitely worth it, even moreso on teams I'd say |
Originally Posted by Ace_of_Hearts
Just re-reading the paragraph is making me realise how SLOW soloing a mission would be using this tactic but as I mentioned above the playstyle is just an experiment on my part during solo missions. I wouldnt attempt it in a team.
|
Quote:
It's worth mentioning that this is not necessarily correct. Hurricane alone is capable of taking spawns to the ToHit floor, so there's not really a need to mez unless you're really that afraid of a 5% chance to take a hit.|
Originally Posted by Saltyhero13
The thing that stands out the most concerning your proposed play style is do you intend to position the mobs without mezzing them? If so i hope you plan on building for DEF. Without mezzing and defense you will get creamed if you attempt this. (you didn't specify in your description so I didn't want to make the assumption that you would mez prior to herding)
|
It takes a lot of practice to go from scattering an entire room to continually moving things tighter into the deathball, so don't obsess about it early on.
Edit: On Gale, it's possible to KB a single mob (even in a pack), provided that mob is at the edge of a group. This has applications mainly in sending things back into Freezing Rain or the Tank's taunt aura more immediately than is possible with just Hurricane. It works as long as you Gale at max range (or out of range and then step into range), since you're striking with the end of the cone.
Quote:
You can do this consistently on any mob regardless of scenario without a mezz and not die?|
Originally Posted by Midnight_Tempest
It takes a lot of practice to go from scattering an entire room to continually moving things tighter into the deathball, so don't obsess about it early on.
|
I want to see this. I'm always up to learning something new. What server are you on?
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Saltyhero13
You can do this consistently on any mob regardless of scenario without a mezz and not die?
I want to see this. I'm always up to learning something new. What server are you on? |
It's theoretically doable. Keep in mind that Defenders and Corruptors use the Storm set without very strong mezz powers and pull through. I don't know about mopping up in every possible scenario but Storm by itself does provide pretty strong capabilities. Much more so, IMO, after the introduction of incarnate powers to help it with endurance reduction.
Quote:
I'm on Freedom, and I assure you it's possible to position the mob without a Mez. How do you think Storm Defenders have been doing it? Hurricane slotted with the 4 ToHit Debuff pieces from Dark Watcher will apply a 59.1% ToHit Debuff for 10 seconds. Last I checked the numbers, it pulses on the order of every 0.25 seconds since they un-nerfed it, so you'll ToHit floor the mob almost immediately upon touching it with Hurricane's outer edge.|
Originally Posted by Saltyhero13
You can do this consistently on any mob regardless of scenario without a mezz and not die?
I want to see this. I'm always up to learning something new. What server are you on? |
From there, it's usually easiest to find a convenient corner, but it's possible to just keep a pack together - if more movement-intensive.
Edit: For the Controller version of Hurricane, the 4 ToHit pieces of Dark Watcher will increase the power's ToHit Debuff to 47.3%, which is still enough to ToHit floor an even-level mob.
Quote:
Good. |
Originally Posted by Midnight_Tempest
I'm on Freedom, and I assure you it's possible to position the mob without a Mez. How do you think Storm Defenders have been doing it? <snipped for brevity>
|
I would like to learn this by watching you if that's not a problem. I have toons on Freedom too. I sent you a PM to make arrangements. I'm looking forward to learning something new.As far as Storm/ Defenders I have not seen any break an alpha by "Herd"icaning unless the group was already somewhat clustered or aggro was already managed by another player via taunt or mez.
Quote:
I must have missed your PM in my message spam, drop me an in-game mail at @Midnight Tempest and I'll try to find some good examples for you.|
Originally Posted by Saltyhero13
Good.
I would like to learn this by watching you if that's not a problem. I have toons on Freedom too. I sent you a PM to make arrangements. I'm looking forward to learning something new.As far as Storm/ Defenders I have not seen any break an alpha by "Herd"icaning unless the group was already somewhat clustered or aggro was already managed by another player via taunt or mez. |
Edit: If I find a CoT map, one really bad example too.
Quote:
Cool. I appreciate it. I'll reach out next time I get a chance to get back in game.|
Originally Posted by Midnight_Tempest
I must have missed your PM in my message spam, drop me an in-game mail at @Midnight Tempest and I'll try to find some good examples for you.
Edit: If I find a CoT map, one really bad example too. |
Did some testing on my end too. SS or Hover+Jetpack/Steam Jet makes a big difference in applying the debuff quickly to the whole mob.
Mind control is one of my favourite powersets and for a while now I've been thinking of pairing it with storm. I know there is not a lot of synergy between the two powersets because Freezing Rain does not get on well with Mass Hypnosis and Terrify but, tbh, thats one of the reasons why I'm attracted to it.
My theory is that a mind storm MAY make a very good controller for positional control (in otherwords use the map to your advantage). That is to use telekinesis, hurricane and gales to round up mobs and pin them down in a corner or against a wall THEN use freezing rain, tornado and thunder storm to take them out (with a little help from the ST attacks in Mind control).
I understand that grav/storms can use what I call positional control to great effect. Was just wondering if mind/storms could do the same.
Anyway all that is just theory and I've never actually tried it. Has anyone here tried this method of play? If so is it VERY difficult to pull off? I suspect I will need a lot of practice but I would only use this tactic for solo play and play more conventionally in teams.