I19 Katana/Dark Survivability Build - Improvements?
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Thanks! Yeah, almost unfortunately, I like some of what I see in that (for instance, it didn't occur to me to go with a full Gladiator's Armor set), plus I've had some recent ideas of my own, so it looks like I'm going to lose the first of the two freespecs while I keep playing with ideas. Oh, well. I'm sitting on five veteran respecs, and so far it looks like I'm keeping the vast majority of my IOs, so I should be fine. I'm just so eager to actually play it!
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Originally Posted by Gaidin
Here's the build I came up with. There's a lot good about it, but a few things that don't come up to snuff. You may get some ideas from it, so I figured I'd post it (that and without it, you'd think I didn't even try.
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"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
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The "you have a week to respec all your characters" aspect of this issue is really aggravating.
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Originally Posted by Werner
Thanks! Yeah, almost unfortunately, I like some of what I see in that (for instance, it didn't occur to me to go with a full Gladiator's Armor set), plus I've had some recent ideas of my own, so it looks like I'm going to lose the first of the two freespecs while I keep playing with ideas. Oh, well. I'm sitting on five veteran respecs, and so far it looks like I'm keeping the vast majority of my IOs, so I should be fine. I'm just so eager to actually play it!
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Moonlighter
50s include MA/SD, MA/SR, DP/Elec, Claw/Inv, Kat/Dark, Kat/Fire, Spine/Regen, Dark/SD
First Arc: Tequila Sunrise, #168563
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Eh, it's more of a freebie than usual. I've failed completely to take advantage of it, but people who planned ahead better than I probably got the benefit on at least a couple characters. I just tend to take a wait and see attitude towards new issues, which bit me in this case.
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Originally Posted by Moonlighter
The "you have a week to respec all your characters" aspect of this issue is really aggravating.
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"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
End result of the Gladiator's Armor set idea from Gaidin: better hit points (1848), better resistance profile, AoE actually soft capped now instead of 0.1% below the cap, faster Hover speed, but 1 less point of knockback protection (11). I'm happy with the change.
I'm also thinking of dropping Vengeance and picking up Assault. Turns out I underestimated my recovery when I was using the I18 Mids', or maybe I've just accidentally picked up a lot more since then, and I can afford another toggle, again once I have the very rare. Until then, it's just one more thing to use situationally, one common situation being all my normal missioning. The down side is that Vengeance was a set mule for the Shield Wall +3% resistance, which now requires a slot, which I scavenged from Divine Avalanche. That brings my melee and lethal defense down to 70% from almost 75%, but my stated goal was just 70%. More is always better, but it's unlikely to come into play very often.
Do 13 toggles make me Toggle Man?
Resistances with the very rare are now:
60% smashing/lethal
57% psionic
55% negative
44% fire/cold
30% toxic
29% energy
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| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1599;782;1564;HEX;| |78DAA594596F12511480EF3050642B50A4FB4617D6B2D9566B6B34D56AA22D496D6| |B9F5432D2296011C8C043FBE60FD068AAD127DFB4EA4F303EF92B4CD43FE0D2EA1F| |3078960B6DC2A31338DF9DB3DD7BCEE192D95D720AF1F092503AAF94B45A2DBB9E3| |3B46A55372C192D5FCC752C96F45DBD681542F89B966C462FE97A6259AB6B656DA0| |A55DD2B7F5724D4F2C69C64E76D1785031BCD7CB05DDD0CBF54473E158AD544A896| |BA562BE5077F11A97C572DE4D6F2BBAB6A51BB542B1EA6CBE57C1E8BD5A2DE61297| |2B5B7BD98C56ABEBC65E2F1C6816BE8FF164F4342C226812222D4C614684608E326| |2848E4F009F88609422A3922A5952845369C619827D9A109F2144214A9151CA7748| |3424EC3F08CE9F8C5F84CE43C6112106512A4799D5190513795284FE3421304D189| |F2538C0DDC20509CB373AF45350591513AA54EB058055155D92A7CF49DE17E83A05| |AE36DE4CD87A14DCFF09A81C32A1639EBD6DA073C94A5C3283C74FFB77FD1518D5C| |D5BF77E214C7D25C421CC4D1D6858DC731CD6BF40A6C12E15C306D728C9F03A6383| |B00F615E39232FF76D98FB36CA7D1BE5BE8D72DF02DCB70444F9F88C269F3C63B76| |4609906A2808B5F96E66FC02354D0F47090D273919D7B259F81AD4F1EA36F9BDA35| |9E671408134506B77262879084A8019971E02C670A7EA6BACC601A92A62179B2207| |7F1399846E45E235C72904B0E71C9212E39C42547B8642F448DC9846332618413FA| |C034292736F99A5A1E7943881E30DE32DEF1C0DE13BA212A2C138665C2294EB80E1| |D8CC9DEC56254EA814B8884F44EDC8045482403D4E82EC893923FAB54809C07CDAD| |8B071FECFDCA494D9C9C56CDF29A814A21A71173EBE6FDD7F3C1D9CC635BB383DC4| |0B10A42D9C4D56D1477F0F52EAE345CDD4391C3D7C64767F3A8EE393CD07914F328| |1650F83D201EA1A7156F8E038513850B45270A370A0F0A1F8A7E14AF50346C10AC7| |2CD8D437BEB1F4328E3D492A393AA30A97EDB4FFCAFDCA4E9C4F91EC5F91E25F91E| |256F11D29B843FC75126E5258D3BFD82B14F48B54D28DAA649B769668E0704BDA54| |4D36D4EC773F80741C425B8| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
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How long has the Enzyme Exploit been around for the Hami-O's? Don't normally deal in them myself, so wasn't aware of it until recently. But, given it shouldn't be giving the bonus that it is, wouldn't it viably be safer to stick with the Cytoskeletons? If you swap the Enzymes with the Cyto's, it does result in a significant cut in the defenses (about 2% across). Still think it would be safer to go the exploited-free route I mentioned before. Still viable to get to 70/45/40-42 and meet the resistance expectations, all while widening the distance on end usage. Possible to get 1.2 net gain versus the .8 you're looking at right now.
| -snip from Werner- |
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Warning: crazy space limit reached. Please delete some crazy and try again. |
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It has been around forever. I think it has always been "bugged". In fact, it's been around so long that I've heard that a red name is on record saying these are no longer considered exploits, but simply the way the hamios work, and I guess what makes them still worth slotting occasionally instead of having a complete domination of IOs. I've not seen this supposed post, though, and it was also made almost forever ago if it was made. So the way they work is not something I ever expect to change. If it ever does, I'll respec at that point, and I'm comfortable with that.|
Originally Posted by John_Printemps
How long has the Enzyme Exploit been around for the Hami-O's? Don't normally deal in them myself, so wasn't aware of it until recently. But, given it shouldn't be giving the bonus that it is, wouldn't it viably be safer to stick with the Cytoskeletons? If you swap the Enzymes with the Cyto's, it does result in a significant cut in the defenses (about 2% across). Still think it would be safer to go the exploited-free route I mentioned before. Still viable to get to 70/45/40-42 and meet the resistance expectations, all while widening the distance on end usage. Possible to get 1.2 net gain versus the .8 you're looking at right now.
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I still need to look over what you did more carefully. I agree that Hasten would be very nice to have, and may be worth losing something for. I don't think defense is something I'm willing to give up though. One possibility is to give up damage output, going back to my old chain of Divine Avalanche -> Gambler's Cut -> Sting of the Wasp -> Gambler's Cut. But in my few attempts to make something of that, I've ended up not only with worse DPS, but just a worse build overall. I may keep poking at it now that the time pressure is off since I think I missed the deadline for the first freespec.
As for endurance, the most recent build should be sustainable for Stupid Scrapper Tricks once we get the very rare. Yeah, we don't know how long that will be, but I can fiddle with toggles a lot until that point, even if it's for months. And for normal play, I should be just fine with the blues that drop.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
The exploit has been around since I4-ish (? I think), whenever the Hami-Os were toned down from 50% ---> 30%. Castle was on record prior to I9 (still quoted on Paragon Wiki) that its an exploit they're aware of. That said ... 15 issues and counting, still out there. Obviously not a high priority (I know, I know, I'm going out on a limb with that one)
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Ah, I see. It was still definitely an interesting challenge none the less, to try and take out the exploit and get the same numbers.
| It has been around forever. |
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Warning: crazy space limit reached. Please delete some crazy and try again. |
It's been a while since I've been of the forums; nice to see new blood floating around the water coolers. Dove back into the game with Going Rogue and have been sneaking peeks at the ole Scrapper Haven from time to time. Caught wind of someone saying you'd started this thread, Werner, and I couldn't help but take a more detailed look.
Took your build and disassembled it for a few hours before attempting to put it back, and I must say seeing 40+% Defenses squeezed into Dark Armor is a nice feat, but I wanted to see if I could de-exploit it, and slot it up proper with Cytoskeletons instead of Enzymes. I've moved some things around, and looked into pushing the overall impression of the build. One thing I did go back and double-take was the fact I'd pushed Melee/Lethal to 75% originally, and realized you were only after 70%; so I tweaked range a bit to fix a few percentages I believed I wasn't going to actually get. The only thing I wasn't happy with was the 2.7% shortcomings on AoE defense. Beyond that, most everything else borderlines within a sneeze of your destined build. A percentage here or there, some cases halves and quarter percents, even. Cut as much EPS as I could manage, and raised what I could to widen the gap as much as possible. Start throwing off a few toggles and there's a massive difference, but only in the realm of maybe a 5 1/2 to 6 minute long fight with Conserve Power used once. Conserve would need another two minutes before its up again. You could, theoretically, pause/kite for twenty seconds, fight for forty, pause for twenty, fight for forty, pop Conserve, fight for 90 up to full, fight for another two minutes (etc) Running GC-DA-GD-GC-SD, indefinitely. That's at least an eleven minute bout, if the target can be taken down in that time frame. All hypothetical off estimate numbers and not accounting for any Incarnate usage or additional accolades that might sway final numbers (max End). If the Very Rare can extend the attack chain out into 180-200 seconds, then a small ten to fifteen second pause for end would quite easily carry the build, and--in my opinion--be a reasonable method.
Just a bit of food for thought. Most of the other goals would be easily reached, I just think shrinking R/AoE down 5% to virtually work Hasten into the build (removing, at best cause, Hover--again afflicting endurance woes for better performance).