Interesting. I think I like that idea.
While not bad (well, I wouldn't mind,) keep in mind that people still complain loud and long about Khelds getting Void/Quantum spawns in their missions, even after the special mobs have been severely nerfed.
As far as equality, I'd prefer they spend time working on the VEAT arcs instead. They're simply awful (past, oh, 15 or so. You can tell when the AT got rushed out.)
Just one more suggestion and then I'll stop posting after midnight(my brain runs on stupid after) for a while.
We have Natural epic ATs and we have a Science epic AT. The other Origins are missing out! what about a Technology Epic AT and a Mutation Epic AT and a Magic Epic AT. No idea what they'd be but it feels like Paragon Studios is missing the opportunity to have a very cool set-up by filling out the Origins with Epic ATs.
Its just my personal opinion but doesn't the Science Epic AT seem a little loney there with the other three Natural origin Epic ATs there.
Oh well enough sleep deprived crazy talk from me for the night.
Work in progress no more. I have decided that I'm going to put my worst spelling errors here. Triage Bacon, Had this baster idea, TL
R"I'm going to beat the Jesus out of Satan!" My Wife while playing Dante's Inferno
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I actually concur that it feels a little bit like warshades are the oddman out.|
Originally Posted by Crim_the_Cold
Just one more suggestion and then I'll stop posting after midnight(my brain runs on stupid after) for a while.
We have Natural epic ATs and we have a Science epic AT. The other Origins are missing out! what about a Technology Epic AT and a Mutation Epic AT and a Magic Epic AT. No idea what they'd be but it feels like Paragon Studios is missing the opportunity to have a very cool set-up by filling out the Origins with Epic ATs. Its just my personal opinion but doesn't the Science Epic AT seem a little loney there with the other three Natural origin Epic ATs there. |
But on the note of other Origin ATs:
My vote goes for a Midnighter Magic EAT, a Preat Clockwork for Tech EAT (Tier nine is becoming a super Warwalker for a few minutes! Awwww Yeah!), and-... Can't think of anything for a mutant EAT.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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Rikti EAT, please 
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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If you want equality between the Epics, why not go the other way and scrap the nonsense that is the Quantum and Void idea? It would make me hate Kheldians slightly less, at least.
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Originally Posted by Crim_the_Cold
Since Kheldians have special spawns I was thinking that non-villain alignment Soldiers and Widows should have a hit placed on them by the Arbiters. It would be neat if the price for them going rogue from Arachnos was being the target of special arachnos hit squads especially if the units are unique for that purpose and have some special advantage over the villain epic ATs.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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This.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
As far as equality, I'd prefer they spend time working on the VEAT arcs instead. They're simply awful (past, oh, 15 or so. You can tell when the AT got rushed out.) |
Also: Still interested in Rikti EAT.
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There are two problems I could see with a Midnighter Magic EAT. First would be the acronym that would result: MEAT. Secondly most of the missions would involve saving Percy from various villain groups that he keeps getting kidnapped by. |
Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel
I actually concur that it feels a little bit like warshades are the oddman out.
But on the note of other Origin ATs: My vote goes for a Midnighter Magic EAT, a Preat Clockwork for Tech EAT (Tier nine is becoming a super Warwalker for a few minutes! Awwww Yeah!), and-... Can't think of anything for a mutant EAT. |
Seriously though a Midnighter EAT could have a very cool story line that starts off with a hellion ritual goes through a few CoT cliches and eventually ends with stopping Darren Wade's plan. Midnighters even work for both sides since they accept both villains and heros into their ranks.
Work in progress no more. I have decided that I'm going to put my worst spelling errors here. Triage Bacon, Had this baster idea, TL
R"I'm going to beat the Jesus out of Satan!" My Wife while playing Dante's Inferno
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I support MEAT!|
Originally Posted by Crim_the_Cold
There are two problems I could see with a Midnighter Magic EAT. First would be the acronym that would result: MEAT.
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Could be worse, though. What if you had a pair of Tech EATs?
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Secondly most of the missions would involve saving Percy from various villain groups that he keeps getting kidnapped by. Seriously though a Midnighter EAT could have a very cool story line that starts off with a hellion ritual goes through a few CoT cliches and eventually ends with stopping Darren Wade's plan. Midnighters even work for both sides since they accept both villains and heros into their ranks. |
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How about not? I like getting the extra XP from getting extra mobs in a spawn. That's pretty much all Qs/Vs are these days.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
If you want equality between the Epics, why not go the other way and scrap the nonsense that is the Quantum and Void idea? It would make me hate Kheldians slightly less, at least.
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Actually a Rikti EAT would fit perfectly into the mutation origin. Think about it, some of the Rikti in Paragon City and the Rogue Isles are former members of the Lost faction who have been mutated first from human to Lost and then all the way to Rikti. Once again both sides work because we have the traditionalist split. Or another path is that you regain your human mind and resume what would have been your alignment inclination before your mutation. Either way story line could be to start off with trying to save other Lost from sharing your fate then move on to helping put Trolls into rehab, move up to stopping the superadine trade by taking down the family and finnally maybe have a negotiations gone wrong mission on the Rikti Homeworld (cutscenes and all).
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Rikti EAT, please
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Work in progress no more. I have decided that I'm going to put my worst spelling errors here. Triage Bacon, Had this baster idea, TL
R"I'm going to beat the Jesus out of Satan!" My Wife while playing Dante's Inferno
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True epic equality would mean:|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
If you want equality between the Epics, why not go the other way and scrap the nonsense that is the Quantum and Void idea? It would make me hate Kheldians slightly less, at least.
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Kheldian's ranged/melee mod increased to 1.0;
Kheldian's secondary passive given 4-6 MAG protection to status effects.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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Except that Rikti are Science origin |
Originally Posted by Crim_the_Cold
Actually a Rikti EAT would fit perfectly into the mutation origin. Think about it, some of the Rikti in Paragon City and the Rogue Isles are former members of the Lost faction who have been mutated first from human to Lost and then all the way to Rikti. Once again both sides work because we have the traditionalist split. Or another path is that you regain your human mind and resume what would have been your alignment inclination before your mutation. Either way story line could be to start off with trying to save other Lost from sharing your fate then move on to helping put Trolls into rehab, move up to stopping the superadine trade by taking down the family and finnally maybe have a negotiations gone wrong mission on the Rikti Homeworld (cutscenes and all).
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the drug that changes the lost is a Rikti mutagen made by Rikti Scientists. But having Traditionalists and Restructurists would be awesome.
Oh, and Bill;
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| How about not? I like getting the extra XP from getting extra mobs in a spawn. That's pretty much all Qs/Vs are these days. |
And I really hate it when people just scoff like Quants and Voids are nothing. At lower levels and if you don't have a -KB Io, Quants and Voids can be bloody lethal, since they have an insanely high KB chance, and they are ready to fire again by the time you get back on your feat. LT Voids and above are just plain nasty. Sure, they may no longer one shot you, but it's a damn close call. Oh, and thats before the chance to Stun too.
And Cysts. Don't talk to me about Cysts.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Yes, I scoff at Quants and Voids, because they *are* nothing. I know you don't want to accept that, but they are. |
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
You mean the 'extra' mob that actually replaces one of the normal mobs in the spawn?
And I really hate it when people just scoff like Quants and Voids are nothing. At lower levels and if you don't have a -KB Io, Quants and Voids can be bloody lethal, since they have an insanely high KB chance, and they are ready to fire again by the time you get back on your feat. LT Voids and above are just plain nasty. Sure, they may no longer one shot you, but it's a damn close call. Oh, and thats before the chance to Stun too. And Cysts. Don't talk to me about Cysts. |
They're nothing but extra-flavor extra-XP.
For a low to mid-level character when solo, they're fairly lethal, especially if you're low on/out of inspirations. For a higher level one, they go down to moderate depending on "did I spot it" and "is it a boss". With IOs and a tweaked build, they become no threat. All in my experience, of course.
As is routine, on a team, everything becomes severely muddled.
I know you don't want to accept that, Bill, but Quants are, in fact, threatening to most Kheldians. A couple bad rolls on the knockdown and/or stun (or even the hop-in Incandescent/Gravity), especially for early level characters, means they're likely to wind up staying down.
Dawncaller - The Circle of Dawn
Too many blasted alts to list, but all on Virtue.
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I don't accept that because it isn't true if you pay the slightest amount of attention. And I *do* play them at all levels, not just my 50s. I'm not running an "IO'd/tweaked build." Yes, there's the chance of an unlucky roll -you get that with everything. |
Originally Posted by Dalantia
For a low to mid-level character when solo, they're fairly lethal, especially if you're low on/out of inspirations. For a higher level one, they go down to moderate depending on "did I spot it" and "is it a boss". With IOs and a tweaked build, they become no threat. All in my experience, of course.
As is routine, on a team, everything becomes severely muddled. I know you don't want to accept that, Bill, but Quants are, in fact, threatening to most Kheldians. A couple bad rolls on the knockdown and/or stun (or even the hop-in Incandescent/Gravity), especially for early level characters, means they're likely to wind up staying down. |
Just running into a group without looking? Might as well run a level 5 anything up, solo, and take a swipe at an AV. Just don't complain about the result afterward.
My experience differs from yours, then, so I will caution you that anecdote does not equal data. I will note that I am generally referring to Lieutenants and Bosses with regards to higher levels, because that's where the margin for bad luck, resisted holds, or "surprise, I was hiding around the corner/up above/behind the boxes/in the mess" becomes exceptionally unpleasant.
(also, my experience is that they're a replacement, not an addition.)
Dawncaller - The Circle of Dawn
Too many blasted alts to list, but all on Virtue.
Personally I'd like to see the PB and WS ATs get a scalar buff.
VEATs have a damage scalar of 1.0 for melee and ranged, the HEATs wind up with .85 and .80. Sure, HEATs get higher Buff/Debuff/Heal values, but VEATs get a higher defensive scale (Tanker scale compared to scrapper) and no Self-Heal.
To make the gulf appear even larger, the new "Damage per End" scaling has taken away a lot of strength from the HEATs who used a lower end-cost on similar powers to other ATs in order to make up for an inherent lack of "Room" for Stamina.
I propose that Humanform HEATs have their damage scale raised to 1, to match the VEATs and bring them back into competition as a valuable AT to a given team. I'd like to note that I think both Dwarf and Nova form are well-balanced based on their design, already. And need neither a buff or nerf.
That would make HEATs and VEATs a bit more "Equal" in my opinion.
-Rachel-
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Well, I look. Every time. And they are still a PITA.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
I don't accept that because it isn't true if you pay the slightest amount of attention. And I *do* play them at all levels, not just my 50s. I'm not running an "IO'd/tweaked build." Yes, there's the chance of an unlucky roll -you get that with everything.
Just running into a group without looking? Might as well run a level 5 anything up, solo, and take a swipe at an AV. Just don't complain about the result afterward. |
So we're just going to have to agree to disagree.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Emphasis on the Mutagen part. What does a Mutagen do? Right it causes a mutation. The Rikti I was talking about putting as the mutant origin epic AT are the Lost who have been fully mutated into Rikti. |
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Except that Rikti are Science origin
the drug that changes the lost is a Rikti mutagen made by Rikti Scientists. But having Traditionalists and Restructurists would be awesome. |
I'm sure you could spin it the other way and honestly both science and mutation fit but I had to get my point across.
Work in progress no more. I have decided that I'm going to put my worst spelling errors here. Triage Bacon, Had this baster idea, TL
R"I'm going to beat the Jesus out of Satan!" My Wife while playing Dante's Inferno
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You can do it that way, but even "natural" (not talking about origin) Rikti would be science origin. They see a human and talk about "birth form," after all. Mutant (origin) tends to be "You're born with this that makes you different from everyone else of your race" - a human from primal earth with wings, for instance. The Rikti and Lost are mutated after birth with a scientific process (though the Rikti Mages could probably start being classified as Magic now.) |
Originally Posted by Crim_the_Cold
Emphasis on the Mutagen part. What does a Mutagen do? Right it causes a mutation. The Rikti I was talking about putting as the mutant origin epic AT are the Lost who have been fully mutated into Rikti.
I'm sure you could spin it the other way and honestly both science and mutation fit but I had to get my point across. |
No, I don't stick to it either (leaning the same way as you described on several characters - was mutated, so mutant) but being really strict by the game's description, the Rikti and Lost would be science.
Since Kheldians have special spawns I was thinking that non-villain alignment Soldiers and Widows should have a hit placed on them by the Arbiters. It would be neat if the price for them going rogue from Arachnos was being the target of special arachnos hit squads especially if the units are unique for that purpose and have some special advantage over the villain epic ATs.
Work in progress no more. I have decided that I'm going to put my worst spelling errors here. Triage Bacon, Had this baster idea, TL
"I'm going to beat the Jesus out of Satan!" My Wife while playing Dante's Inferno