Not a scrapper expert here but I'd go for the second scenario, the 26% ranged should take care of a lot of fire/cold attacks. On my /EA Stalker I didn't even bother increasing the F/C def and never felt a difference, same on an Ice/Fire Tanker, I breezed through mobs even on those Croatoa missions with the all-fire throwing pumpkin head mobs. And SLNE are so much more prevalent, that 5% will surely make a bigger difference. IIRC most ice attacks have s/l components.
Resistance could affect the answer, since if you highly resist the damage coming through, it matters less that it comes through. Based on the assumption that we're talking about Dark Armor, I plugged your numbers on top of Alexei's resistance, with the exception that I raised his psionic resistance to 60%, because I believe you like to slot for that more than I do. Also using Alexei's regeneration and healing, but that makes no comparative difference.
Option 1 then gives you a survivability score of 1323.
Option 2 then gives you a survivability score of 1784.
So option 2 wins by a landslide.
That said, we don't have the complete picture. You have SOME positional defenses in option 1. I bet you have SOME psionic defense in both. I bet you have SOME AoE defense in option 2.
My bet's still on option 2, though.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
Here's what the build for Option 2 looks like.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.621
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Desmodas I17 possible: Level 50 Magic Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Dark Melee
Secondary Power Set: Dark Armor
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Darkness Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Smite -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), T'Death-Dam%(9)
Level 1: Dark Embrace -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(7), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(7), RctvArm-ResDam(9), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(29)
Level 2: Shadow Maul -- Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(11), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(13), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(13), Armgdn-Dam%(15)
Level 4: Death Shroud -- Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), Erad-Dmg(15), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(17), M'Strk-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(17), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx(19), M'Strk-Acc/EndRdx(19)
Level 6: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 8: Siphon Life -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(11), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(21), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), T'Death-Dam%(23)
Level 10: Obsidian Shield -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(25), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(27), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(27)
Level 12: Hover -- HO:Micro(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(29), Zephyr-ResKB(31)
Level 14: Fly -- HO:Micro(A), Zephyr-ResKB(42)
Level 16: Dark Regeneration -- Theft-Heal(A), Theft-Heal/Rchg(39), Theft-+End%(40), Erad-Acc/Rchg(40), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(42)
Level 18: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Rcvry+(39)
Level 20: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(37)
Level 22: Murky Cloud -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(36), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(37), RctvArm-ResDam(37)
Level 24: Cloak of Darkness -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(25)
Level 26: Soul Drain -- Erad-Acc/Rchg(A), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), C'ngBlow-Acc/Rchg(34), C'ngBlow-Dmg/Rchg(36), C'ngBlow-Dmg/EndRdx(36)
Level 28: Cloak of Fear -- SipInsght-ToHitDeb(A), SipInsght-Acc/ToHitDeb(31), SipInsght-Acc/Rchg(31), SipInsght-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(33), SipInsght-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(33), Abys-Acc/EndRdx(33)
Level 30: Boxing -- HO:Enzym(A)
Level 32: Midnight Grasp -- Hectmb-Dmg/Rchg(A), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg(43), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx(43), Hectmb-Dam%(45)
Level 35: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(39), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(42), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 38: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), Zephyr-ResKB(48)
Level 41: Torrent -- Empty(A)
Level 44: Dark Blast -- Apoc-Dmg/Rchg(A), Apoc-Dam%(45), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(46), Apoc-Acc/Rchg(46), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 47: Tenebrous Tentacles -- Ragnrk-Dmg(A), Ragnrk-Dmg/Rchg(48), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(50), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(50)
Level 49: Weave -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 0: Ninja Run
Code:
| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1428;697;1394;HEX;| |78DA9D93EB6E12511485CFC0E014864B6FF4DE02BD53DAA178AB6D35C688263525C| |1D6F4974AA638B6440A3883491BA3F1017C051FC4F82AFA001A7D06DC7BAF037FFC| |E704D677E6EC7DCEAC3597CA6539AED4A7FBCA483E6CBA41503BAEFB6EA7E3F9918| |A7BD6A8A7CB5E70D17EE506D983D24EB6D30E82C669D3B39452D3FDC65AC56B7A9E| |5376FD3718CE0E2A65EFB5D70A74ED817FD1F6470E5AE79EEFB5BA4E7F10AFB6DB4| |DE771A3DBF282C0C649B37176DE4DE8020D1BAD33B41D7A6E874ED28F3A8DBAECCA| |8B6A1537E87AFED514B9CAD3DF677B72F422AA4A9857A1A7C091C03C06EA82A19A2| |0CFAB0C5965AA0583A7AE65809C606851303729082CDD4DEDC65E48A9928AED0AE2| |77817D41F29E6083DAC3D83D12FE13E21D923F05C3BF81AEB8187D0B048208AD8A6| |0958AF4E850EF68C6D2D92C648B21DB38B28D23DB04B24D20DB262D89629F701431| |A6107106116710314A7D36FA42F63EC1546A2E2DA585EF62D3A68E04AE6F2474471| |EA52D2AA50C43ACA512619E5A4D0AD646815FD2B786C079DC058B568DE092C6C889| |5C6AF509EE3755C674652CABF82E2E0305AAA4759C34722C21C732722C23A3437D9| |37A87C91D361B56539A97549B56703B0D633918CBC158AE2DB76EA9055C088AB46A| |563FC6594B522D0C0151413606D8C00FF16158AC788CF3FAFA573497D1EF4F660DE| |FC83A900736049B054198DA1775E445A45B45F23C926F22F904F5ADE8C82B787245| |3C9EF7E4685D9B589777E903CD14B485C216AE56126C394011D8167CA47647B73BD| |765AA7803B82D28DD046E094C72B2AD9D6CEBD025CD3973F085D28FBD1CFE335335| |071F98326426630EBED05E74583A159AFFEBF81AEF6F173D8A913E63A99218273C7| |ACEF2824F5FF2C8E5D1294B9D4F7BDFE27DC3A93BEC6B97658F659F254DFED467EE| |B46C129B25CE926049B2A4588659C6586658BEB0F4FE02338EF5E4| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
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Quote:
Most of your assumptions were correct. I did forget to mention FC resistance was at 43.2%. I posted the build above for easier review/critiquing.
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Originally Posted by Werner
Resistance could affect the answer, since if you highly resist the damage coming through, it matters less that it comes through. Based on the assumption that we're talking about Dark Armor, I plugged your numbers on top of Alexei's resistance, with the exception that I raised his psionic resistance to 60%, because I believe you like to slot for that more than I do. Also using Alexei's regeneration and healing, but that makes no comparative difference.
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SI Radio has many DJs and listeners whom hold City of Heroes close to their hearts. We will be supporting many efforts to keep CoH ALIVE!!
Yeah....this build isn't sustainable.
SI Radio has many DJs and listeners whom hold City of Heroes close to their hearts. We will be supporting many efforts to keep CoH ALIVE!!
Quote:
Quick question, what exactly is that survivability score and how would I go about figuring mine?
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Originally Posted by Werner
Resistance could affect the answer, since if you highly resist the damage coming through, it matters less that it comes through. Based on the assumption that we're talking about Dark Armor, I plugged your numbers on top of Alexei's resistance, with the exception that I raised his psionic resistance to 60%, because I believe you like to slot for that more than I do. Also using Alexei's regeneration and healing, but that makes no comparative difference.
Option 1 then gives you a survivability score of 1323. Option 2 then gives you a survivability score of 1784. So option 2 wins by a landslide. That said, we don't have the complete picture. You have SOME positional defenses in option 1. I bet you have SOME psionic defense in both. I bet you have SOME AoE defense in option 2. My bet's still on option 2, though. |
Quote:
Have a look at this thread. There's a lot of discussion about what the number is, and also a lot of discussion about what it isn't, and why you shouldn't put a whole lot of stock in it. Below is the main explanation, and I've updated the links inside the quote, along with the most recent version of my spreadsheet, now in Excel format.|
Originally Posted by MunkiLord
Quick question, what exactly is that survivability score and how would I go about figuring mine?
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(Oh! Reviewing that thread, it's Besserwisser that gave me the incoming damage percentages by type. Must remember that. Besserwisser. Besserwisser. That comes up a lot, and I never remember. Besserwisser. Wait. I'm a tool using ape. I could just write it down in the spreadsheet itself. I is smart!)
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Werner
[ QUOTE ]
Question, what is the survivability rating? [/ QUOTE ] A meaningless number that I totally make up every time someone asks for one?  The basic philosophy is very similar to Arcanaville's immortality line from this Ph.D. thesis. To quote, “the immortality line represents the maximum average damage rate sustainable indefinitely by the scrapper”. My scale is actually two times DPS. I'd cut it in half to be DPS, but I've been doing this for so long that I'd just confuse myself, even if it made it more clear for the rest of the world. Maybe I'll still do it that way some day. So anyway, when I say something has a survivability score of 672, I'm basically saying that in a sense, the build can survive an average incoming DPS of 672/2 = 336 DPS. There are some issues with the calculation. I assume some sort of average distribution of types and positions of attacks, which will obviously not match any one fight exactly. I assume that damage and regeneration/healing are steady, where in the game itself, they can both come in spikes, and this can significantly affect survivability. However, I don't have the time or inclination to go as far as Arcanaville has and write a simulator to better represent the spikiness of the data. And I don't have a good way to account for things like knockdown and knockback, so I ignore them. Characters with a lot of knockdown and knockback will be better than they appear on the number. I also don't know how to account for the scaling resistances of Super Reflexes. I think I've plugged in 20% for them. Don't remember. Still, the spreadsheet accounts for the major things. It handles damage resistance and defense by damage type, and defense by position. It handles all of the Regen clicks including Moment of Glory, taking into account recharge times, how much they heal, how much they boost regeneration, how they overlap, and so on. Although I often find myself doing it, I didn't really set it up to compare characters with different power sets. I set it up to compare characters with pretty much the same powers. Specifically, I've mostly used it while tuning my own characters. A slightly out of date version of it is available at this link if anyone wants to study it in more detail, make changes, and so on. It's in open office format, but Excel should be able to handle it. |
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
First, thanks for the reply.
Second, I'm dumb. I remember now. I thought it seemed familiar, which it should since I'm the third post in that thread.
Having trouble trying to compare these in my head. Basically been staring at too many Mids builds for far too many hours straight.
VS
~35% SLNE and 19% FC (incidentally having 27% melee and 26% Ranged)
Seems to me the 2nd scenario would be superior in the vast majority of situations, no?