Pointers for the Artistically Challenged
By
Avernal_EU,
Posted on: 2006-08-09 06:02 in Multi-Media Fan Creations
Brilliant advice there Scarlett - you make it look so easy as well heh.
Out of interest, do you use a mouse for drawing in PSP or have you got a graphics tablet of some kind?
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
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I use both. I have got a graphics tablet, but only a small one, and I tend to use that when I want things to be a bit more 'freehand'
Basically, when I'm blocking in highlights and shadows I use the mouse to get a consistent effect, then I use the tablet to fine tune it and try to bring some texture in.
@ScarletVengeance
My CoV Portrait Gallery
Great work Scarlet, as said before, you make it look easy [img]/uk/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img].
BTW, this piece is now finished (see it here if you've not seen it)
I took more screenies as I was finishing it, so I'll try to get the 2nd half of the guide up this week.
@ScarletVengeance
My CoV Portrait Gallery
Bought a couple of other books as well (or at least my gf did - she seems to want to encourage my creative side hehe).. "Anatomy for Fantasy Artists" and "How to Draw Fantasy Figures: From the Imagination to the Page". Both highly recommended for the Artistic Novice. Granted the style is geared more towards fantasy art than comic art, nevertheless, the priniciples and ideas are the same. In particular there is a whole section on musculature and skeletal topography which are the bits I find the most difficulty with.
I had a look through my sketch book the other day, and I'm pleased to say that there is a MARKED improvement from my initial attempts to my more recent ones. Will be posting scans up soon [img]/uk/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
Great news indeed!
Don't go off that learning curve you're on!
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Bought a couple of other books as well (or at least my gf did - she seems to want to encourage my creative side hehe).. "Anatomy for Fantasy Artists" and "How to Draw Fantasy Figures: From the Imagination to the Page".
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Now, I'm not an artist, nor do I play one on Usenet, but I do have some friends who know the sharp end of the pencil from the blunt, and I'd like to offer a small piece of advice: Get a good non-genre book on anatomy for artists as well as the genre-specific stuff.
While there are stylistic "tricks of the trade" and techniques to pick up, it can be dangerous to learn anatomy from a style, rather than learning how to apply a style ontop of a fundamental knowledge of anatomy.
Oh don't worry Leif, not only do I have a "generic art for Noobs" book which covers first principles like bowls of fruit and sunflowers, but in addition all three of the "draw in this style" type books that I have, cover the basics of anatomy and stress that fantasy and comic characters are just exagerated versions of that. Essentially, with fantasy (including comic) characters of any sort, you have to know and be able to use the rules before you can bend or manipulate them [img]/uk/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
Swissy, what's keeping me going is the progress that I'm making, and the fact that every time I draw something, I surprise myself. I'm sure this will flatten off eventually, but suffice to say, I'm enjoying the process which I think is the important thing [img]/uk/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
[ QUOTE ]
...every time I draw something, I surprise myself. I'm sure this will flatten off eventually...
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I don't know if that's true tbh. I still finish a piece now and if I'm really happy with it, I get a buzz from it, so keep going [img]/uk/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
@ScarletVengeance
My CoV Portrait Gallery
How long have you been drawing Scarlet? You mentioned that you'd found the Marvel book invaluable, had you also been a complete n00b in the artistic sense?
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
[ QUOTE ]
...had you also been a complete n00b in the artistic sense?
[/ QUOTE ]
Everyone starts as a n00b. In all senses.
For some, skills comes more naturally than others, for others it's a matter of reading/learning/practicing.
Just like music.
The real question is: Do you still feel the fun and passion for it?
Scarlette says: I get a buzz from it
I'm guessing that's a yes [img]/uk/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
Yeah I appreciate everyone has to start somewhere - I guess I was asking "Could you draw to an extent before, and have used the books to perfect your skills, or have you started from 'can't draw to save my life' and progressed from there."
Additionally, is it fair to say that a lot of keen artists start relatively young, because they display a natural talent for it a younger age. Someone like me (in their 30s) had no flare for visual art at all in his teens (but was an enthusiastic musician), and have only come into it through being inspired by the likes of Douglas Shuler (DarkJedi on the US forums) Gill Bates (MMOArt) and comic art in general.
I suppose I'm trying to guage the "average speed of progress", which is completely daft because it has so many different variables.
You're right though, ultimately whether you're any good at it isn't what's important, it's whether you enjoy it or not that matters.
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
Been checking in on this thread for the last couple of days as it's got a good number of helpful pointers for people starting out, I'd also echo the sentiment on "How to Draw Comics the Marvel Way"; it's been mentioned on these forums numerous times in the past from many seperate users. Definitely worth the investment, one you might also like to check out if you're interested in studying perspective is "Perspective for Comic Book Artists" by David Chelsea. It breaks things down into a very digestable manner and the entire book itself is written like a comic, so it's always enjoyable to flick through. [img]/uk/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
I guess i could always draw. I remember when i was quite young I drew a road with perspective, and my Mum asked me why I'd drawn it the way I had
I just said that it was cos it got smaller as it got further away so that's how I drew it.
I spoke to her about it last night and she reckons I was about 6 or 7 when that happened, so I guess I just 'knew' how to translate stuff to paper.
Hard to explain really. I saw a program a couple of years ago with kids of a similar age and showing how they interpreted stuff. They were drawing 2 apples, 1 behind the other, and some of the kids drew them one behind the other, whereas others could only interpret it as 2 apples and couldn't draw the relationship between them.
So, i don't know why some can and some can't, but i guess I always was able to transalate what i saw to paper
@ScarletVengeance
My CoV Portrait Gallery
My theory is that every kid start with the same ability to draw and therefor become artists.
But obviously not all actually do. I reckon there is a trigger at some point, somewhere along the way, that switches off for most of us but stays on for the others.
I don't believe in being "gifted with a special" skill. You might have a better eye to interpret things than the next man, but I think it depends of wether you actually kept on drawing from childhood or not.
@Avernal:
Thanks. I will certainly give this book a look. ^^
I don't think everybody has the same ability, per se, but possibly we all start off from a similar place but are diferently inclinded.
Doesn't matter how well you can 'see' something if you're not bothering to look, does it? [img]/uk/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
I dunno though, I think some may be kinda 'hardwird one way or another. For instance, I have no inclination for numbers, whereas some people can complete sudoku in no time at all because that can just 'see' the pattern.
For the record, i'm RUBBISH at suduko [img]/uk/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
@ScarletVengeance
My CoV Portrait Gallery
Funny, I'm in the same situation with numbers... [img]/uk/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]
Seems to be the case though, people are either strongly left or right brained. Right brained people are artistic and intuitive, whereas left brained people are scientific and logical.
I'm more likely to be left brained because I'm better with science and numbers - so for me the learning curve for creativity is a steep one heheh. Interestingly, I think I'd rather have the ability to draw than to complete a Sudoku in under 10 minutes.
However I think both challenges are learnable if you want to do it badly enough (me to draw, and you to do Sudokus)
I never forget seeing a documentary about the ability for the brain to heal itself after a serious trauma, and the lady who'd suffered a stroke in the left hemisphere of her brain. She'd been a high ranking neurosurgeon, and so knew exactly what was happening to her. So severe was the stroke, that simple things like dialling someone for help became impossible; the part of her brain that recognises numbers had been damaged, and therefore she had no way of working out the phone numbers to dial in the first place.
The really fascinating part was her recovery. Her left brain had been damaged, but her right one had compensated and become the more dominant hemisphere. She described the way that her entire perspective of the world around her had changed from a relatively logical and scientific viewpoint to a more abstract and emotional one.
She gave up her career as a doctor, and instead turned her hand to her newly discovered artistic talent. She makes "stained glass brains" in 2D.
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
also a good point.
Mind you though, you can use one to serve the other. While I don't see trends in numbers, I manage them through creativity in spreadsheets and the like.
I saw a programme on 3D graphics once where the guy created complex architectural structures by inputting nothing but numbers - saw the whole thing as a complex equation. madness!
My first attempt at a sudoku was about 25 minutes! I'm now down to about 12 [img]/uk/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
@ScarletVengeance
My CoV Portrait Gallery
Excellent! I actually think it's good to practise tasks which you're not naturally gifted at - perhaps it helps develop over all intelligence because it taxes parts of your mind that you might not otherwise use? I'm strongly left brained, so I work in IT. It would be interesting to see if practising the perfection of something that I'm not "wired" to do, will improve my overall intelligence, and in turn the things that I am "wired" to do?
I'm not for a minute suggesting that becoming able to draw my CoH characters is suddently going to give me insight into the true Origins of the Universe, but given the fact that working on something that doesn't come naturally would require more cognitive effort, it seems logical that it would improve things generally, not just in that specific area?
Any brain surgeons on? [img]/uk/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
This all reminds me of an excellent exercise:
To "massage" both sides of your brain, draw a picture normally. Then, on a new sheet of paper, try to draw the same picture but upside down.
Very good for your brain -and you- to differenciate between the artistic and logical approach to a drawing.
LOL I'd have trouble drawing it the right way up, let alone upside down
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
OK, as promised here are three stages of my work - from first attempt to latest.. be gentle!
Not great
Better - playing with faces and a fist
Overjoyed! Wooo!
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
Good stuff Ratty - keep it going 
Hi guys
Ok, a bit of a follow-up for you then, regarding colouring.
It wasn't until I got to grips with a computer that I started using colour, and again, it's been a case of practise to get things looking the way I do them now.
I use Paint Shop Pro (and not PANT shop pro like I would have posted if I didn't notice my typo!)
I'm on paintshop pro 9, and I think it's great - it's no photoshop, but then I never really got on with photoshop. What it does offer though is important functionality like dodge and burn (which is essentially all I use for shadows and highlights on my pieces) but it also gives you layers, which are all-important for the way I do things.
Once again, not saying this is the right way of doing it, just saying it's the way that works for me.
Anyhoo, what I'm working on is an image of my main. She's a Ninja/Dark Mastermind and although this is her 3rd outfit, it's the one I've used for the longest period of time as I feel it suits her really well.
first off, I create my image. This starts off as the stick-figure, and gets fleshed out until I like it. Once I'm happy with the shape, I'll trace it through to a new page where I'll sketch in the details, like shown here:
Sketch
Then I trace it through again to give me a clean outline.
Outline
I always sketch in paper by the way, up to the outline stage, then I scan it in and colour it.
When I start the colour, this is where the layer function comes in. I'm not going to go into detail about how to use layers, cos the help files in paintshop pro will doubtless do it far better that I can.
Anyway, I start to block out the colours, creating each element on a seperate layer to make my life easier later on.
Blocking Out
Soon you'll have your drawing set out in block colour and ready to shade. I'd already done the legs by the time I started this guide, so you'll just have to pretend they're not shaded for now.
Ready to shade
Now i need to turn it from a 2D image into one that looks like it has mass and form, which is done with shading and highlights. The reason I broke the image down into elements before this stage is I find it much quicker to tweak the parts later without having to go to the hassle of masking everything off to avoid affecting surrounding areas.
Now I'm going to give myself a rough guide for shading by throwing in some extreme shadow. I create new layer, and rough out in black where I feel the shadows whould go.
Block Shadow
I tweak it until it's roughly what i want, then this is where the beauty of layers comes in - I reduce the visibility of the shadow to about 40%, and I've got my guide in place and I'm ready to start shading proper
40% shadow
That's as far as I'm up to at the moment.
As soon as I've done some more detailing I'll post the 2nd half of this guide, or, you might prefer to leave them in 'toon' style. I'll always save a toon style before going on to shade the details in, as sometimes I like them as much as the finished piece.
Toon example
Guess it's all down to the sytle you're going for.
Have fun
@ScarletVengeance
My CoV Portrait Gallery