Ummm.... having read the posts most of those who disagree with you do not play as stalkers but play a lot of PvP. Indeed having looked at Jackhobos scrapper build im lookin to try something similar with my scrapper for PvP.
If we want to make it fair then I think energy blasters should not be able to detoggle me as a tank, its a complete pain and stops me killing them 
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But how do you know only 3-4% of players would take this 'trait'. I for one would expect just about every PvPer out there to take it.
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Because grabbing this power would ONLY be usefull against stalkers? not against ANYTHING else in the whole game apart from -maybe- ghosts in croatoa, which is a breeze to plow through anyway?
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The way it is now, every stalker CAN POTENTIALLY be totally invisible to everyone.
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Wrong-diddly-wrong-wrong.
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No, because I've TRIED everything that's been suggested to me, pluss a few other things my own little brain came up with.
Teaming to get buffs -on top of sacrificing TONS of other usefull things- just to be able to spot these guys is just silly.
Actually the Concealment pool is available to everyone and generally the good Blasters take it so they can get the same edge Stalkers have.
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No, because I've TRIED everything that's been suggested to me, pluss a few other things my own little brain came up with.
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You =/= Everyone.
World of Jackcraft.
*sigh*
A stalker stalks
A scrapper scraps
A tanker tanks
etc
etc
everyons powers are in relation to their ATs, wouldnt be much of an AT if stalkers couldnt stalk. Simple fact is Hide and Stealth are EASILY circumvented should you CHOOSE the relevant powersets, if you dont then you cant complain really, its ENTIRELY your choice. Some people make specific PVP builds, some dont, its your call and NO AT is unbeatable and currently a well specced Regen Scrapper will munch any Stalker.
If you have problems with stalkers or any AT you need to sit back, research and think about what to do, mine and Xanthus controllers die in one shot if a stalker gets through us (neither have +perception powers) but we certainly kill our fair share of stalkers. Try to think of it as a puzzle that needs to be beaten, you say its not fair that we cant see stalkers, we cant see illusion controllers either, I cant beat SinghMC solo unless he makes a balls of it, the PDs can be a royal pain in the proverbial especially if their uber squishy empath Elerith is with them but so what, its what makes the game fun. PVP is, from experienced PVP players points of view, pretty well balanced, instead of saying something isnt fair, do something about it, my stalker only exists as I was building something to take out TGs storm controller (thats right all blame TG )
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Teaming to get buffs -on top of sacrificing TONS of other usefull things- just to be able to spot these guys is just silly.
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If you are not willing to compromise your build into a pvp spec you cant complain about anything really, PVP is NOT PVE
**Acceptable "support" responses**
Its your fault
Its your computers fault
Its your ISPs fault
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it's ALL OVER the US boards too
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This is frankly untrue. I've been on the US boards searching for information unrelated to this subject, but the biggest complaint within the PvP zones in the US is...<drum roll>.... Heroes camping in, or just outside of, Villian hospitals. Thats whats flooding their PvP chatter, not Stalkers being overpowered.
Just remember, in comparison to everyone else that your talking to on these boards, I'm an empath. I buff, I CM, I keep the team alive. In return I expect nothing more than they keep my backside alive. I have no problem with stalkers, I get AS'd by them, whether in a team or not (how is a stalker going to know whether I'm teamed or not anyway). If a stalker doesn't attempt to one shot me, hes preatty damn stupid because:
1) I'm an easy kill
2) If he doesn't, chances are I'm buffing a player that will kick his backside, quickly.
On the basis of that, why in the hell are you moaning about your blaster? At least you have a chance to kill something which is more than can be said for Defenders. Apart from the few oddballs, most Defenders haven't stepped up and asked for other ATs to be nerfed to their level. Think about it.
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Would it be soooo saaaad for you guys if 4% of the hero population had an even chance against you?
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Are you under the impression that we all have Stalkers or something?
As far as I can see, the only person who is disagreeing with you and has a stalker is Stalk-obot...who has a very good PvP build, but that doesn't mean it's impossible for me to kill him.
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Also...with this 'brilliant' trait system, you said that stalkers can take the sneaky trait, which means even people with the perception trait can't see them. Every PvP Stalker would take that trait, and we'd be exactly where we are now...
I am, at this very moment, reading one of the most recently updated threads on the US boards, and it's name is STALKERS and the same problem is taken up there.
Anyway. I'll stop posting, because fairness obviously comes in small doses in the human race. And anyway, like I've said before, the stalker-nerf WILL come, it's just a matter of time. All I'm doing is trying to find an alternative to this nerf that don't involve any lessening of the stalker skills, but since everyone here apparently WANT stalkers to be nerfed, critisize all you can. If you look at all my posts, not once have I said that the current setup should be gimped, I'm offering a solution to all those ppl who are sick and tired of the über stalker sneakieness.
If stalkers are to be the only AT that can see everyone without being seen by anyone else, why not make blasters the only AT that does damage, Defenders the only AT that can heal, controllers the only AT with controlling powers. Or put it another way, give blasters a 200% damage increase, controllers 100% chance of whatever effect they are trying to achieve, every defender heal 100% HP, and tanks and scrappers ACTUALLY invincible. (I haven't written the CoV equivalents, because I do give your intelligence some credit, and believe you can figure out where I'm going with this)
OK, I did actually offer a solution that removed something from the stalker, and that was the ability to stack hide and stealth. That a person can stand on completely flat ground in 200 meter radius on a sunny afternoon and not see a person coming sneaking up on them, even from the front, is a bit weird. This is called a "super power". What's so strange about having a "super power" that allow ppl to see hidden things??? If one is possible, surely, the other is too.
You see the difference is, that even without total invincibility, Scrappers and Tanks are still good. But without total invisibility, Stalkers would suck bigtime.
World of Jackcraft.
Though we appreciate you trying to figure out a way to make stalkers more detectable, there fine the way they are now imo.
I say this because the sole goal of a stalker is to get to its victim without being detected and finish them off in 2 or 3 hits then dissappear again. Now if you did anything to make them more detectable, that would basically kill the AT.
I also disagree with them weak. With my scrapper i have faced countless stalkers and about a third of them can scrap, and pretty damn good too.
You see in my mind there are 2 types of stalkers. The first one is the stalker who comes in and AS's you and then releases the finishing blow, and then there is the stalker that scraps. The do exactly the same as above but if they miss, they hang around and scrap. I've had trouble fighting these because though my attacks are all 2x AC's in them, they still miss, while there happilly pounding you away. Stalk-abot, Tanaka San & Izrael to mension just a few but there are plenty more.
Bottom line, i think stalkers are great the way they are. Obviously they need the invisibility to make there whole AT effective.
@SinghMC
But is that the overall topic of conversation in their forums? Sure it might be the latest posted, but most discussed about their PvP? Thats what I was referring to, and you time stamping stuff merely shows how briefly you check out their forums.
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because fairness obviously comes in small doses in the human race
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Exactly. When have you known the human race to be free and fair? History has taught otherwise.
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why not make blasters the only AT that does damage
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Coz scrappers do damage.
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Defenders the only AT that can heal
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You've just insulted every decent defender on every server. Defenders dont heal. They buff and they debuff, empaths are the only primary on a Defender set that is 'designed' to heal their teammates. You've just shown your lack of knowledge on Defenders.
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OK, I did actually offer a solution that removed something from the stalker, and that was the ability to stack hide and stealth.
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Thats the only statement of yours I agree with. Other ATs cannot stack their hide/stealth powers, why should Stalkers be able to do the same?
You *are* trying to get Stalkers nerfed, otherwise you would not be making more noise about it than somebody who plays within a PvP zone with an empath. I get 100% heal whenever I heal anybody, or I dont suffer an Acc penalty like say Dark Defenders do, but at the same stroke, if I were to heal 100% every time I hit them in a PvP zone, wouldn't that make the AT I'm healing impossible to kill? And if that AT was protecting me, would that mean that I was impossible to kill also? Using your own arguments, we're already encountering a situation whereby players would be complaining a lot more than they are over Stalkers and their AS. Leave Stalkers alone ppl for flip sake.
There's no use arguing about any of this, of course, Developers have said that stacking Stealth and Hide to counter stacked +perception is not intended, and that they're going to stop players from being able to be one-shotted.
So don't worry Stalkers will be a complete joke soon without anyone whining about it.
World of Jackcraft.
Ah good old stalker debate, The problem with stalkers are that they are overpowering toward anyone who doesnt prepare for it, a stalker can if he is good take allmost everyone 1 on 1. But give me 1 good empath and Ill show you some stalkers crying. When Im in the PvP zones I have had stalkers crying nerf */Nrg blasters simply because I prepare. If stalkers annoys you so much its very easy just to ignore them. Keep moving and Ignore that they are in the zone. Yeah so you get a crit from a spines stalker once in a while but consider that random aggro from PvE.
I have seen too many just stand still and fight, if you do that I think you deserve to be AS'ed.
50s
controllers: Ill rad , grav rad, fire kin, ice kin
blaster: ice em
scrapper: spines sr
LOL G_Zeus!!! Have you heard of sarcasm? Or exaggeration to underline a point? Both of these things are very good interpretations of my last post.
I know I said the previous post would be the last, I just couldn't help myself.
Edit: In any case, if what Mr Hobo said in his last post is true, Hide is getting the nerf I feared, and MY problem is moot, but the stalker's problem is not.
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There's no use arguing about any of this, of course, Developers have said that stacking Stealth and Hide to counter stacked +perception is not intended, and that they're going to stop players from being able to be one-shotted.
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They have? I'm sure it says in Hides description that it can be stacked with other stealth powers to make the stalker harder to see!
I know one-shotting is being looked at, but you're a bad PvP stalker if you aren't prepared for an instance where you don't one shot someone.
I've said it once and I'll say it again: Stalkers have one trick, and one trick only. You take away their ability to be the assassin class (which is what they're SUPPOSED to be) and you may as well remove the whole AT from the game.
Besides that, half the fun of PvP is working out a way to beat someone that appears to be "unbeatable". I certainly wouldn't still be playing if I knew that I could march into a PvP zone, steamroller everyone and then leave. How can you improve without failing?
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There's no use arguing about any of this, of course, Developers have said that stacking Stealth and Hide to counter stacked +perception is not intended, and that they're going to stop players from being able to be one-shotted.
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They have? I'm sure it says in Hides description that it can be stacked with other stealth powers to make the stalker harder to see!
I know one-shotting is being looked at, but you're a bad PvP stalker if you aren't prepared for an instance where you don't one shot someone.
I've said it once and I'll say it again: Stalkers have one trick, and one trick only. You take away their ability to be the assassin class (which is what they're SUPPOSED to be) and you may as well remove the whole AT from the game.
Besides that, half the fun of PvP is working out a way to beat someone that appears to be "unbeatable". I certainly wouldn't still be playing if I knew that I could march into a PvP zone, steamroller everyone and then leave. How can you improve without failing?
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I have 2 tricks and AS isnt even number 1, impale is something I send praise to the gods for on a daily basis High damage, immobing and -flying people is a real joy to behold.
Oh yeah and G-zeus is on my list of people I like to kill cos they are a pain in the [censored] to lock down (he makes a mockery of being a squishy when he wont let me squish him) its a good thing being on the list, trust me
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Ah good old stalker debate, The problem with stalkers are that they are overpowering toward anyone who doesnt prepare for it, a stalker can if he is good take allmost everyone 1 on 1. But give me 1 good empath and Ill show you some stalkers crying. When Im in the PvP zones I have had stalkers crying nerf */Nrg blasters
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Yep I cry nerf NRG blasters each time freon/napalm/crystal bashes me after I have defianced them to apparant godhood and against SinghMC, all in a good natured joking way of course
**Acceptable "support" responses**
Its your fault
Its your computers fault
Its your ISPs fault
If you dont want to be one shotted become a tank. Its simple. I decided to try afew things with my Inv/Axe tank and can with stand 5 AS without dull pain (from one person so they go back into hide and wait for AS to recharge). I was quite happy with that and the stalker couldnt believe his eyes. If say multiple people attack I can with stand 3/4 AS if react quick enough and get dull pain activated.
As it has been said before if you are prepared you can take stalkers down. Hide/stealth is what they are all about. They stalk you and spotting them is not meant to be easy. If it was what would be the point of a stalker?. The other way perhaps to get around it is to be close to your team - then that job becomes more difficult for the stalker. As soon as they AS they become visable and this is where your team mates can get them.
I enjoy the game more with the way stalkers are at the moment (not the only one). I love the way it has made it more challenging. Its great seeing how people cope/react to what they are facing. It makes for more enjoyable PvP.
P.S. Tanks are not the only ones that withstand stalkers - some defender and controller builds can as well (by preventing the AS) such as the stalkers favourite storm controller.
Heros
Max Powerz: Lv 50 Tanker
Villains
Max Khaos: Lv 50
Overlord of E.V.I.L.
My Brute - http://maxy-khaos.mybrute.com/
LF SG! Arc ID# 193083
the only thing that annoys me about Assassins Strike is that it also toggle drops, making it even more powerful... I did read that this was a bug though.
And if you want to take on stalkers roll yourself a scrapper (5 AS in one fight and I stll walked out of it hey stalkobot)
I'm also in the process of building a stalker hunting blaster...
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And if you want to take on stalkers roll yourself a scrapper (5 AS in one fight and I stll walked out of it hey stalkobot)
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Bloody regen scrappers. 
On a more serious note; which classes DO kill regen scrappers? That healing seems way over the top for PvP.
Characters with holds, -attack rate, -healrate, or psi damage if they MoG.
Regen killers: Ice/Psi Dominator, Ice/Ice Corruptor.
I really should do something about this signature.
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And insane defense is something they also have going for them. What blasters have is slightly higher damage for bread'n'butter attacks, but not so much that it's their obvious advantage. Stalkers obvious advantages is the ability to stack Hide with Stealth, their INSANE assassin strike AND very very high defense.
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I suggest you create a stalker, take it out for a PvE run and then come back and tell me they have high defence. A stalker is not a scrapper, a couple of hits and it's down and they really are not hard to hit.
Even as a defender and as a controller in Warburg, I really don't want to see Stalkers nerfed for their AS or critics part.
But there's one thing which seems unfair to me : they have mezz protection. Something a blaster will always dream of. Remove their mezz protection in PvP. In PvE, it's needed, I understand but in PvP, how on earth can u stop a SuperJumping or Teleporting Stalker with the hit and run tactic ?
- You cannot slow him (SJ and TP aren't affected by snow rain for example)
- You cannot hold, immobilize him (mezz protection)
- You can follow him for the first 200 meters and then they disappear, because by doing this chase, you're too far away from your teammates so you lose tactics benefice.
Another problem is the utility of Leadership power pool. Before PvP, it would never strike the mind of any tanker, scrapper or blaster to take it because of the endurance cost too high for the little benefits. Now, every AT takes it, not for its first goal but for all its secondary effects :
- + Perception
- Taunt resist
- Fear resist.
There's a problem underlying here. Yet, I dunno know how to solve it but a powerpool shouldn't be necessary to PvP.
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I think the trouble you're having is that the perception bonus offered by Tactics for a Blaster is less than that offered by a Controller/Defender.
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Hang on, u mean defenders get bigger perception bonuses from tactics? I wasnt aware of that and it might explain why i'm seeing so many stalkers since taking tactics. (and enjoying my new hobby of "stalker spooking"). Would the perception bonus be high enough to see stalkers with both hide+stealth running? How about players with invis?
Obviously i'm biased, but giving defenders a really good chance to see stalkers would be a good balancing strategy. We can see them, but we usually dont hit hard enough to kill anything anyway. So, team with someone who hits harder but cant see them.
I can see a time where absolutly everyone takes invis from the concealment pool then we can all complain that we cant see anyone in the game :P
My MA IDs:
Fiend Space: 211464
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[..]Would the perception bonus be high enough to see stalkers with both hide+stealth running? How about players with invis?[..]
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Hide and stealth makes you harder to see than just invis, and tactics can see through invis no problem.
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the only thing that annoys me about Assassins Strike is that it also toggle drops, making it even more powerful... I did read that this was a bug though.
And if you want to take on stalkers roll yourself a scrapper (5 AS in one fight and I stll walked out of it hey stalkobot)
I'm also in the process of building a stalker hunting blaster...
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/em slap
Detoggle is as intended, if they didnt detoggle then there would be a 0% point of a stalker staying to duke it out with a scrapper.
Top slotted regens with the accolades are a royal pain in the backside, lets change the vein of this thread to nerfing them
as for a stalker hunting blaster traps and tactics work just fine.
**Acceptable "support" responses**
Its your fault
Its your computers fault
Its your ISPs fault
I'm not arguing as a Stalker, my highest level Stalker is level 13.
But how do you know only 3-4% of players would take this 'trait'. I for one would expect just about every PvPer out there to take it.
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The way it is now, every stalker CAN POTENTIALLY be totally invisible to everyone.
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Wrong-diddly-wrong-wrong.
World of Jackcraft.