wikked

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Plus, as I'm sure most of us are aware, there *are* modern day pirates. Better to encourage the Witty ones, rather than the machine gun wielding ones.

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You're right, lets get right on the maps for the somalie pirates. Not gonna be able to fit many mobs on a boat the size of a large row boat though.

I never said electro-shock therapy.

What I said was the people who keep posting the same stupid ideas should be subjected to electrical shocks. Similar to the training collars you can get to teach your dog not to leave the yard.

When an idea is proven to be stupid by...
A. forum users who are able to show how it is a stupid idea or
B. the devs saying its not gonna happen because its a stupid idea.
The person should get a slight electric shock to teach them not to post stupid ideas over and over again.

Though it sounds cool. I really haven't heard about anyone actually using these. I did go check on the WoW site and saw nothing on there about it. I also have a paypal account and use it all the time, but have never heard about it.

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Also Epic AT's could be transferred to accounts where the player never earned the right to play one.

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Why? I mean, that seems like a simple enough problem to solve.

Anyway, I'm going to go with my socialist-libertarian party line here:

I don't care if people sell characters and I don't think the developers should either. They should announce the behavior as unsupported, against the EULA, and that any and all consequence (including litigation) undertaken as a result of any character transfer (involving money or otherwise) is entirely the player's responsibility. And that if NCSoft is involved in any private litigation as a result of a character sale (for instance, being asked to appear in court), the player initiating this action is responsible for covering their costs unless it would be illegal to enforce that collection. Then they should spend basically zero effort policing transfers, although the EULA allows them to freeze any accounts who are flagrantly and documentably violating policy.

Veterans' rewards that have been claimed on a character (including, if I understand correctly, all vet costume parts) should remain granted for that character, but new ones should not be available; badges should be forced to refresh as soon as the transfer is complete or on the first login (whichever is more technically feasible). The big advantage to Vet Rewards isn't that you have one character with Sands of Mu and Assemble the Team and boxing gloves, but that any and all characters, including new characters you make, has those things.

Yeah, sure, it would require some technical work. Everything requires some technical work, so, whatever. But it would open up new revenue for them and let we who would like to use this legitimately -- transferring characters between our own accounts or as gifts to friends/family members/sg mates or the like -- do so.

And we would never have to hear about it on Suggestions again.

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I honestly have to say that was the biggest load of doubletalk I have ever seen.

Why make it against the rules if they are not going to enforce the rules? Why let the people keep the vet rewards on a character and not the badges? And last but not least. Why give people every stupid idea they post in the suggestions forum just to keep them from asking for it again?

A stupid idea is a stupid idea. You can put a high dollar paint job with realistic flames and graphics on an AMC Pacer, but it's still an AMC Pacer.

Stupid ideas should be allowed to die and when people bring them up again they should be subjected to electric shocks to teach them the error of thier ways.

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I'm not trying to be rude about this, so please, do not take offense, but......They don't give a dam what prime australian playing time is.

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I think they do care, but maintenance has to happen at SOME point. It's gonna be prime time for someone, and given that they are based in America, they have to do it at some point during the American work day.

OP, that sucks, and I sympathize, but I just don't see it changing.

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I agree with Aisynia that it is not an issue of them not caring, but that it has to happen. As I recall when this is brought up, it was looked at to when it should occur and the current schedule and server numbers point to the window we have now (Off hand, I don't see any direct posts to quote on this and they may be gone via the purges). And as Aisynia mentioned, no matter what time they pick, it will be prime time to some one, some where and it is not a perfect system, just an optimal one for NCSoft.

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Yup and since a majority of the game players are from the US, guess who gets precedence? Now I know, I happen to be a big fan of the satisfaction of the few (like what 20 people? ) trump the satisfaction of every other player. Sorry pal but thats the way the cookie crumbles.

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You guys basically said the exact same thing I said. You just used more words and I completely avoided any kind of subtlety.

If something HAS to happen, like maintenance, you really can't afford to him and haw about what the best time is to avoid primetime in australia, madagascar, greenland or china. Since the studio is based in the US and most likely uses a standard US work day which starts, on average, at 7 or 8 and ends around 4 or 5. The best time to get the maintenance done is within a couple hours of the start of the day and have it done before the majority of your subscribers wake up at noon.

I'm not trying to be rude about this, so please, do not take offense, but......They don't give a dam what prime australian playing time is.

All of the games I have played have had the maintenance window at the same time. WoW actually starts thiers 4 hours earlier and it lasts three hours later. They only have it on tuesday, but I found thier server stability to be sporadic at best.

I avoid the AE lag the same way I avoid the WW lag.

Use the one in Kings Row.

Good grief man, click the edit button. It's right there next to the reply button, its not rocket science.

And no its not a good idea.

Edit: See, its easy.

Edit2: I can do this all day and not make completely useless posts.

Edit3: Ofcourse doing it this way doesn't boost your post count any.

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Oh noes, you might need to move.

Seriously... doing Architect Missions already cuts down on travel time by a whole bunch. Having to get to the same AE site ONCE is not really hard work.

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Your opinion. I stand by my idea.

W4E

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Standing by your idea is your right.

My right is to say /unsigned.

Seriously, if you can't get from one zone to another to meet your team at a specific AE how are you able to actually move around in the missions?

As was recently said, the people who truly deserve the recognition don't ask for it. If they were to make one of the ideas people have added it would mean the devs would be just inundated with "I Deserv hal of fam statu NAO!!!!!!!!!" messages.

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Thats basically what kiloton said. He just used more words.

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Oh, you are speaking of posts from the Tanker Tuesday Tour thread I started in the Tanker forums. (I read this one first when I cam home from work, and thought you may have grossly misconstrued one of my posts from this thread. my bad. sorry.)

I don't think Kilo meant TT wouldn't be special(or whatever it is) anymore, just that the streak would be over.

I can understand feeling this way. My family has many little traditions that we do on holidays that would be missed if we didn't do them.

The practical side of wanting to keep TT on champion is to satisfy the players that already made the effort to make a new Tank on Champion, especially ones from other servers, and people without the time to keep making new characters. Those people may even be NON-ALTAHOLICS. I've never met one, but I've heard they exist.

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I can see the practicle side. But, if you really want this event to be the gamewide thing you guys claim it is, you are going to HAVE to expand it onto other servers.

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Everything you mentioned there has already been covered.

Repeatedly.

And to great extent.

In fact the only people to repeat themselves are the ones saying "we deserve a plaque!"

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I think the point of Panthershade's post was to try to stop the back, and forth of the SAME Pro, and Con posters who will never agree.

I'm not gonna say their aren't any posters on the Pro side that have repeated themselves, but answer me this: How many posts have Memphis_ Bill, and you yourself made in this thread repeating basically the same thing: TT should not get a plaque?

Opinions have been duly noted, please allow others to weigh in on the same topic without turning this thread into 100 pages of the same posters saying the same things.




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But, its seems obvious that whenever someone tries to spread out to other servers to make TT more game wide, the majority say "O gee, I dunno" "I don't want to make a new lowbie tank on another server" and my persoanl favorite "If TT leaves champion on the first tuesday of the month it's streak will be broken and not special anymore".

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Who said that last quote? I must have missed it.

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Thats basically what kiloton said. He just used more words.

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We seem to have several people repeating themselves, so I have some suggestions:


If you think that a plaque is a good idea, please voice your opinion (if you haven’t). Also, look at some of the other alternate suggestions and voice your thoughts on those ideas. Perhaps a fitting alternative isn’t so bad.

If you think that Tanker Tuesday has not met some nebulous set of criteria for a plaque, please list the criteria you would consider appropriate. I encourage you to be as specific as possible. This will help a productive dialog, which we can all enjoy.

If you think that only a plaque on the Champion server is appropriate, please feel free to voice opinion (if you haven’t). I’m pretty sure that such things are prohibitive because of the coding though. Many people have noted that this is an acceptable alternative, but if the Devs can’t do it, then perhaps it would be wise to consider something else.

If you think that a plaque specifically is inappropriate, please feel free to suggest alternatives, if you think of any. Alternately, provide some productive feedback on some of the alternatives already suggested. I don’t doubt that the proponents are willing to consider a thoughtful response.

If you are opposed to the idea based on some type of comparison (valid or otherwise), please keep in mind that this is not a contest. The proponents of the idea don’t seem to be attempting to invalidate anyone else’s events, and your similar courtesy would be appreciated. Having Tanker Tuesday receive a plaque (or alternate) will have no impact on anything else receiving a plaque. If you think that something else is just as worthy, please start a separate thread suggesting that it receive a plaque, and it can stand on its own merits, just like Tanker Tuesday.

If you are opposed to ANY type of player recognition in game, please voice your opinion (if you haven’t) and be done. It is unlikely that you will change your mind or the supporters of the idea. Thank you for taking the time to add your thoughts for the consideration of the Devs, who will ultimately decide.

If you have cemented yourself in your opinion, on either side, then firing back at others isn’t productive. Thank you for taking the time to add your thoughts for the consideration of the Devs, who will ultimately decide.

If you are limiting your responses to flaming and accusations, then nothing anyone says (except a maybe moderator) will deter you. Everyone else is encouraged to just hit the report button on the bottom of your post and move on.



In the spirit of dialog and considering alternatives, I posted this before, but it seems to have gotten wiped due to being tacked on the end of a deleted post. (Dang you Quick Reply!)

For those people opposed to a plaque because of the current nature of what’s on a plaque, then how about a location badge?
It could be placed on top of the wall instead of on the face of the wall. That way, it won’t disrupt your 4th wall any more than any other badge, and it maintains a sense of location.
Also, badges DO have a history of coming from player ideas.

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Everything you mentioned there has already been covered.

Repeatedly.

And to great extent.

In fact the only people to repeat themselves are the ones saying "we deserve a plaque!"

It's nothing against tanker tuesday. TT should have recognition. It should have a big party with City Scoop announcement, dev visiting, and added to the tool tip rotation.

But, its seems obvious that whenever someone tries to spread out to other servers to make TT more game wide, the majority say "O gee, I dunno" "I don't want to make a new lowbie tank on another server" and my persoanl favorite "If TT leaves champion on the first tuesday of the month it's streak will be broken and not special anymore".

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You know what else has been done in an MMO?

Hitler.

This is going to be hard to grasp for some people, but 99% of the people who play this game don't give a damn about you. At all. Let's say you have a hundred friends. No, wait, a thousand friends. Who you play with and care about and are close to and deal with on a daily basis. Great. You have one percent of the player base giving a damn about your existence.

Tanker Tuesday generates what, a hundred tanks every month? Two hundred? Three hundred?

Less than a percent?

Sure, it's impressive. I even laud the idea that TT deserves something, sure, something special. But to act like this game needs to follow-the-leader on ego-inflating bling in a competitive, pvp-based game in this, the individuality-driven, small-and-casual creative game is egotistical to the point of irrationality.

Ironically, it's the kind of self-aggrandizing showboating that I've heard experienced players routinely use as their criteria for dismissing tankers - and this event is at last check about tankers trying to increase tanker popularity and 'have a good time' by ignoring everything in the game that isn't a tanker.

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Just in case anyone has him on ignore.

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If TT regularly attracted 10% of the population, heck 2% would be enough, and it was a regular event on multiple servers, I would support this idea. Until that happens I just don't see how TT deserves it.

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I am also in favor of some sort of metric or standard to be in place that sets a guideline for ideas like this.

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This, I'm fully in support of. (I'm very much "on the side of caution," if you've paid attention to my comments.)

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You know this thread speaks to a bigger topic that all 14 vocally opposed have overlooked by a mile.


Saying you'd like to see some standard or metric on this idea while spending ALL your time trying to shoot down the vehicle that might bring that about, is a contradiction.

Wouldn't it be amazing to have THIS in OUR game? That's a feature in a game that's not even a year old.


Do you really think the devs would consider the request in the OP without first considering a system to reward laudable milestones by other players, and events? Really?

In that, you're really selling yourselves and everyone who's accomplished worthy milestones or feats in the game to date, and in the future, short.

[u]You say you want a standard and contemplation by the devs, but the vehicle to start the process is right in front of your eyes.[u]

You've pointed to other entities that are worthy, yet clearly those associated with them are no where near as passionate about their cause as those who've attended TT through the years.
More likely, many of the leaders of the afore mentioned don't have active accounts anymore.

Contrast that with the person responsible for starting TT returning to the game to support the idea.


This is the vehicle to force that "metric" by the devs if there ever was one, by the broad show of support, to possibly usher in something like THIS, but you're so inclined to think inside the box that the point completely misses you, just as it did with Power Proliferation for many of you.

[u]You were wrong on Power Proliferation (I have pms battle scars on my sons account from a few of you from those days ), and you're totally missing an opportunity with the OP.[u]


Airing on the side of cation and inside the box clan thinking rarely gets anything interesting done, just as it wouldn't if some of you had your way with PP.


In effect you could say that this event and those offering this outside the box idea are pioneers of maybe something like this making it's way into the City Of game world.


[u]But you're not exploring anything, or promoting any new ideas, you're just hunkered down in your narrow box dissecting every minuscule fact to "air on the side of caution". [u]


Maybe the devs will still think of an equitable system to reward better then exceptional feats by players and forumites, because of the uncontested milestone highlighted in the OP (like a Hall of Fame instance, with an entire map filled with stutues and plaques highlighting legends and legendary accomplishments), [u]but it wont be because of any of the obstructionist minded pack.[u]


You offer [u]nothing new[u], only the same rehashed rewards that are growing five years long in the tooth, while even the devs have tried to think outside the box on this topic.



And for that you do a disservice to everyone in the game, including yourselves, who've accomplished crazy amazing milestones while playing this game we love.

This could be in the games future, and it's at least worthy of a polite debate. Using your obvious intelligence to offer alternative new ideas, ways that this could happen equitably in game, like maybe using the MA as part of it.


Think outside the box, be proactive, if a one year old game can think of some new and exciting way to reward true achievements, then why can't you, you're friends, you're events and groups, who've unquestionably made not just a mark but a crater in this game, be rewarded with something innovative exciting and brand new?!

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First of all giving out a reward like this without first setting standards for it is just stupid.

Second, this seems like nothing but a huge ego-stroke. Just because RO or the Taxibots haven't asked for this does not mean they are less passionate. It means they see enjoying themselves ingame as all the reward they need. The fact that you set there and even claim that TT has done more for the game then RO is just ludicrous. TT runs once a month, on ONE SERVER. RO spans three servers, on both red and blue side, every night.

TT's life is impressive, but it has had ZERO effect on the other servers. It has attracted less then one percent of the populaation of the ENTIRE game and just does not deserve to be made a part of canon in any way shape or form.

_mr3_, none of us are saying TT doesn't deserve some kind of recognition. We just feel that it shouldn't be enshrined game wide when it is a single server event. Sure people have said it happened on other servers, but they also said it never caught on with the other servers population. Therefore it is by very deffinition, and by the fact that every announcement says "champion server", a SINGLE SERVER event.

And, SINGLE SERVER events should not be enshrined game wide in any way. Make a help tip for it, have a party and invite the devs. just because you did that on the last anniversary doesn't mean you can't know. Where will it stop?

Had a big party for 3rd anniversary? Check.

Got a plague for 5th anniversary? Check.

8th anniversary is coming up. We should have a statue. "Get to work devs! You gave us a plaque for the 5th anniversary, you should give us a statue for the 8th!"

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My breasts.

[/ QUOTE ]Pics or GTFO

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I second that.

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"And, to be honest, I think if the Devs are considering this, then TT would be a good place to start as it does have an extensive history in which the Devs themselves have attended."

No argument here. IF they decide they want to offer such recognition in game, Tanker Tuesday would be an excellent choice.

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Actually I disagree. An event that happens on ONE SERVER does not deserve permanent inclusion into the game world. Or did I miss it on freedom last night? Guess I should have gone the justice TT, or maybe the victory one.

There wasn't one on those servers?

Hmmm, that seems odd for a such a important and game altering event.

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You set no criteria for Tanker Tuesday to meet to deserve a plaque that it has not already met. At what point do you either concede that it qualifies or admit that you are just being oppositional?

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I personally will not concede.

Why you may ask?

Because there are other ways to recognise a SINGLE SERVER event then to enshrine it gamewide. I think thats pretty obvious and simple to understand. No matter how many times you post the exact same thing.

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And, really, a small plaque does very little to alter the landscape. It isn't something that would be required for the history badges, nor would it be the only one not required for a badge. I'd bet that a lot of people don't even notice most of the city plaques, they are small and this isn't a heavy traffic area. Basically- it wouldn't harm anything to have a tiny detail like this added.

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It would be a small reminder of the events achievement, with nothing attached to it, in an obscure location, which is only filled with activity the first Tuesday of every month during Tanker Tuesday.

TT has run successfully for half a decade, and continues to be as popular as year number one.
It wouldn't be a slight at all to any server, as players have happily gathered to one location every month since 2004, just so they can meet up with likeminded enthusiasts at a really unique event.

TT is the only event that has run for sixty consecutive months and continues unabated, if you'd like to say there should be a standard met before a player[s] created event could be considered for a small token like this, Tanker Tuesday is the standard, at half a decade for sixty consecutive months (Oct 6) and counting.


Upsen_Downs "Go. Hunt. Kill Skuls.", comments way back when led to an actual in game reward, a badge, the TT plaque wouldn't be in the same hemisphere as that, it would just be a small clicky reminder of the ongoing achievement.

Events have been started over the years for many different AT's, Blasters, Controllers, Defenders. Tank enthusiasts have kept this event thriving for so many years, much like Harley Davidson rallies where inexplicably bankers and doctors mingle in with an eclectic group who share each others interests.

I think the above quote is pretty reasonable in summing it up. =T



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My first exciting experience in this game that cemented my stay for the last 27+months was this - [color= yellow]TANKER TUESDAY[/color].

As a new player, I was in awe at the incredible amount of camaraderie, friendship, helpfulness and selflessness the TT players that I was teamed with provided. After a couple missions, and some great in-game conversations, I was hooked on City of Heroes.

Not long after, I was able to attend a Tanker Tuesday Anniversary, where Tankers marched from zone to zone, arriving at the Tanker statue (the one with the "Tanker" badge). Group shots were taken and many wonderful events ensued. The line of tankers stretched for block after block for some of the contests. Multiple zones were created simply due to the influx of tankers. I had NEVER seen anything like this in any MMO or other game for that matter. Between getting a yellow title, seeing the Dev characters, such as Back Alley Brawler and Castle, I was lucky enough to win the 'best battlecry' award for my character, "Captain Battleship". It was indeed an incredible, magical moment.

The gist of what I am trying to point out is that for those on the Champion server that have participated in this incredible and fun event, it is indeed an experience that creates a moment in gaming that we all have experienced at one time or another, that I affectionately dub as "video zen"; a moment in your gaming experience that you will always remember with a fond recollection. For most, this 'zen' is experienced when the game is new, fresh and challenging. THIS event, Tanker Tuesday, has been my 'video zen' in this game and the only one I've had in any MMO.

After 5 years of consistent effort, providing memories for nearly every player who has ever experienced "Tanker Tuesday", I wholeheartedly agree with Ace Mace and all the incredible Championites that continue to provide the community with the BEST event ever, that a small plaque in this game is truly a notable and worthy request.

[color= yellow]Devs, the masses have requested for a plaque to be placed in- game and in-zone to honor those that have created one of the most incredible and dynamic community-created events ever. I submit to you, the designers, developers, administrators, and the the makers of City of Heroes/Villains to honor this incredible event that is "Tanker Tuesday". [/color]

If you have ever participated in a Tanker Tuesday, you will understand how incredible and worthy this request is.

Make it so.

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No the masses have not. There are some people who think so, mostly those who participate in it or help oganise it. They are in no position to be unbiased or impartial. Those of us who are against the plaque idea are just that, against the plaque idea. I'm all for TT getting recognition, but it should not be enshrined gamewide when it is a Champion server event, even if it has been going for 5 years.

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Since we are using the "never heard of" argument, what is Repeat Offenders? A big SG or something?

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If you had actually read the last page or two you would know.

Really adds nothing to the debate.

edit: read 5 posts above your's and you will see that Bill went into detail about what RO is.

I'm not trying to argue or point any fingers. But saying an event you participate in deserves a permanent place in the game, when it is only well known on one server is self-aggrandizing. Sure people on other servers might know about it, but it is not a cross server thing.

I am all for TT getting recognition for lasting this long, but it does not deserve a plaque or any other permanent addition to the game world.

I find it funny when people who disagree are attacked for not agreeing with someone elses opinion. Why is the person disagreeing not intitled to thier opinion?

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BTW, tomorrow night is Tanker Tuesday, and everybody is welcome as long as you play a Tank, any kind, any level.
It'll be extra fun if I14 goes live.


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Yes, and we tend to throw rocks at the other ATs when they show up. Big chunks of pavement, actually...



As far as the plaque idea is concerned, I am all for it if the Devs want to place one for Tanker Tuesday and will not lose a wink of sleep if they don't. I attend them neither for recognition nor for reward, so either way. Tanker Tuesday is about Tanker players getting together and having fun and not having recognition will not change that.

Although, a plaque with something like "Tanker Tuesday, Home of the Ringslide" would really work.

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And this is how people should feel. The whole "I've been in it for years. We need a plaque!!!" Is nothing but self-serving and concieted. As Bill and others have said, RO has done more then TT ever has. Yet you don't see RO in here saying "We need a plaque because we are so cool!"

TT is something that happens on champion server. I have never seen it announced anywhere else, in fact I haven't even seen it in the player events section in a while. Maybe I missed it in there, but I doubt it.

I agree with bill and just don't see a reason for a permanant addition to the game.

edit: I did go search in case I missed it and saw an announcement for feb and a post for march on the day of. Nothing for this month so far though.

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You're right and I did blueside. I was amazed how fast, you level.

Sewers -> Hollows/Positron TF -> Synapse TF and so on.

I got to 30. In a month. But it was hard to solo, you had wait for a task force or a team but you don't have to wait long for that. It was more team oriented to me. I felt easier to solo redside. Powers seemed backward to me other than the Scrapper. I'm more offence-minded I guess. Game is completely foreign to me blue-side.

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No wonder you don't have any influence or enough drops. Every person on your team raises the number of mobs to beat. More mobs to beat = more inf and drops. Makes sense to me.

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With sprinkles, obviously.

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Edited to remove quote pyramid -Mod08

Don't tanks always come with sprikles?