sturm375

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But I want to play Superman, and fie on those who want to play The Question!

FIE ON THEM I SAY!

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I had a Question/Rorschach homage character for a long time. He ideled in the teens because there's no Street Fighting set and DM felt wrong.


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Question learned martial arts from Richard Dragon, so he should be a MA scrapper. At any rate, the Question was a pathetic fighter. Green Arrow* trashed him in Double Date, and he's an Archery/TA defender.

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*fixed that for ya, no charge. I'm pretty sure it was Green Arrow, not Green Lantern (who would be like Positron, only better powerlevel).

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Ya know I have always thought it funny that the Brute class was based on the HULK. A Hero.

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Hulk isn't a hero, Bruce Banner is, but the Hulk is just a force of nature extremely loosely directed. But then again I am weird, I tend to think that the current incarnation of Batman more closely resembles a terrorist than a hero. Am I that old?

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...little more backup than "but comic book tankers..." which even the devs have noted is not a valid statement.

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I disagree with this. We're playing a game based on comic books, so it seems to me that the expectation that the game should behave like the comic books is paramount. That said, Game Balance MUST be retained.


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Can't be done. It really can't. Comic books themselves don't behave like each other, within the same series or between different series. Should we have people with the power level of Superman, or Batman? Of the Silver Surfer, or Kitty Pride? Of the Hulk, or Thunderbird? These characters have vastly different power levels, but are all in the comics. How do you get the game to behave like a Silver Surfer comic, and also like the Batman comic? You can't. You just can't.

So, what you aim for is trying to get as decently close as possible, within the framework of the game. This game, at inception, didn't have ATs. You could choose any two power sets you wanted. It was closer to the comics than the game is today, with a wider range of power levels in it. You could have Tank-Mages, and you could have complete gimps, with no offense except brawl. How do you balance a game with that wide of a power level difference? You also have people tending to choose the path of least resistance, often times choosing it over concept. As such, people tended to make more Tank-Mages, able to survive and dish out a ton of damage. It made the game ridiculously easy.

Because of that, the Devs made the AT system. The AT system does not exist in the comics. It just doesn't. You have characters that emulate certain ATs (or, more accurately, the ATs emulate those characters), but you never get exacts. Each character in the comics can usually do something that this game won't allow them to do. The Ancillary Pools try to fill in these gaps to some extent, but can't cover every case. Conversely, we have characters in the comics that would be woefully underbalanced if they came into this game (Storm would have Storm Summoning, but no blasts, for instance; the Invisible Woman would have almost no offense at all).


This game is an MMO inspired by comic books. It is NOT a comic book MMO. It has taken a specific power level, and used that as a baseline for it's characters to have. It then goes from there to work out how each AT will fit into that baseline level. When doing so, it will likely divert largely from the source material. Sure, the Devs can try to keep it as close as they can, but it's not going to be very close. To get closer, you need to not be an MMO, where balance issues don't need to be addressed, and you can just imitate a specific character and not worry about different power levels between your characters.

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I agree with this comment wholeheartedly. And I believe the fact that "this is an MMO with Super Hero Elements, not a Super Hero MMO" is about the best we can do.

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Sadly you are correct. And getting more correct every day it seems. I see it being pushed, pulled by devs and players alike in this direction. I suppose for those that like MMO first Super Hero second it's a good thing.

Trouble is (and I wish I had the search fu to find it) Statesman himself said CoH is supposed to be a Comic Book like game first and MMP second. I'm paraphrasing, but that was what I believe he meant.

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-Buff a tank's primary in some way

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You'd have to show that every Tanker primary set needs a buff.

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Doesn't have to be a buff to def/res, could be an endurance reduction or something. Or, like I said above, small, scaling (with level), unenhancable, unstackable, resistance to the unresistable.

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What if, in addition to gauntlet, we got something that buffed our primary? You know, just like every other AT in the game has?

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Except for controllers and defenders. Controllers inherent buff their damage, it is based on their primary to do damage, but it does not buff it. Defenders though are the complete opposite, their inherent is based on them ignoring their primary, since it only works when team mates are not supported.

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Controller's primary controls and does some damage. Containment buffs the damage portion of that. Thus it buffs their primary.

Defender's buffs/debuffs cost endurance to run and cast. Vigilance buffs their primary by reducing it's endurance cost. It's not great, and in fact should be up above tanks in getting a better inherent, but this isn't the defender's forum.

Let me be totally clear. I'd not touch gauntlet. However any additional inherent should address some, if not all of these issues:

-Buff a tank's primary in some way

-Have an effect in PvP

-Not diminish anything tanks currently do

-Provide flavor and fun, especially at lower levels before those new to tanks give up on them. (should be effective and noticeable at level 1)

What if, in addition to gauntlet, we got something that buffed our primary? You know, just like every other AT in the game has?

What if, seeing as we are the only AT with a Self Defense primary, we got a scaling, minor, resistance to the unresistable? Hami Damage, Crystal Titan Damage, PvP (Blasters unresistable damage, scrappers unresistable crits, defenders unresisable debuffs.......). Basically anything in the game, that is either unresistable or untyped, we'd get a scaling, minor resist to it.

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Incidentally, I know it's kinda weird for me of all people to be pointing to the topic drift, but I think it's worth underscoring that this thread, from Ultimo, is about the idea of adding ranged attacks to tankers, which I'm against because it diminishes the distinction between ATs, because it gives more survivability to an AT that doesn't need it, because it's tricky to implement and because I can't see what the game really gains from it.

In this strand of topic drift, we're discussing JB's favourite bugaboo of 'Tankers Need Moar Damage' where he tries to rearrange the order of the words and hope we don't notice, which prompts me to remember something I did the last time this happened. I was playing my non-IO'd shield/ss tanker, in Crey's Folly, and thought I'd see how 'slowly' I defeated enemies. Not 'how much slower than a scrapper', but how much actual time it took me to kill things. With fairly standard slotting, no hasten, no recharge in attacks,

The normal tactic of this character is to leap into a +0 spawn and shield charge them and then kill the lieutenant that was still standing. Since getting Foot Stomp, it's become leap in, Foot Stomp, Shield Charge, one-shot the remaining lieutenant. I do this primarily because it's fun and it makes me giggle to watch a large pack of freaks drop all at once. However, that's not really all that clear - after all, shield charge takes time to recharge, so I can't do it every single spawn. I alternate by bashing faces of lone or paired bosses in the area. Plus 'the activation time of two attacks' isn't really meaningful data for this little curiosity of mine.

I waited until Rage was ready to go, then clicked it and closed in on the a trio of red (+1) freakshow tanks and just laid into them. Between that point and the crash of Rage, I killed all three bosses, killed one that had rezzed, and was halfway through killing the next that had rezzed. So in 90 seconds, that's 4.5 bosses. 20 seconds for a +1 boss.

How much faster do I have to be before it's good enough? Twenty [censored] seconds.

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That's awesome Talen, however how many people who are trying out a new AT are going to wait 38 levels (footstomp). Maybe 39-40 (footstomp fully slotted). Hell Shield Charge and Rage don't come into play till what mid-late 20's?

Sorry to side-track this, but it does show one of the biggest flaws in the "balance" designed currently in the game. Tanks are one of, if not the latest "shiners" in the game. You really don't feel very tankerly, and I really don't have fun with them till the mid 20's. DO's and TOs are next to, if not totally useless as Defense or Resistance enhancers. Late to the party offense. Those are just 2 of the reasons tanks are late bloomers.

Tanks are the only AT I've played that I don't feel their essence within the first 5-7 levels. That's a problem IMHO.

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Sadly, only Scrappers had thier inherent from day 1 blue side.

And Vigilance only helps when you screw up. Go me. Then again, Defiance 1.0 was the same way.

And if a Fire/Fire is generating too much aggro, slot better, because 90% of the critters should be dead before they realize you are blasting them.

As for gauntlet.... it seems to be the perfect blend with WP because most tanks have a more agressive aura which holds aggro by itself. Largely, Ive been a disappointed with gauntlet, but really, do tanks need to be better?

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I could be wrong (and that's been known to happen) but I don't think scrappers launched with crits. They were added early on, but I am pretty sure they did not have them at live launch.

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Oh, I get all that. That was an idea I had after just 1 year in the game, after all - and I'm not the number-cruncher you lot are. :P

I understood the mechanics a lot less then I do now. I'm of the school of Havok (or was it Kruunch?) who coined the slogan during the KOB campaign "I just want to punch the bejesus out of stuff!".

But, yes, you're right.

As an example of my less-than-concerned interest in combat statistics, I also submitted to Statesman in '05 something called "Comic Book Mode" where you set an option that removes the damage numbers from combat, and replacing them with onomatopoeia ("Boom!" "Freem!" "KPOW!") - others here - to give the game a more immersive 'comic book' feel if you wanted it, and not worry about DPS and other stuff.

I got an "Interesting...".

I bet CO will get it. Heh.

But I digress.

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So that's where they got the idea for their April Fools joke a year or two ago.

http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/April_Fools%27_Day

Powerset: Shield Defense
Animation: Fly Emotes

Most, if not all Shield Defense toggles prevent the use of fly emotes. Same bug used to be in Blazing Aura of Fire Armor however that power was fixed.

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My fire/fire blaster, if I'm going all out with no regard for my own safety (is there any other way?) can and does pull agro off of anything but an Ice tank running both auras and taunting. If a tank doesn't have Taunt while my blaster is on the team, he is basically a really tough scrapper for all the agro he keeps off me. A stoner running Mud Pots can hold agro from me as well, mostly because they run so slowly they forget about me before they leave the aura.

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This always get me. So what you're saying is that a player playing a tank has to adjust his/her playstyle to suit your blaster's needs. And your blaster should not have to adjust playstyle to what the tanker does?

Don't forget Gauntlet:

The only inherent that doesn't do anything in PvP. (not that we'd want gauntlet to do anything in PvP since we'd just get demolished faster)

The only inherent that doesn't in some way buff the AT's primary powersets.

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wow why is everyone harping on wonderwoman?

in the dc universe, she is second only to superman in raw power.


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Actually Darkside, Mon-El, and Captain Marvel would all be significantly stonger than WW.

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Because these devs didn't make the claim you're attributing to them. And the one dev that made the claim did so quite a few years ago, proceeded to increase Tanker damage by a sizable amount, then left the project around the same time many of the current devs came on to the project.

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I wasn't around when they buffed Tanker damage. Can you give me a comparison of when KoB was unchanged then buffed? Because I think it would be interesting for me to see the damage on it before and after.

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tankers were insane. invuln was deservedly nerfed into the ground not long after issue 4. an invuln/fire tanker should never, ever be able to solo a respec trial set for 8 people on invincible.

you guys should play a brute i think. forget the concepts and copying comic books. play a brute. sadly they made villains into pseudo-heroes if you follow the storylines. a brute is as close to a working version of what JB whines for you'll get in these games.

in order for any mmorpg to be anything but a solo grindfest, you need content that has to be completed in a group. for this - you need an assortment of classes that dont all perform the exact same functions. the trifecta of tank-healer-dps has worked for over 30 years of MUD's and MMORPG's and any attempt by companies to do something new has failed to date - the game became an anti-social solo fest or it's a korean grinder where yo ucontrol three chars at the same time.

the original system of picking whatever powers you wanted wasnt going to work. they knew this. i mean just look at how it's affected the AE. cryptic knew that for longevity of the game they were going to have to have some basics of class design. after all, these games are based on MUD's, most of which were based on DIKU which was based mostly on dungeons and dragons rulesets. they needed tanks, they need healers or buffers, and they needed dps'ers.

i'm sure CO will be a good game, but it remains to be seen if everyone and their mother isnt using the exact. same. powersets a month after launch because with the open endedness of the game someone somewhere will find some obscenely overpowered combination of powers - and every one will play them. READ: burn tankers issue 0-4

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IIRC Invincibility had a Typ-0 in it or a misplaced decimal point that caused it to be far overpowered. They then nerfed alll of defense (GDN), then they fixed the decimal point problem in invincibility. Finally, a short time ago, they buffed invulnerability to where it's competitive again.

Every official DC write-up on Superman I've ever seen shows him to have a much higher offense than defense.

How things should have been balanced from the begining:

Blasters: Kings of damage (if you count up all the orange numbers from their multi target attacks, and they should have had splash damage).

Scrappers: Kings of Single Target DPS. Quickly taking down multiple targets using speed and percision.

Tanks/Bricks: Kings of Damage per Hit.

I know it could have been balanced that way. They might have had to do something like give a momentum like inherent to Tanks/Bricks that would lower the recharge cap, and raise the -recharge floor to make sure that powers like hasten would not allow tanks to out DPS scrappers.

It could have been done, but it wasn't. Yeah, I'm still a little miffed that they shoehorned the 2 most iconic powers in comicbookdom (SS/Inv) into an aggro manager, but not as mad as I used to be. It's done, it's not going to change dramaticaly ever. I've accepted that and moved on.

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I also wanted a lot of recharge so I could fit more attacks in. An ideal attack chain for me would be FSS -> GFS -> Combustion -> FSS etc. Not sure if I could do that, but it would be nice. Also, I'm kinda wondering if the procs I have in blazing aura would be better in combustion and FSS. More defense would be nice, but I don't see a way I can do that and still keep anywhere near the recharge I have.

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If you've got the influence, go for it. Fireing off FSC against Single Targets isn't very efficient, but you've probably got the recovery to do it.

My single target attack chain consists of: GFS, Incinerate, Sands of Mu (Vet Power), and occasionally Fire blast. I hardly ever find myself waiting for a ST attack to recharge, unless slowed.

Another note, I herd whole rooms of Carnies, as long as there are on DRMs in the mix. Sure, taking down a dozen or so will drain the end a little, my shields stay on, and I recover quickly enough.

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I was thinking the extra recharge and recovery would be superior to extra regen and resistance/defense because healing flames would be up so much faster and consume would be able to cover for the times sappers/carnies got to me, at least long enough for my recovery to kick back in.

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Healing Flames, the way I have it slotted, gets triple stacked if I put it on auto fire. There's only so much a Fire/Fire/Pyre tank can do for mitigation against damage. There is none to speak of in their secondary (you can use burn to cause stuff to run away for a short time, but that's about it)

My thoughts have been adding +HP first, +Recovery and +Def second, then +Res/+Recharge third. Seems to work real good for me, I am miles sturdier than the IO'd up brute that was on my ITF last night. Not quite as tough as the Stone Tank on the team, but I was a LOT more moble, and added quite a bit of AoE damage.

My theory has always been adding def to a Resistance heavy primary like Fire is better than adding more resistance. Works for me in practice. YMMV.

Here's my build basically, some differences in game, but I like it. Most EBs I don't have to sweat much. Some things still get me, like the occasional malta sapper I miss, or Dark Ring Mistress'


Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/

[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]

John Bryne: Level 50 Magic Tanker
Primary Power Set: Fiery Aura
Secondary Power Set: Fiery Melee
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Pyre Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Blazing Aura <ul type="square">[*] (A) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage[*] (19) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Recharge[*] (19) Scirocco's Dervish - Chance of Damage(Lethal)[*] (23) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Endurance[*] (23) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance[*] (25) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Recharge[/list]Level 1: Scorch <ul type="square">[*] (A) Accuracy IO[/list]Level 2: Fire Shield <ul type="square">[*] (A) Titanium Coating - Endurance[*] (3) Titanium Coating - Resistance[*] (3) Resist Damage IO[*] (9) Titanium Coating - Resistance/Endurance[*] (37) Steadfast Protection - Knockback Protection[/list]Level 4: Combustion <ul type="square">[*] (A) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage[*] (5) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Recharge[*] (5) Scirocco's Dervish - Chance of Damage(Lethal)[*] (9) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Recharge[*] (34) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Endurance[*] (34) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance[/list]Level 6: Healing Flames <ul type="square">[*] (A) Miracle - Heal/Endurance/Recharge[*] (7) Miracle - Endurance/Recharge[*] (7) Numina's Convalescence - Heal[*] (11) Numina's Convalescence - Endurance/Recharge[*] (11) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance[*] (15) Miracle - Heal/Recharge[/list]Level 8: Hover <ul type="square">[*] (A) Defense Buff IO[/list]Level 10: Swift <ul type="square">[*] (A) Flight Speed IO[*] (46) Flight Speed IO[/list]Level 12: Plasma Shield <ul type="square">[*] (A) Titanium Coating - Endurance[*] (13) Titanium Coating - Resistance[*] (13) Resist Damage IO[*] (15) Titanium Coating - Resistance/Endurance[*] (40) Steadfast Protection - Knockback Protection[/list]Level 14: Fly <ul type="square">[*] (A) Freebird - Endurance[*] (43) Freebird - FlySpeed[*] (43) Freebird - +Stealth[/list]Level 16: Health <ul type="square">[*] (A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal[*] (17) Numina's Convalescence - +Regeneration/+Recovery[*] (17) Miracle - +Recovery[/list]Level 18: Taunt <ul type="square">[*] (A) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Recharge/Range[*] (27) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Range[*] (42) Perfect Zinger - Chance for Psi Damage[*] (42) Perfect Zinger - Taunt[*] (42) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Recharge[/list]Level 20: Stamina <ul type="square">[*] (A) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod[*] (21) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Endurance[*] (21) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Accuracy[/list]Level 22: Boxing <ul type="square">[*] (A) Accuracy IO[/list]Level 24: Build Up <ul type="square">[*] (A) Adjusted Targeting - Recharge[*] (25) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff/Recharge[/list]Level 26: Fiery Embrace <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO[*] (27) Recharge Reduction IO[/list]Level 28: Fire Sword Circle <ul type="square">[*] (A) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage[*] (29) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Recharge[*] (29) Scirocco's Dervish - Chance of Damage(Lethal)[*] (33) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Recharge[*] (33) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Endurance[*] (33) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance[/list]Level 30: Tough <ul type="square">[*] (A) Titanium Coating - Endurance[*] (31) Titanium Coating - Resistance[*] (31) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%[*] (31) Steadfast Protection - Knockback Protection[*] (34) Titanium Coating - Resistance/Endurance[/list]Level 32: Burn <ul type="square">[*] (A) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Recharge[*] (43) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Recharge[/list]Level 35: Incinerate <ul type="square">[*] (A) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage[*] (36) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge[*] (36) Mako's Bite - Chance of Damage(Lethal)[*] (36) Mako's Bite - Damage/Recharge[*] (37) Mako's Bite - Damage/Endurance[*] (37) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge[/list]Level 38: Greater Fire Sword <ul type="square">[*] (A) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage[*] (39) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge[*] (39) Mako's Bite - Chance of Damage(Lethal)[*] (39) Mako's Bite - Damage/Recharge[*] (40) Mako's Bite - Damage/Endurance[*] (40) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge[/list]Level 41: Char <ul type="square">[*] (A) Accuracy IO[*] (46) Accuracy IO[/list]Level 44: Fire Blast <ul type="square">[*] (A) Devastation - Accuracy/Damage[*] (45) Devastation - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge[*] (45) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage[*] (45) Devastation - Damage/Endurance[*] (46) Devastation - Damage/Recharge[/list]Level 47: Fire Ball <ul type="square">[*] (A) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage[*] (48) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance[*] (48) Positron's Blast - Damage/Range[*] (48) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance[*] (50) Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy)[/list]Level 49: Weave <ul type="square">[*] (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance[*] (50) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance/Recharge[*] (50) Luck of the Gambler - Defense[/list]------------
Level 1: Brawl <ul type="square">[*] (A) Empty[/list]Level 1: Sprint <ul type="square">[*] (A) Empty[/list]Level 2: Rest <ul type="square">[*] (A) Empty[/list]Level 1: Gauntlet
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[u]Set Bonus Totals:[u]<ul type="square">[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Smashing)[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Lethal)[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Fire)[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Cold)[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Energy)[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Negative)[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Toxic)[*]13.5% DamageBuff(Psionic)[*]3% Defense(Smashing)[*]3% Defense(Lethal)[*]7.69% Defense(Fire)[*]7.69% Defense(Cold)[*]6.75% Defense(Energy)[*]6.75% Defense(Negative)[*]12.4% Defense(Psionic)[*]3% Defense(Melee)[*]10.5% Defense(Ranged)[*]12.4% Defense(AoE)[*]36% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*]11.3% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*]295.2 HP (15.8%) HitPoints[*]Knockback (Mag -12)[*]Knockup (Mag -12)[*]MezResist(Held) 6.6%[*]MezResist(Immobilize) 6.6%[*]MezResist(Sleep) 6.6%[*]MezResist(Terrorized) 2.75%[*]8% (0.13 End/sec) Recovery[*]94% (7.35 HP/sec) Regeneration[*]1.58% Resistance(Fire)[*]1.58% Resistance(Cold)[*]9.38% Resistance(Negative)[/list]------------
[u]Set Bonuses:[u]
[u]Scirocco's Dervish[u]
(Blazing Aura)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 3.13% Resistance(Negative)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 3.13% Defense(AoE), 1.56% Defense(Fire), 1.56% Defense(Cold)[*] 3.13% Defense(Psionic)[/list][u]Titanium Coating[u]
(Fire Shield)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Sleep) 2.2%[*] 28.1 HP (1.5%) HitPoints[/list][u]Steadfast Protection[u]
(Fire Shield)<ul type="square">[*] Knockback Protection (Mag -4)[/list][u]Scirocco's Dervish[u]
(Combustion)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 3.13% Resistance(Negative)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 3.13% Defense(AoE), 1.56% Defense(Fire), 1.56% Defense(Cold)[*] 3.13% Defense(Psionic)[/list][u]Miracle[u]
(Healing Flames)<ul type="square">[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery[*] 35.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints[/list][u]Numina's Convalescence[u]
(Healing Flames)<ul type="square">[*] 12% (0.94 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 35.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints[/list][u]Titanium Coating[u]
(Plasma Shield)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Sleep) 2.2%[*] 28.1 HP (1.5%) HitPoints[/list][u]Steadfast Protection[u]
(Plasma Shield)<ul type="square">[*] Knockback Protection (Mag -4)[/list][u]Freebird[u]
(Fly)<ul type="square">[*] 8% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 28.1 HP (1.5%) HitPoints[/list][u]Numina's Convalescence[u]
(Health)<ul type="square">[*] 12% (0.94 HP/sec) Regeneration[/list][u]Perfect Zinger[u]
(Taunt)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Terrorized) 2.75%[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*] 2.5% DamageBuff(All)[/list][u]Efficacy Adaptor[u]
(Stamina)<ul type="square">[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints[*] 1.5% (0.03 End/sec) Recovery[/list][u]Adjusted Targeting[u]
(Build Up)<ul type="square">[*] 2% DamageBuff(All)[/list][u]Scirocco's Dervish[u]
(Fire Sword Circle)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 3.13% Resistance(Negative)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 3.13% Defense(AoE), 1.56% Defense(Fire), 1.56% Defense(Cold)[*] 3.13% Defense(Psionic)[/list][u]Titanium Coating[u]
(Tough)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Sleep) 2.2%[*] 28.1 HP (1.5%) HitPoints[/list][u]Steadfast Protection[u]
(Tough)<ul type="square">[*] 1.5% (0.03 End/sec) Recovery[*] 3% Defense(All)[*] Knockback Protection (Mag -4)[/list][u]Scirocco's Dervish[u]
(Burn)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[/list][u]Mako's Bite[u]
(Incinerate)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Immobilize) 3.3%[*] 28.1 HP (1.5%) HitPoints[*] 3% DamageBuff(All)[*] MezResist(Held) 3.3%[*] 3.75% Defense(Ranged), 1.88% Defense(Energy), 1.88% Defense(Negative)[/list][u]Mako's Bite[u]
(Greater Fire Sword)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Immobilize) 3.3%[*] 28.1 HP (1.5%) HitPoints (Exceeded 5 Bonus Cap)[*] 3% DamageBuff(All)[*] MezResist(Held) 3.3%[*] 3.75% Defense(Ranged), 1.88% Defense(Energy), 1.88% Defense(Negative)[/list][u]Devastation[u]
(Fire Blast)<ul type="square">[*] 12% (0.94 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 42.2 HP (2.25%) HitPoints[*] 3% DamageBuff(All)[/list][u]Positron's Blast[u]
(Fire Ball)<ul type="square">[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery[*] 1.58% Resistance(Fire,Cold)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Luck of the Gambler[u]
(Weave)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration (Exceeded 5 Bonus Cap)[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints[/list]

Here's a possible solution: Get rid of all class "B" TOs and DOs. Their effects on powers are barely noticeable, and they sell for much less than a class "A" TO/DO. Just work with the base numbers for your powers, add EndRedux to toggles. Adding a DmgRes TO to a power, any power, might make you feel better, but a +3 TO adds only 1.5% res to the best res toggles out there. That means that when that 100 pt dmg attack comes at you, and you have Temp Inv up, instead of seeing the unslotted 70pts of damage, you'll see 68.5 pts of damage.

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No, it's amazing that an iconic powerset such as Super Strength was almost an afterthought on the part of the devs from the begining. Hell, it was a few months in live before KO blow did any damage. Punch that doesn't look like any kind of punch I've ever seen. Haymaker that looks nothing like a haymaker.

[/ QUOTE ]Being one of the most powerful sets in the game = an afterthought?

Right.

The reason people don't cater to please you is because you're exactly the kind of person who will not be pleased by anything they do.

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Note, SS is now one of the best offensive sets a tank can get. At live it was horrid. Wasn't till KO Blow did damage, and I believe they upped the damage quite a bit on Footstop that it did get to the position it is now. Yes, SS appears to be an afterthought on the Devs in a comic book genra MMO.

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You know, the two melee classes seem to be defined as Tankers=power, Scrappers=finesse.

That makes me wonder why Tankers don't have access to Broad Sword, but do have access to Dual Blades? I mean, Dual Blades looks fast and precise, and has little sense of raw power. Sure, you could argue for finesse in Broad Sword, but it's really a power weapon.

In other words, when are we going to get Broad Sword for Tankers (and Brutes, for that matter)?

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There are a ton of things in this game that would make sense conceptually, but aren't likely to happen because it would break balance. Giving tanks Broadsword w/ Parry is one. Giving Scrappers Super Strength w/ Rage is another.

No, it's amazing that an iconic powerset such as Super Strength was almost an afterthought on the part of the devs from the begining. Hell, it was a few months in live before KO blow did any damage. Punch that doesn't look like any kind of punch I've ever seen. Haymaker that looks nothing like a haymaker.

It was because the procs were affecting the player and not the enemies. They chose to remove taunt sets from taunt auras rather than spend the time and money to fix the problem. As far as I know, allowing taunt sets in invincibility is still a bug, but such a minor one they haven't fixed it yet.

The -Regen debuff is interesting, but ultimately probably a no-go. The devs are loath to give tanks any debuffing ability at all. Frankly I was totally surprised they added some debuffing to their epics. I believe their complaint was that it would step on the toes of defenders.

Quite some time ago I posted and idea similar. Basically a minor resistance debuff is added to every ST attack a tank gets. Including pool powers and epics. Adding it to AoEs would be too much IMHO. This resistance debuff would be in the 1% range. It would be stackable, if the tank, or another tank landed a blow within a short time span (5-10 seconds). Also each rank of enemy would have a ceiling as to how much debuffing could be done this way, with GMs/AVs having a much higher ceiling than minions and underlings. Basically it's a tank wearing down the defenses of their enemies. Since it's -res, it would also add damage to tanker attacks w/o hitting the damage cap, or actually making the attacks hit harder. It would also help teams out and provide some incentive to have more than 1 tank on a team.

That idea was soundly shot down because it would step on the toes of defenders, and to some extent controllers.

Thanks for all the great feedback. The flier, we defeated again 5 minutes or so after it respawned, and it respawned again nearly instantly.

I never knew that about re-building towers. Learn something new everyday.

What about the flier moving instantly from the position furthest from LR, all the way to where it can attack us while we assault LR in a fraction of a second?