mauk2
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Quote:Originally Posted by Sylem2k
11 people have looked at this but no one can answer me ?
First, we're not your servants. With that attitude you can expect little assistance.
Second, it's double xp weekend, most folks are gettin' their scrap on. As will I, very shortly.
Third, we're scrappers, not scarppers, or however the hell you spelled it. Sheesh.
Fourth, the question you're asking is huge. The short answer is, get your defenses to 45 percent.
Have fun figuring out how.
Because fun is the whole point, ain't it? 
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Quote:Well....Originally Posted by infernoassassin
Can someone check this build. I want to see if its an ok build for a scrapper
It's a little unconventional.
Claws:
No focus? Really? I would swap out confront for focus in an instant, stick ToD's in it to get the +Def back. Your slotting on followup is nice. I tend to dislike the +dam buff powers, YMMV. Shield breakers in slash? Interesting take on the debuff thing, but not conventional. Unless it's a pure cheap set mule, I'd swap it for another ToD. And, all those Kinetics are gonna cost a mint, plus, 4 naked KC's leave you pretty under-powered.
I'd unslot boxing, save a ton of money, and get the +def back by slotting up Tough Hide and Weave.
And that leads us to:
Invuln:
Invincibility should have at least two cyto's in it, the money you save on the KC's from Boxing should cover those nicely.
Unstoppable? Ergh.... I find it to be too icky for words, and in any case I would want that Steadfast someplace else muuuch lower.
Epic Pool, Body Mastery:
I'd unslot Physical perfection and dump that EA set. I'd give it three slots, one for a Performance shifter +End proc and two for the other two healing uniques. One slot from there goes into Weave + Tough Hide.
FA with six Gaussians? Ehn, it's 'ok."
Fitness pool:
Stamina: No, not six slots any more. Give it four performance shifters if you must, or the proc and two +End's. Your choice. I'd also say hurdle instead of swift, you're a super speeder, you need the vertical leap to add to ninja run.
Speed Pool: Claw's doesn't really need hasten in my books, but it's up to you. It does not need four slots, though, three is plenty and two if you're willing to use 50 IO's.
This leaves you with a bunch of slots, six or more. I'd say take all the reactive armor's out to five slots each, and if at all possible, get Resist Energies to five reactive's as well.
That's my take on a quick skim over it. Claws/invuln is a hugely fun set in my book, I love mine to death.
Have fun with it!
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Quote:Originally Posted by Carnifax
Best I've tried so far is Spin. Stupidly low recharge and you get it at level 6. The one AOE you can end up using over and over again, even with SOs. Combine with a Damage Aura and you're sorted for AOE damage.
Yup. Spin is Win.
With enough recharge you can get it down to less than six seconds. But then, you have issues with firing it on only the leftovers, which kills the output.Quote:FSC is a great AOE too but the recharge is a little too long to be used multiple times on the same spawn (if FSC is recharged at the same spawn you're doing it wrong somewhere).
Shh! Don't tell all the elec/sd guys about this.Quote:Mind you with FSC you can combine it with Shields...
I'm sure it was AAO, not animations.Quote:"Best" is such a loose and argumentative term. I'd go with Spin for an SOed character though. Shield Charge is amazing but even when you do wipe Spawn #1 out with it you've then got to wait a bit for it to come back for Spawn #2. Spin should be back in the time it takes you to toddle from the corpses of #1 to #2 (it recharges in 9.6 seconds unslotted).
I wonder how crappy Claws/Shields looked to the devs animation-wise, it'd be a godly combo.
Spin, Shockwave, Eviscerate, Focus, Shield Charge, all topped up with AAO?
(shudder) It'd be a monster. -
Quote:You're joking now, right?Originally Posted by Umbral
20% is not "a mile".
OK, many folks poo poo MA and the upcoming DP sets for poor damage.
How far below the curve are those sets on a decent attack chain?
And note that the 20 percent disparity is being kind: At maximal recharge the difference is 23 percent, and it ranges to well above 30 percent with more reasonable numbers.
FSC wins by a mile. You worked it out yourself, I have no idea why you're clinging to this.
Yes, the big AOE is teh nice, there is no doubt.Quote:When you consider that SC has a 400% larger area of effect.
True, but it can often be the case (especially on teams) where there aren't enough baddies to saturate SC, especially when there are competing AOE's. In my experience the bigger area isn't that big of a factor, YMMV.Quote:FSC has to put forth some amount of work to get 10 targets into its area of effect. Shield Charge just hits everything.
...okay.Quote:FSC is probably better overall, but in top end AoE scenarios where 3 seconds of herding is actually an issue you have to address, Shield Charge closes the gap relatively easily.
So very true!Quote:AoE isn't just about number of targets and damage. Area of effect and ease of target acquisition matter too (which is why I value spherical AoEs a good deal above radial AoEs). -
Quote:Uhm....Originally Posted by Umbral
Actually, it doesn't. That was kind of the point. When you begin factoring in recharge (which you kind of have to because I've yet to meet anyone with a decent build that doesn't slot their AoEs for recharge at least a little), FSC begins losing ground pretty quickly, to such an extent that the fact that SC can hit 16 targets with very little difficulty whereas FSC can take time to bring enemies in that close begins to have a substantive effect on the numbers.
By your numbers, FSC is 20 percent or more better.
But, Ok!
SC is Teh Uber. I don't know WHAT I was thinkin'.
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Quote:LOL, blizzard of numbahs!Originally Posted by Umbral
I'm not sure what Mids' number's you're reading, but FSC is listed as having 126.7 base damage for me. Of course, this number isn't correct because Mids' doesn't handle the rolling DoTs correctly. Assuming even distribution of minions and upper rank targets, the damage should actually be 119.04 ((48.5 + 48.5)*1.075 + 6.26*.8 + 6.26*.8^2 + 6.26*.8^3 + 6.26*.8^4) damage.
Shield Charge also has a base damage of 200.2 damage (remember the Shield Charge damage increase for Tankers and Scrappers?), but it doesn't have the ability to crit.
Shield Charge is 16 max, not 17. The largest number of targets for any attack (except for a few like Repulsion Bomb that got missed when max targets were added) is 16. The aggro cap, however, is 17.
You're forgetting the fact that powers don't start recharging until they are finished activating. FSC has a 2.67 sec (2.904 sec Arcanatime) animation whereas Shield Charge has a 1.5 sec (1.716 sec Arcanatime) animation. The base cycle times on the both are actually 22.904 and 91.716 seconds, respectively, which hurts FSC a good deal because its animation accounts for more than a tenth of its cycle time.
Now, assuming the proper base values and factoring in cycle times rather than recharge times and no additional recharge values, the info would look more like this:
damage * targets / cycleTime
FSC: 119.04 * 10 / 22.904 = 51.97 DPS
SC: 200.2 * 16 / 91.716 = 34.93 DPS
Now, if you add in some +rech (66%, 133%, and 200%), the fact that FSC has a substantially longer animation time starts to hurt it.
66%
FSC: 119.04 * 10 / 14.95 = 79.53
SC: 200.2 * 16 / 55.93 = 57.27
133%
FSC: 119.04 * 10 / 11.49 = 103.60
SC: 200.2 * 16 / 40.34 = 79.41
200%
FSC: 119.04 * 10 / 9.57 = 124.39
SC: 200.2 * 16 / 31.716 = 101.00
The conclusion is still the same (FSC generates more damage over time assuming that you are dealing with target saturation and ignoring wait times), but it's substantially closer than you calculated. If anything, it starts getting close enough for the fact that Shield Charge has 4 times the area of effect as FSC to start making a decent difference. It takes some manipulation to get 10 targets into a 10' radius circle around you. It doesn't take much manipulation to get 16 targets into a 20' radius circle around you. The fact that Shield Charge is so much bigger gives it a substantial practical advantage (which is why it the AoE formula penalizes larger AoEs), which could probably offset the lower damage by a fair amount. I like that we have such accurate numbers these days.
But while more accurate, the base conclusion remains: FSC wins by a mile.
SC is not the towering best AOE people seems to think it is. Sorry, but that's just so.
We should also take into account the oddball targetting mechanism of SC and LR, due to the Teleport component. I find it slows me down to have to target the TP component, but maybe I'm just slow.
Actually, that might be a wash, since getting to fresh vict... er, targets gets to be a chore on massive recharge builds. I usually use CJ+hurdle for maximum combat speed to keep the AOE's crammed full.
But, to answer the OP, I'd rank them Spin, FSC, Lotus Drops, Thunder Strike/Dragon Tail. (TS/DT gets a nod because the knockdown is oh-so-sweet. There is more to attacks than just damage.) -
Quote:LOL!Originally Posted by Umbral
And that's the kind of thinking that drives me crazy.
"I don't care if it takes 3 minutes to animate! It's pretty!"
I played DP on closed beta for about an hour, and said, "Yep, it's the MA of blaster sets. Meh, but gorgeous."
And you know, that's plenty. I sure as hell am gonna play one. DP and trenchcoats? Geddouttahere! -
Quote:Laser Beam Eyes is among the most powerful debuffs available to a scrapper.Originally Posted by Vitality
Why does this power have such a long activation time?
It is, by far, the longest animating single target range power in all of the Scrapper's Epic pools.
Fire Blast: 1.2s
Dark Blast: 1s
Shuriken: 1.07s
Laser Beam Eyes: 1.67s
It does decent damage AT RANGE, AND a -15 percent defense debuff AT RANGE. On top of that goodness, it lets you set mule debuff and acc debuff sets. Which don't suck.
That's why.
You have to look at all aspects of a power, not just the shiny bits.
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Quote:uhm....Originally Posted by Santorican
Does FSC do upwards of 500 damage in one huge burst? Nope
(sigh)
According to Mid's FSC does 151 base damage, SC does 159.
FSC is small and targets ten max, SC is large and targets 17 max.
FSC recharges in 20 secs base, SC in 90 secs base.
Assume you saturate them both (NOT hard) and attack for three minutes.
Run the math.
FSC saturated damage is 1510 per 20 secs, 180 secs = 9 attacks.
SC saturated damage is 2703 per 90 secs, 180 secs = 3 attacks.
8109 damage for SC versus 13,590 for FSC
Assuming the MID's numbers are even sorta right, FSC wins in a walk, sorry.
Now with a ton of recharge the balance might tip a little in SC's favor, simply because it gets tough to cram enough victims into the roaring mass of death that is FSC, but hey....
To be blunt: SC and LR are big, pretty attacks, but not that terribly effective compared to other tools in the box. -
Quote:All good stuffs. For a really 'old-school' challenge, go out to the Storm Palace and run a lap around the Storm Palace fortress in the center, killing everything as you come to it, all with no temps or insp's.Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
Pylon Challenge: Solo a Rikti Pylon in the RWZ, no temps, no inspirations. Just run up and beat it down.
RWZ challenge: Find a spawn of level 54 rikti with 3 bosses. Take out the whole spawn without temps or inspirations. While you are allowed to herd them up, you're not allowed to split the spawn up.
The last good one I know of is to head into the AE and create a mission with a lot of AVs and find out how many AVs at once you can handle and take down.
A DM/Inv is a rock solid combination. It won't reach the low times on a pylon that the DM/Shields are reaching, but its survivability will be very good. The tohit debuffs from dark melee stacked on to Inv's invincibility plus the self heal from dark will be very nice indeed.
As far as I know that's the first scrapper challenge, and it's still a good one.
Be warned, for an Invuln, that's going to be next to impossible.
Also fun thing is to herd Monster Island in PI. You won't HURT any of them, but see how many you can pile up around you. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
In my opinion, the big problem with superstrength is the range in footstomp. It overshadows everything else in the melee sets except the also overpowered shield charge/lightning rod.
Well, this is easy to fix: Make Dragon Tail the same size as Foot Stomp. Easy peasy! Heck, while we're at it, increase Spin, Whirling Sword, The Lotus Drops, and Flaming Sword Circle, as well.
All balanced now, and all scraps will love it. (Yes, I skipped electric melee's thunder strike on purpose. Also, spines, dual blades, and dark.)
Yup it is. Seismic smash, total focus, and energy transfer are all in the same neighborhood.Quote:Knockout blow?.. it's fine. Every set has to have something special or it won't be.. well... special. -
Quote:...does that count the Gladiator unique? Ehn, the price on that....Originally Posted by Werner
On a Dark Armor, you don't need Hover to pull it off, so you can take Fitness.
On a Dark, might be worth it. Stamina is teh nice, although it is becoming less so.
You should look hard at it. The addition of PP was huge for END management. Using it makes for late bloomers, but Posi has supposedly been dedicated to the 'End Game' so exemping down may become less and less an issue.Quote:On an Electric Armor, you get Power Sink. On a Fiery Aura, you get Consume. Wasn't really thinking about that when I was thinking they'd have endurance problems. So yeah, might be practical to skip Fitness for Hover, though I haven't actually plugged in a build like that to see how it looks.
Hover is really, really nice. Heck, simply having the OPTION to skip Fitness is teh nice.
Honestly, I think this helps /WP and /Regen the most. Layered defenses are the most effective, and soft capped plus adequate levels of resist plus lotsa hp plus lotsa regen is about as layered as you can get.Quote:But you might be able to pull off a soft-capped Katana/Electric or Katana/Fire without horrible compromises. Not sure if it's the best approach, even just for survivability, but it's an interesting thought. -
Quote:Yes it does. Hasten kills your end, and does nothing for your defense. Defense specced scraps need to give up something, and it's perfectly doable to make a workmanlike attack chain with four attacks without hasten or even much in the way of global recharge.Originally Posted by UberGuy
Hm, that cuts out both Hasten and Stamina.
Quote:My new DB/Regen is sans Stamina, and I bailed on Maneuvers in my build once I saw the change to the +Recovery uniques. (Right now just Numi, but I suspect Miracles are on the horizon.)
? Have I missed something?
Team with buffers.Quote:With just PP, two PShifters, QR and both +Recovery uniques, I was borderline on my end burn. Maneuvers would have pushed me places I didn't want to go.
Problem solved.
In all seriousness, defensive oriented scrappers are wonderful teaming toons, they serve as extremely effective buff magnifiers. Plus, having the leadership pool for manuevers makes YOU a buffer too! Win! -
Quote:Originally Posted by Werner
I haven't done it, but I suspect it is possible. What I'm thinking is that you soft capped Dark Armor without the PvP +3% defense. So there's 3% of the 6% we're trying to make up from losing Cloak of Darkness. Yeah, it's tough to pick up another 3%, but there ARE options. For instance, drop Fitness for Hover. Figure out how to power everything with Conserve Power and Physical Perfection. Pop blues in long fights. Might not be an ideal build, but it sounds possible and playable.
CJ+Hover+Manuevers+Weave.
Works frighteningly well on a WP, and might be almost as nice on an Elec or Dark. -
Quote:Originally Posted by squishor
I like that idea but it seems almost pointless to have any blasters on a team now as a ele/sd scrapper seems to put out equal if not higher dmg than any of my blasters ever could. I am not complaing as I finally have a farmer with my ele/sd but it still makes me sad.
Uh....
Make better blasters.
Yes, a good scrap is terrifying, but a blaster is always a blaster. Sorry. The issue is that on most teams, blasters are aggro/movement limited, not damage limited. A smart blaster makes friends with every decent tank they meet. -
Quote:That's a decent approach. Adding +dam components to existing sets would be quick, easy, and popular.Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
Actually I agree with you. I'd like for +resist to be equally available as +defense through the use of sets bonuses. It would make +resist an option for maxing out a build. However, I suspect, and have read quotes from dev's that imply they agree, that the way to achieve that balance would not be by adding +resist bonuses.... it would be by reducing the +defense bonuses. Those same quotes also said they wouldn't do this because so much of the player base has already invested huge amounts of time/inf/work to building +defense toons. Removing those bonuses would be a difficult task to accomplish.
Hrmm.. Perhaps, they should try adding more +damage type powers to the other scrapper secondaries to help with balance.
Adding new sets with a resist focus would also be enormously popular, though.
Of course, the big issue right now is the runaway inflation fueled by all the AOE shields and proliferation added to the game. (sigh)
Why are Dev's so terrified of money sinks? WTF? -
Quote:Originally Posted by Sinistar6000
Hi all,
Im getting close to 28 percent smashing/lethal defense and 30% melee on my fire/fire scrap.
I will have tough and healing flames to soak up some damage, however my ranged defense (and some others) is negligible.
I know a lot of ranged attacks will have a smashing and lethal component to them so I may be safe.
Is my current defense and resist enough to make me ok in all aspects of PVE?
If not what % defense should i shoot for?
You want 45 percent in "something."
Pick either positionals (melee, range, aoe) or typed (all the rest.) Only one kind counts versus each type. IE, a melee lethal attack will take either the melee number or the lethal number, whichever is higher.
Base the choice on your secondary.
You should probably shoot for 45 percent melee and aas much as you can squeeze on the others without gimping yourself. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Mr_Enigma
Late-game and IOs allow SD to pull way, WAY ahead of SR. As Fury Flechette said, with IO's, there's nothing SR can do that SD can't.
I have a softcapped elec/shield. He is an AoE damage powerhouse, steamrolling everything in his path. Shield Charge and AAO make it possible. Just tonight I reworked his build in Mid's to give him softcapped defense AND perma-hasten. Show me an SR that can compete with that.
You see, this statement, while completely true, makes my blood boil.
BOIL I SAY.
Why are there no resist bonuses in sets? Where is the +10 percent resist all uniques? There should be at least five more sets that are resist bonus oriented. Where are they?
WHERE?
If SR could slot more resist, the brutal nerfing sliding toward shield might not be so inevitable.
Or maybe I'm just paranoid.
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Quote:MA/WP is a fantastic scrapper combo. Mine is near enough to soft capped that the near-max regen does a fine job indeed.Originally Posted by Vitality
I know I'll miss footstomp...and Rage for that matter...but I'm hoping Dragon's Tail will help me through it.
To the OP question: Screw focus. Skip it and laugh, I never take any of that junk.
It's a dumb power in the late game, one more button to clicky. The additional damage is a sop, period. Pulse damage is only useful if you're scared of your target, in which case your defenses aren't good enough. (Caveat: May be useful on teams if a squishy is about to die. Maybe.)
If you want more damage, slot more stuff, period. Recharge is the key if you want damage. On a WP, you're much better served with Focused Accuracy and frankenslotting more recharge/damage.
My two cents.
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Quote:Originally Posted by Balefire_Djinn
What are some good tank builds for just running up and down the Cim wall?
Edit: Really I should just ask what's a good build for killing/tanking groups of Cim's in general that range from +0 to +2, you get the idea.
Inv/any
WP/any
Yes, really.
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Huh.
That's a helluva good guide.
It's refreshing to see somebody call it like it is.
Dammit, now I want to try one of these out of sheer cussedness.... -
Quote:Important caveat:Originally Posted by Werner
Wearing the gold for top DPS is Dark Melee/Shield Defense, with Fire Melee/Shield Defense holding the silver medal after the judges reviewed the photo finish.
Single target DPS only. In more general play, fire runs away and hides from DM, and spines/claws are right there with fire.
DM is a pickaxe, essential for certain jobs.
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BS/Elec, on paper, has a very potent synergy in that Elec is a nearly pure 'resist' set with a mild auto-heal/end discount added in.
BS gives access to a potent +Def power, in Parry.
So, the min-max route for a BS/Elec would be: Mild to moderate global recharge, slot heavily for +def and +hp, and take both +End powers. Add in as many of the +End, +Def, and +Regen uniques as you can manage.
For attacks, BS will do well with anything, so roll what you want. I'd recommend one recharge, one acc, one or two end reducers, and two or three damage in your main attacks. If you have trouble hitting, slot your least damaging attack with less damage and more acc and use it as a can opener.
Slot Parry for as much +recharge and +acc as you can cram in and spam it when you need it, otherwise let your global nested defenses ride you through. (Note: End may be an issue early on, but isn't always? )
Important: Recall that BS is one of the strongest debuff sets available to a scrapper and capitalize on it. Teams will love you if you do. They may not know WHY things melt so easy when you're around, but they'll surely notice.
There's my two cents, for what it's worth.
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Quote:All very true. This is one of the secret strengths of BS/Kat: The Defense is against Melee and lethal (assuming I'm reading it right.)Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
As you said, many FCEN have lethal components. And the ones that do not are mostly ranged attacks... Also most psi attacks are ranged as well.
That's a common positional and a common typed, and a LOT of ranged/AOE attacks have lethal components. If you make the attack miss, the whole attack misses.
(Another secret strength of BS is the fact that it's a potent debuffer. Who needs rads?)
Quote:Again, this may not be possible on a resistance scrapper. /Dark or /invul might be able to pull it off.
You can, but the builds look a little...odd. Not bad. Just odd.
HERESY!Quote:You might have to take hover and combat jumping both. Personally, I hate hovering with a scrapper.
I personally LOVE my hoverscrap. It completely changes the playstyle of the game to run a hovering meleer, and you get all sorts of cool animations, not to mention that people stare in amazement. I just wish it wasn't an SR, I find even softcapped super reflexes to be way too delicate for me.
But the manueverability of a fast hoverscrap has to be seen to be believed. It is astonishing how much easier many maps are that way. -
Quote:...or you play like you have a brain and hop out of the aggro knot (yay CJ) and kite until the cascade fades.Originally Posted by Santorican
But...if you get rid of Grant Cover you'll lose DDR and not having 95% DDR leads to horrible casading defense failure and then you die.
I do this sort of thing against the Cimmy's all the time on my WP toons. Invuln actually has enough DDR (and hit points) that I usually solve cascade failures via a pile of 'dead' bad guys.
Designing for edge conditions can get you strange things, and capping all defenses is a worthy goal. The last few percents counts the most.
Of course, the toon would be godlike either way, to be honest. I just like the idea of rock-solid, destroy all in path, badass toons without a single purple. The current bidding frenzy on purples is frankly ridiculous, they simply aren't worth it.