TopDoc

Silver is for Suckers

[ QUOTE ]
Set up a tranfer bid on WW/BM.
...
It is risky to do but if you have good control over the BM you shouldnt have a problem, I do it with heroes to villains and villains to villains. I havent had a "mishap" in a year and a half but it can happen


[/ QUOTE ]
You're mixing some bad ideas with something that's impossible.

You can transfer from hero to hero via Wentworths, or from villain to villain via the Black Market. But the Black Market and Wentworths are not connected, so you can never transfer between heroes and villains. There is a single Black Market server that handles all villain transactions on all servers, even the European ones, so you can arrange transfers between villains on different servers. And there is a single and separate Wentworths that handles all Hero transactions in the same way. But they aren't connected, so items listed at Wentworths will never show up on the Black Market, and vice versa.

The bad ideas are to use Inspirations and price them high. There's an article on Paragonwiki that explains a MUCH safer method of transferring Inf between chars. You pick something with a VERY low transaction rate, like a level 41 Mutation Intangibility DO with 1 for sale. Buy it on the char you want Inf, then relist it for 1 Inf. Swap to your banker, make sure there is still only 1 for sale, and buy it for however much you want to transfer (plus 10% to take into account the transaction fee). There is virtually no chance that anyone will offer another for sale, ever. But if they do and they list it for more than 1, your banker will buy the one your other char listed as it is priced lower.

Well, in that case, here are my keepers from some recent farming. Don't ask me what else I got, or how many thousands of Bronze rolls, I was clicking and deleting pretty fast. This was all redside, so I wonder how much it's worth. More importantly, I wonder how much it'll be worth next month. It's all level 14 stuff, which should be better than higher level ones. Then again, people are stupid.

Uncommon
85 Steadfast Protection: KB Protection
72 Steadfast Protection: Res/Def
93 Karma: KB Protection

Rare
15 Basilisk's Gaze: Acc/Rech
12 Basilisk's Gaze: Acc/Hold
12 Blessing of the Zephyr: Run, Jump, Fly, Range
24 Impervious Skin: Status Resistance
22 Kismet: Accuracy
20 Regenerative Tissue: Regeneration

I've offered him a good deal on one via PM, though I'll specify here that it must be for personal use. So he should be taken care of.

I did a little testing on PvP IO drops and found some behavior that I think is slightly broken. This was all testing in the Arena, so it may work differently in zones. Recipes always drop at the level of the target. Under the right conditions, they appear to drop around 1-2% of the time. If you aren't seeing that, read on.

1) I believe you can only get a PvP IO from a char close to or above your level. I got about 1500 kills by a level 50 on level 33 and level 10 targets, but no recipes. A level 12 char did get a recipe from a level 10 char, and a level 33 char did get a recipe from a level 50 char. I'm guessing it's the same cutoff as normal recipes, so you won't get one from a char 3 levels or more below you. Due to my sample size, I'm fairly certain this is true.

2) The 10 minute timer may start even if you don't get a recipe due to the reason above. I had about 1000 kills where a level 50 char was defeating a level 50 and 2 level 10 targets. The level 10 chars were defeated 2 to 3 times as often as the 50. I got a single recipe from the 50. I suspect the reward code path checks to see if I should get a PvP IO, starts the timer if yes, then checks to determine the level of the IO. In my 1000 kills I may have gotten 10 recipes that were denied due to level, but 100 minutes of "No recipe for joo!" that prevented me from getting anything from the level 50 defeats. I'm less certain about this due to the very small sample size of level 50 defeats.

Both of these may explain the low number of recipes people have reported. If observation 1 above applies to zones, I'd say it's a bug. Everyone is set to the same level. Granted there will still be significant differences due to the number of slots, the intent is that most everyone is around the same power level. Observation 2 could cause big problems in zone PvP if true. If you take a 50 to Siren's Call, there may be very few targets that can possibly drop a recipe for you. And there may be a lot of targets who can PREVENT you from getting a recipe for 10 minutes!

So can anyone confirm or deny these in zone PvP? Has anyone on a level 50 earned a PvP recipe below 48?

Let's see if I got this right. The box costs $19.99. With that I get a free month (valued at around $15), plus a Booster Pack which effectively costs $5. Or I could spend about $10 for a Booster. Hmm.

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks. You never received more than one purple in a run?

[/ QUOTE ]

Incorrect. There's a ** in my second set of data, 10 runs reported on 3/19.

[ QUOTE ]
...it looks like you were able to earn 1 purple every ~56 minutes...

Just to clarify how the information is presented:

Does - IOs '30/1/0*' mean that you received 30 common, 1 uncommon, 0 rare, and 1 purple?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's about one purple every 48 minutes if you take into account my second set of runs. But note that's just pure farming time, and doesn't take into account the time it takes to craft the keepers and sell stuff between runs.

And yes you have it right. The * means a purple drop.

[ QUOTE ]
this kinda makes me mad, i came back to the game in Nov and since ive been back i farm ALOT, i also run at least 3 SF a day, with all of that i have only gotten ONE purple since last november. so there is definatly some thing screwy with the whole system.

[/ QUOTE ]

I assume you know that you can only get purples off mobs that can drop level 50 rewards. So doing the Cap Au SF for example will never get you a purple. That leaves the ITF, LGTF, RSF, and last treespec.

Figure out how many mobs you defeat, and that'll give you an idea where you stand. Do you speed run the ITF? If so, that's about 500 mobs, divided by 8 people, so your share is about 60 mobs worth of drops. What about the LGTF? Do you stealth to Penny and Vet recall back? Do you kill the chatterboxes and fail that mish? Do you have Hami defeat most of the Rikti? Do you skip all but the Riders? You can complete that one and defeat probably 200 mobs. Your share is 25. LRSF? Another 200 or so, so you get 25. The last treespec is under 100 mobs that generate drops (the vines don't), so 12 more for you. The faster you get at running SFs, the fewer mobs you kill, so the fewer purples you get.

Farming depends on your speed and the number of people in the mission. I defeat nearly 30 mobs a minute and I do it solo. If you farm at the same speed but do it in a team of 6, you'll get 1/6 of the drops.

Of course there may well be something wrong with the drop system. Unfortunately, just claiming that something is wrong will accomplish nothing. My results were for solo farming. You would have to keep track of your teaming situation (how many people, level, SK or not, position in team list, etc.) and get a decent sample size worth of data to get the Devs to pay attention.

Time for some more numbers. I did another 10 runs. Cumulative numbers are at the bottom.

<font class="small">Code:[/color]<hr /><pre> Defeat Enh. Salv. Common Extra Total
Run Mobs Inf Enh Inf Salvage Inf IOs Inf Inf Inf
3/15#1 673 4,235 12 162 62/10/3 5,925 23/2/1 2,360 20,721 33,403
3/15#2 675 4,310 8 112 41/10/0 20 20/2/1** 1,753 105,521 111,716
3/16#1 680 4,260 10 140 45/9/3 4,170 26/1/0* 2,426 92,907 103,903
3/16#2 651 4,134 3 40 46/12/2 53 19/8/1 1,785 22,969 28,981
3/17#1 664 4,332 8 106 50/15/3 1,233 13/7/1 1,296 13,562 20,529
3/17#2 660 4,320 3 39 38/14/2 3,424 17/4/2 1,543 38,551 47,877
3/17#3 677 4,431 8 100 41/14/2 1,569 18/4/0 1,807 1,534 9,441
3/18#1 673 4,296 5 63 35/16/1 1,225 13/8/2* 1,163 60,479 67,226
3/18#2 675 4,312 7 94 47/11/1 73 27/5/0* 2,567 6,201 13,247
3/18#3 689 4,355 4 57 53/13/1 32 17/4/0* 1,699 29,444 35,587

1,264/ 489/
Cumulative (27 runs) 306/ 100/
Tot 18,116 116229 189 2,486 57 55,052 21 47,721 776,063 995,688
Avg 671 4,305 7 92 47/11/2 2,039 18/4/1 1,767 28,743 36,877

Total Inf from Purples: 515,776
Total Inf from all other sources: 479,912

</pre><hr />

What does this say? Mobs, Salvage, and Enhancements were pretty consistent. I got a few more recipes, just enough to bump the average. The Purple Recipe drop rate increased to 1 per 1394 mobs. The actual rate is probably between 1000 and 2000 mobs, but it would take someone with statistics knowledge to say anything definite. And they'd probably just laugh at my small sample size and walk away. The income from purples still beats the income from everything else combined.


Recipes, (C)=Costume, (R)=Rare, (P)=Purple

Run 3/16#1

(C) Costume Piece: Piston Boots (10k)
Multi-Strike: Dam/End (1,007k profit)
Multi-Strike: Dam/Rech (1,507k profit)
(R) Numina: End/Heal (18,197k profit)

Run 3/16#2

(P) Armageddon: Dam (78M profit)
Detonation: Dam/Acc/End (1,507k profit)
(R) Devastation: Acc/Dam/End/Rech (10,507k profit)
(P) Grav Anchor: Immob/End (15M profit)
Kinetic Crash: KB/Dam (507k profit)

Run 3/16 #1
(P) Armageddon: Proc (92.4M profit)
Multi-Strike: Dam/End/Rech (507k profit)

Run 3/16 #2
2*Blood Mandate: Accuracy (2*507k profit)
Efficacy Adapter: Rech/Acc (3,507k profit)
Essence of Curare: Acc/End (507k profit)
Extreme Measures: Dam/Int/Rech (507k Inf)
(R) Gaussian's: To Hit Buff/Rech (13,907k profit)
Nightmare: Acc/Fear (vendor 10k)
Red Fortune: End (3,507k profit)
Rope-a-dope: Acc/End (vendor 10k)

Run 3/17 #1
Detonation: Dam/Range (507k profit)
Lethargic Repose: Acc/Sleep/Rech (vendor 10k)
(R) Mako's Bite: Acc/Dam (8,507k profit)
Mocking Beratement: Taunt (1,007k profit)
Multi-Strike: Acc/End (2,007k profit)
Nightmare: End/Fear (vendor 10k)
Soaring: Fly (1,007k profit)
Tempered Readiness: Dam/Slow (507k profit)

Run 3/17 #2

Adjusted Targeting: To Hit (4,507k profit)
(R) Aegis: End/Res (12,507k profit)
Air-Burst: Dam/Range (vendor 10k)
Jaunt: Range/End (vendor 10k)
(R) Obliteration: Dam (21,507k profit)
Perplex: Acc/End (vendor 10k)

Run 3/17 #3
Dampened Spirits: Rech/End (507k profit)
Enfeebled Operation: Acc/Immob (1,007k profit)
Exploit Weakness: Dam/Range (vendor 10k)
Soaring: Fly/End (vendor 10k)

Run 3/18 #1
(P) Absolute Amazement: Stun (23M profit)
Adjusted Targeting: To Hit/End (3,507k profit)
Blood Mandate: Damage (507k profit)
Essence of Curare: Acc/Hold/Rech (vendor 10k)
(R) Numina: Heal (19,407k profit)
Red Fortune: Def/End (6,507k profit)
Soaring: Fly/End (vendor 10k)
(R) Sovereign Right: Acc/Dam (vendor 10k)
Tempered Readiness: Dam/Slow (507k profit)
Thunderstrike: Dam/End (4,507k profit)
Thunderstrike: Dam/Rech (2,507k profit)

Run 3/18 #2
(P) Coercive Persuasion: Confuse (recipe 3M)
(C) Costume Piece: Bone wings (recipe 10k)
(C) Costume Piece: Rocket Boots (recipe 150k)
Enfeebled Operation: Immob/Range (1,507k profit)
Essence of Curare: Hold/Range (507k profit)
Kinetic Crash: KB/Acc (1,007k profit)
Rope-a-dope: End/Stun (vendor 10k)
Undermined Defenses: Rech/End (vendor 10k)

Run 3/18 #3
(P) Absolutement Amazement: Stun (23,160k profit)
(C) Costume Piece: Rocket Boots (250k recipe)
Dampened Spirits: To Hit/End (vendor 10k)
Enfeebled Operation: Immob/Range (1,507k profit)
Rope-a-dope: Acc/End (vendor 10k)
Thunderstrike: Dam/End (4,507k profit)

[ QUOTE ]
Additionally, I may - if I get to the point you're at where I can just hop along and pwn - up my toon count to eight and not bother killing the bosses. Just run, seeds / roots / DL / SD, ditch mobs, repeat.

[/ QUOTE ]

That does sound like a much safer way to farm drops. You can get the cycle time of Seeds down to about 16 seconds with silly recharge, so it would be faster as well. Spawn the mission for 8 so you get 2 bosses per spawn. Hit mobs with Seeds and a couple AoEs (including Roots to keep everyone in place and PSW so you still do a significant amount of damage to them), then run to the next spawn. The bosses will toss AoEs and fry the rest of the spawn for you, and you collect the drops.

NERF PLANT DOMS!!! THEY'RE OVERPOWERED!!!

My time is too valuable to me to waste it PLing other people for Inf, so I don't really need to worry about how much I would charge. That was more a mental exercise. But I am honestly interested in determining a reasonable number, just for grins. So I can laugh every time I head through PI on Freedom and hear the broadcasts of lowbies willing to pay for PLs. Common sense indicates that bringing a SK into a farm mission will cut the total Inf of an otherwise solo farmer roughly in half, as the SK will get half of the drops. Common sense may be wrong due to bugs, but I'll keep that assumption for now. And if my average Inf earning is based on 17 runs with a fairly large mix of both good salvage and recipes, I'd say that's a pretty good basis for comparison.

If anyone could shed some light on the statistics involved in small sample sizes, that would be appreciated. I only got 7 purples, but that's certainly more statistically significant than if I had only gotten 1 or 2. I got a mix of good and bad ones, so I don't think that aspect is skewed in any way. But that's why I asked if anyone knew the average value of a purple on my OP, as I'd rather use the average of all purples rather than the average of the small sample that dropped for me. I'm guessing that all purples drop with the same chance. And I'm guessing there are people in this forum who track the value of all purples.

How many more purples do I need to find to give my final average some sort of statistical significance? I'm looking for something like the following (completely made up): After 20 purple drops, it is 70% likely that the real drop rate is within 10% of the observed drop rate.

I seem to recall that Lts drop Salvage twice as often as Minions, and bosses are either 3 or 4 times as much as Minions. If that's the case, then it puts the average number of Minion equivalents at around 887. That's 6 bosses at 4 minions each, 198 Lts at 2 minions each, and 467 real minions. Maybe that applies to all drops. As a result, it looks like Enhancements drop about 0.8% of the time per minion, Salvage about 6.7% of the time, and recipes about 2.4% of the time. Has anyone else come up with percentages like those?

And what about the relative distribution of Common/Uncommon/Rare items? It looks like it may be somewhere around 20/4/1 or so.

Am I even counting right? I count Temp Power recipes as Rare Pool A recipes, but are they? Are costumes really a separate pool? Are purples also a separate pool, or just a subpool of Pool A? What about Respec Recipes? We could find out if someone got 2 recipes from a single mob, but that would be a pretty rare event. Does it even matter?

I'm asking because I think the Devs have on very rare occasion mentioned some of these numbers, and other people have likely charted drop rates. The more information I can put together, the closer I can get to figuring out the average worth of defeating a mob. Then I can weigh that against Mission Architect rewards. People with the brains to read this forum will them be able to make an intelligent decision as to what sort of content they should run to maximize their rewards, in the same way that they consult Dr. Robert's charts to see what recipe, TF, or Trial roll provides the highest Merit/Inf value.

Yep, here's the planned build for my current farming Dom. I named her Slow Farmer. She clears the Liberate TV mission in about 23 minutes. I dropped Mu Mastery and the Mu Guardian for Soul Drain. The Imps get Expedient Reinforcement even though it's bugged, mainly for the set bonus. Once it's fixed, I suspect they'll do well enough to keep around. And if the Recharge really does affect them, then I'll be putting that set into every pet I have. I shuffled a few other things around.

I have Hot Feet frankenslotted for Damage, END, and Slow. The extra 5% from an Obliteration set wouldn't add much to my silly Recharge bonus, and I'd have to lose the almost capped Slow versus +2 mobs.

Note that this isn't her actual build. I had a full Decimation set and several Ragnaroks sitting around, so Char and Dark Obliteration got those. I don't have the Ribo or Steadfast Protection: Red/Def yet. But she still does just fine.

As to your build, let me make some suggestions. You'll usually want to skip the Dam/Rech or equivalent in the purple sets. Especially for the single target ones like Psi Dart (if you ever use it) and Mind Cages (which you probably will), you want all the Acc you can get in order to hit the bosses through stacked Vengeance. Soul Drain lasts for a bit under 2 spawns, and it's hard to hit a Fake Nemesis in that second spawn after Soul Drain goes down.

I originally had Assault but switched to Tactics. Between frequently double stacked Domination, Soul Drain, and chomping the Inspirations I get each spawn, I can hit the damage cap frequently without even slotting damage. Due to Expedient Reinforcement being bugged, my Imps need help to hit +2 mobs, especially when Vengeance starts stacking. So for now, I have Tactics.

You can skimp on little bit on Damage Resistance, but not too much. Stacked Vengeance means mobs will hit you easily and harder than normal, and there are a couple places each run where you may find spawns standing close to each other.

I went with Dark Obliteration over Summon Seer. The Seer may be the better choice when Expedient Reinforcement gets fixed. With sufficient slotting plus Tactics, she may be able to take down the last Lt in a spawn. But for now, Dark Oblit is a 95% chance to do 104 damage (capped) to most of the mobs in a spawn, including whichever one happens to be last.

Da_Captain, as to the Recharge IO in PSW, it's because it lets me take down spawns faster. It usually takes 3 PSWs to put down a spawn. That Recharge IO cuts a quarter second off each cycle. That's a half second per spawn. It may not seem like much, but it's a bargain for a single slot.

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/

[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]

Slow Farmer: Level 50 Science Dominator
Primary Power Set: Fire Control
Secondary Power Set: Psionic Assault
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Char -- Apoc-Dmg:50(A), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(3), Apoc-Acc/Rchg:50(3), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx:50(5), Apoc-Dam%:50(5)
Level 1: Psionic Dart -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Fire Cages -- Posi-Acc/Dmg:50(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx:50(9), Posi-Dmg/Rchg:50(27), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(27), Posi-Dam%:50(29), TotHntr-Dam%:50(29)
Level 4: Mind Probe -- Hectmb-Dmg:50(A), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(7), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg:50(7), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx:50(9), Hectmb-Dam%:50(19)
Level 6: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(17)
Level 8: Hot Feet -- Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx:50(A), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx:50(11), TmpRdns-Dmg/Slow:50(11), C'ngBlow-Dmg/EndRdx:50(17), Slow-I:50(19)
Level 10: Stealth -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:25(A)
Level 12: Flashfire -- Amaze-Stun:50(A), Amaze-Stun/Rchg:50(13), Amaze-Acc/Stun/Rchg:50(13), Amaze-Acc/Rchg:50(15), Amaze-EndRdx/Stun:50(15)
Level 14: Super Speed -- Zephyr-Travel:50(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx:50(23), Zephyr-ResKB:50(37)
Level 16: Grant Invisibility -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:25(A)
Level 18: Maneuvers -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx:50(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg:50(25), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(34), RedFtn-Def:50(43), RedFtn-EndRdx:50(43), LkGmblr-Rchg+:25(46)
Level 20: Drain Psyche -- Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx:50(A), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg:50(21), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:50(21), Dct'dW-Heal:50(25), Dct'dW-Rchg:50(50)
Level 22: Cinders -- UbrkCons-Hold:50(A), UbrkCons-Acc/Hold/Rchg:50(23), UbrkCons-Acc/Rchg:50(31), UbrkCons-EndRdx/Hold:50(31), UbrkCons-Dam%:50(31)
Level 24: Assault -- EndRdx-I:50(A)
Level 26: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 28: Tough -- Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx:50(A), Aegis-ResDam:50(42), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(43)
Level 30: Weave -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx:50(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg:50(33), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(34), RedFtn-Def:50(37), RedFtn-EndRdx:50(37), LkGmblr-Rchg+:25(40)
Level 32: Fire Imps -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg:50(A), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx:50(33), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(33), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg:50(34), S'bndAl-Build%:50(50)
Level 35: Psionic Lance -- Mantic-Acc/Dmg:50(A), Mantic-Dmg/EndRdx:50(36), Mantic-Acc/ActRdx/Rng:50(36), Mantic-Dmg/ActRdx/Rchg:50(36), Mantic-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(46)
Level 38: Psychic Shockwave -- Armgdn-Dmg:50(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(39), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg:50(39), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx:50(39), Armgdn-Dam%:50(40), RechRdx-I:50(40)
Level 41: Dark Embrace -- HO:Ribo(A), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx:50(42), Aegis-ResDam:50(42)
Level 44: Dark Obliteration -- Posi-Acc/Dmg:50(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), Posi-Dmg/Rchg:50(45), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), Posi-Dam%:50(46)
Level 47: Soul Drain -- AdjTgt-ToHit:50(A), AdjTgt-ToHit/Rchg:50(48), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg:50(48), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx:50(48), AdjTgt-Rchg:50(50)
Level 49: Vengeance -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:25(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I:50(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Domination
------------
[u]Set Bonus Totals:[u]<ul type="square">[*]16% DamageBuff(Smashing)[*]16% DamageBuff(Lethal)[*]16% DamageBuff(Fire)[*]16% DamageBuff(Cold)[*]16% DamageBuff(Energy)[*]16% DamageBuff(Negative)[*]16% DamageBuff(Toxic)[*]16% DamageBuff(Psionic)[*]3% Defense(Smashing)[*]3% Defense(Lethal)[*]4.56% Defense(Fire)[*]4.56% Defense(Cold)[*]5.5% Defense(Energy)[*]5.5% Defense(Negative)[*]3% Defense(Psionic)[*]3% Defense(Melee)[*]8% Defense(Ranged)[*]6.13% Defense(AoE)[*]133.8% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*]4% Enhancement(Heal)[*]87% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*]30.5 HP (3%) HitPoints[*]Knockback (Mag -4)[*]Knockup (Mag -4)[*]MezResist(Confused) 2.5%[*]MezResist(Held) 2.5%[*]MezResist(Immobilize) 6.9%[*]MezResist(Sleep) 2.5%[*]MezResist(Stun) 2.5%[*]MezResist(Terrorized) 4.7%[*]21% (0.35 End/sec) Recovery[*]28% (1.19 HP/sec) Regeneration[*]17% Resistance(Fire)[*]17% Resistance(Cold)[*]1.26% Resistance(Energy)[*]1.26% Resistance(Negative)[*]10% RunSpeed[/list]


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[ QUOTE ]
I've necro'd your Fire / Psi build.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh? Oh, nm, I see you posted in the old thread on my Dom's build.

[ QUOTE ]
Soon, I shall have a plant / psi to attempt to compete with it. Not on damage, oh no. On clear time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmm, I could see why you'd want to do that. The 4.2M/run in defeats is relatively small compared to the total take. If you can clear significantly faster, you'll do better than me on total Inf earned.

There are nearly 70 spawns on the map, and I defeat them in under 20 seconds on average (including travel time). I just run in and start attacking with PSW, Drain Psyche, Soul Drain, Dark Oblit, and Fire Cages. That's because I can't waste time casting Flashfires, much less wait for it to recharge for each spawn given that it cycles in about 25 seconds. But with enough Recharge you could use Seeds on every spawn (cycles in around 17 at high recharge), and it takes less time to cast.

But as soon as you start using PSW, the mobs will get stunned. I believe it has 2 separate 25% chances to stun. You'll need to rely on their own alpha strike doing significant damage to them, but not so much that it kills them. Then you finish them off and collect the drops.

While purples are expensive, you've got a few things going for you. You can use the purple Sleep and Confuse sets, which are dirt cheap. And once you start farming, you'll make enough Inf to buy everything else. Do be sure to post your results.

In a team of 6, double the Inf due to the team XP multiplier. That brings the total Inf up to 35,118. Divide by 6. A level 50 char would earn 5,853 Inf per run on average. It seems appropriate to charge 6M per person if there are 6. At the other extreme, if it's just the Dom and a single SK, the total rewards is a bit over 32M. That means it would be appropriate to charge 16M per run. Yes that's a silly high price, but it's based on the chance the the SK gets a nice purple drop once in a while. STATISTICS DON'T LIE!

A slightly lower level char will earn more Inf due to the level modifier, but less Inf because you don't earn as much at lower levels. I'm not sure which factor is larger.

A lowbie being sidekicked won't earn nearly as much from defeats, and their miniscule Enhancement income will be even lower. But the salvage and recipe drops will be the same, and that's the lion's share of the rewards.

From now on, every time I go to PI and hear lowbies offering 1-2M to get PL'd, I'm going to laugh. That's like stealing Inf from farmers! Hey, that's an interesting angle. If you hate PLing farmers, pay them 1-2M to PL you. You can laugh all the way to the bank!

Now time for the analysis...

My purple drop rate was 1 per 1628 mobs.

You make more on average from purple drops than from EVERYTHING ELSE.

I can make on average over 60M/hour farming.

Of course that's HIGHLY dependent on purple drops.

The Inf from Enhancement drops is almost worthless.

If you sell spots on a farm, charge appropriately.

You can make Inf by buying your way into farms for a couple million and selling the drops.

Can anyone provide an average price for purples?

What else?

The following is a listing of the rewards I've gotten farming the "Liberate TV" mission redside using my Fire/Psi Dominator. I run this via Flashback spawned for 6 on Relentless, so I get level 52 mobs. SG mode was off. Each run took about 23 minutes of actual fighting, then extra time to zone, sell, check stats, etc.

Regular spawns were 8 minions and 3 Lts or 6 and 3, so probably an average of 7 and 3. There were 4 spawns containing a Fake Nemesis (which I always defeated). And there were 4 spawns containing a random boss, and I defeated the boss when it was a Fake Nemesis (I assume 50% of the time). I counted the number of mobs and defeat Inf using Hero Stats.

The table below shows the values for 17 runs. It shows the vendor or fair market value for my drops at the time they dropped, NOT including any 10% marketing fee. Salvage and IOs are listed as Common/Uncommon/Rare. I do not include Costume Recipes or Purples in the #/#/# because I think they come from different pools. But I put a * by the recipes for a purple drop. "Common Inf" is the Infamy gained from vendoring the Common IO recipes. "Extra Inf" is from selling the Uncommons, Rares, purples, costumes, etc. ALL Inf values are in thousands (k).

This thread is for making observations about these numbers. And there is a LOT of useful info here.


<font class="small">Code:[/color]<hr /><pre>
Defeat Enh. Salv. Common Extra Total
Run Mobs Inf Enh Inf Salvage Inf IOs Inf Inf Inf
3/2#1 664 4,273 4 56 54/9/2 1,490 12/3/0* 1,184 107,507 114,510
3/2#2 680 4,375 9 104 52/11/2 4,891 19/4/1 1,764 4,025 13,395
3/2#3 669 4,208 9 109 33/13/3 5,981 13/6/0 1,198 1,526 12,923
3/3#1 656 4,240 7 85 47/9/1 220 24/5/2 2,504 16,027 23,076
3/3#2 673 4,355 7 89 59/5/1 1,770 20/3/1* 2,025 88,614 96,853
3/3#3 663 4,263 5 75 41/11/4 185 13/2/0 1,269 6,014 11,806
3/3#4 664 4,378 5 73 38/8/3 1,451 14/1/0* 1,404 6,507 13,813
3/4#1 663 4,271 10 137 45/13/3 3,823 13/2/0 1,178 512 9,921
3/4#2 677 4,297 5 66 57/14/1 59 13/6/0 1,349 15,095 20,866
3/4#3 674 4,362 9 109 45/8/3 144 19/3/1* 2,043 3,026 9,684
3/4#4 673 4,311 6 79 48/7/7 9,050 17/4/2* 1,736 39,640 54,816
3/4#5 676 4,369 6 77 52/8/2 2,120 14/2/0 1,310 1,512 9,388
3/5#1 654 4,223 8 106 42/8/3 3,318 25/3/0* 2,388 3,317 13,352
3/5#2 694 4,429 6 83 46/8/0 18 30/1/0* 3,045 62,005 69,580
3/6#1 663 4,311 7 92 50/19/1 1,142 11/4/2 1,045 17,532 24,122
3/6#2 682 4,333 10 129 57/14/2 139 22/1/2 2,196 2,272 9,069
3/6#3 674 4,246 8 104 40/17/1 1,527 17/5/2 1,684 9,043 16,604

806/182 296/55
Tot 11,399 73,244 121 1,573 /39 37,328 /13 29,322 384,174 523,778
Avg 671 4,308 7 93 47/11/2 2,196 17/3/1 1,725 22,598 30,810

Total Inf just from purple IOs: 281,216
Total Inf from all other sources: 244,561
</pre><hr />


Recipes, (C)=Costume, (R)=Rare, (P)=Purple

Run 3/2 #1
Cleaving Blow: Acc/Rech (1,475k profit)
(C)Costume Piece: Cheribuc Wings (vendor)
Crushing Impact: Acc/Dam/End (7,108k profit)
Detonation: Dam/Acc/End (508k profit)
(P)Hecatomb: Rech/Acc (98,416k profit)

Run 3/2 #2
Calibrated Accuracy: Acc/Range (vendor 5k)
Efficacy Adapter: End Mod/Rech/Acc (1,507k profit)
(R)Temp Power: Revolver (vendor 1k)
Touch of Lady Grey: Defense Debuff (2,507 profit)
Undermined Defenses: Defense Debuff (vendor 5k)

Run 3/2 #3
Blood Mandate: Acc/Dam/End (507k profit)
Calibrated Accuracy: Acc/Dam (Vendor 5k)
Enfeebled Operation: Acc/Immob/Rech (507k profit)
Nightmare Acc/Fear/Rech (vendor 5k)
Perplex: Confuse/Rech (vendor 5k)
Titanium Coating: End/Rech (507k profit)

Run 3/3 #1
(R)Call of the Sandman: End/Sleep (vendor 5k)
Dampened Spirits: ToHit/Rech/End (507k profit)
Essence of Curare: Hold/Range (vendor 5k)
(R)Expedient Reinforcement: Acc/Dam (7M profit)
Exploit Weakness: Acc/Dam (vendor 5k)
Red Fortune: Def/End (8.5M profit)
Rope-a-dope: Stun/Range (vendor 5k)

Run 3/3 #2
(P)Armageddon: Change for Fire Dam (87M profit)
Detonation: Dam/Range (507k profit)
(R)Executioner's Contract: Dam/End (vendor 5k)
Lethargic Repose: Acc/Rech (vendor 5k)
Perfect Zinger: Taunt (1,097k profit)

Run 3/3 #3
Mocking Beratement: Taunt/Rech/Range (507k profit)
Red Fortune: End (5,507 profit)

Run 3/3 #4
Crushing Impact: Dam/Rech (4,507k profit)
(P)Fortunata Hypnosis: Sleep/Rech (2M recipe)

Run 3/4 #1
Air-Burst: Acc/Dam (507k profit)
Lethargic Repose: Acc/Rech (vendor 5k)

Tun 3/4 #2
Enfeebled Operation: Acc/Immob/Rech (507k profit)
Enfeebled Operation: Immob/Range (1507k profit)
Lethargic Repose: End/Sleep (Vendor 5k)
Mocking Beratement: Taunt (1,507k profit)
Red Fortune: Defense (6,062k profit)
Thunderstrike: Acc/Dam (5,507k profit)

Run 3/4 #3
(R)Dark Watcher's Despair: Proc (1,007 profit)
Detonation: Dam/Range (507k profit)
Doctored Wounds: End/Rech (507k profit)
(P)Fortunata Hypnosis: Sleep/Rech/Acc (1M recipe)
Lethargic Repose: Acc/Sleep/Rech (vendor 5k)

Run 3/4 #4
Adjusted Targeting: To Hit (3,507k profit)
Dark Watcher's Despair: ToHit Debuff (vendor 5k)
(R)Force Feedback: Chance for +Rech (1,607k profit)
(P)Hecatomb: Proc (30,300 profit)
Mocking Beratement: Taunt/Rech/Range (507k profit)
Titanium Coating: Rech/Res (2,007 profit)
(R)Trap of the Hunter: End/Immob (1,707k profit)

Run 3/4 #5
Extreme Measures: Dam/Int/Rech (Vendor 5k)
Multi-Strike: Dam/Rech (1,507k profit)

Run 3/5 #1
(P)Fortunata Hypnosis: Sleep/End (500k recipe)
Soaring: End (vendor 5k)
Touch of Lady Grey: Def Debuff (2,807 profit)
Undermined Defenses: Rech/End (vendor 5k)

Run 3/5 #2
(P)Apocalypse: Proc (62M profit)
Nightmare: Acc/Fear/Rech (vendor 5k)

Run 3/6 #1
Cleaving Blow: Dam/Rech (vendor 5k)
Crushing Impact: Acc/Dam (6,507k profit)
(R)Gaussian: To Hit/Rech (8,507k profit)
Nightmare: Acc/Fear (vendor 5k)
(R)Temp Power: St. Louis Slammer (vendor 1k)
Titanium Coating: End/Rech/Res (2,507k profit)

Run 3/6 #2
Costume Piece: Tech Wings (10k profit)
Lethargic Repose: End/Sleep (vendor 5k)
(R)Lockdown: Acc/Hold (200k recipe)
(R)Time &amp; Space: End (2,157k profit)

Run 3/6 #3
Calibrated Accuracy: Acc/Int (vendor 5k)
Crushing Impact: Acc/Dam (6,507k profit)
Essence of Curare: Acc/End (507k profit)
(R)Mocking Beratement: Rech (1507k profit)
Perfect Zinger: Proc (vendor 5k)
Rope-a-dope: Acc/Rech (vendor 5k)
Thunderstrike: Dam/End (507k profit)

[ QUOTE ]
(I exclude GMs since it takes an INSANELY tweaked-out build to solo those these days).

[/ QUOTE ]

I solod most every GM in the game about a month ago with my Ill/Rad (including Lusca), and I'm not insane. My PA all say I'm completely normal. Though I must admit, my Phantasm is taking a "wait and see" approach. Of course I mentioned I could dismiss them all with a click of the mouse, but I don't think that affected their judgment in the least.

As others have pointed out, this is a good baseline. But I personally prefer a more holostic approach. An Illusion Troller isn't going to use Spectral Wounds (SW), Blind, then twiddle his thumbs for several second waiting for them to recharge. Fighting a hard target reduces the value of the extra damage then heal of SW. PA has the same issue that other pets do in melee, in that it sometimes just draws a sword and uses only that till it disappears. The Defense debuffs in Earth won't make a difference if someone is slotted to hit 95% of the time, or uses some other Defense debuff. Nothing should beat a well slotted level 32+ Fire Controller, given it has attacks with the highest Damage Per Second of Animation (DPSA), Imps, and Hot Feet on the side. The attack chain is dependent on Hasten just as much as AM, Siphon Speed, and IO set bonuses. Mobs in an open area may get knocked around, reducing damage from pets and location based AoEs. There are just too many variables to deal with.

Obviously it's completely unreasonable to ask you to test every combination of primary and secondary, with different build options (Hasten or not, SOs up to purple IO sets) at different level ranges. But maybe it would be worthwhile to have some sort of friendly competition to get input from the player base. Set some basic rules (no external buffs or temp powers, pets pre-summoned, fight a +1 boss solo), require full disclosure (slotting, boss resistance), and see what sort of results you get. If enough people report results, we can get a better idea of how the different primaries compare in real game situations. (The Devs call this data mining.)

Gloom should replace Swipe in the attack chain most of the time. In fact I think I'm gonna shuffle the powers in my tray to do just that. Gloom has a higher DPSA than Swipe, in fact it's about equal to Strike. And it's got a purple proc. The only real problem with it is the somewhat high END cost. Gloom has about a 50% lower DPE (Damage Per End) than Swipe. In a long AV battle, that can be a big difference. And purple IO sets have little END Reduction (33%), which makes it worse. That's why the last slot in Gloom is for END Reduction. In regular battles (with pauses to switch targets and move around), this build has enough Recovery that it can support Gloom.

I forgot to add...

This is the char I use for Respecathons. That's where I do all 3 redside respecs in a small team, one after another. Usually it takes around an hour. It's still sufficiently overpowered that I can defeat the EBs in the lowest respec second mission with no help and little risk.

I checked, and the Blessings I have are actually fairly low level. Next time I respec this char, I'll probably pull out a couple of 50 sets and replace them with 36s. That way I'll still get the bonuses when I exemp down to 33 for the Respec.

[ QUOTE ]
How does this second build handle flashbacking/malefactoring?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd say it's average. I always get key powers at the earliest level possible, including things like travel power, status protection, and basic attacks. It's got the purple set bonuses, so you'll have solid Accuracy and Recharge bonuses. You won't be able to use the same attack chain, but that's not a surprise. But I don't think there are any major flaws with the build that exemping will uncover.

This build is meant for playing at level 50. I never put any thought into using it in Siren's Call for example. But plenty of sets could be lower to keep the bonuses. The Blessing sets in particular would be nice to have at lower levels. You could lower the Red Fortunes to 33 or maybe a little lower and still have ED capped Defense. Below that, you'd really have to design it for a specific level range if you wanted it to remain overpowered.

I replaced Poison Dart with Gloom, as Gloom is a much better single target attack. Poison Dart has a Regen debuff, but it's very small and significantly resisted by the only mobs you would really want to use it on (AVs and GMs). Gloom is a power I want to use (due to its better damage), rather than a power just to hold a purple set. I try and use it instead of Swipe most of the time, except when soloing hard targets as Gloom costs just a bit too much END for that.

I replaced Electrifying Fences with TT: Assault. Electrifying Fences does OK damage, but I was slotting it with the purple Immob set. TT: Assault increases the damage of everyone in the team. Most big teams mow through minions and even Lieutenants fast enough that I didn't really see a need for a little more personal AoE damage, plus TT: Assault acting on the rest of the team may make up for me not using Electrifying Fences. Even solo I don't need an Immob, as Minions and Lts die fast while Bosses get massively slowed. But TT: Assault is good all the time, including AV and GM fights. And it increases my personal damage by about 6% overall.

I lost a purple set when I dropped Electrifying Fences, and I had to make it up with 2 LotGs. The second build is more expensive, but has slightly better Recharge.

I added the Winter's Gift: Slow Resistance IO. That stacks with Mental Training to make me very resistant to Recharge and Movement debuffs. I barely notice one set of Caltrops, and I can still get through 2 fairly quickly.

Finally, I slotted some Blessing of the Zephyr sets to add more Ranged and AoE Defense. This caps defense without needing to run Mask Presence. I can turn off Mask Presence when fighting hard targets in order to save a little END (every bit helps). Though I usually leave it on, and it help when facing Def debuffing mobs (like Cimerorans) by providing a little buffer.

Both builds are pretty similar, but I consider the second one a step up in power. It does slightly more damage, it has a better ranged attack, and better resistance to debuffs. When it comes to "feel", both builds are overpowered. Significantly. The second one is just more overpowered than the first.

The Call to Arms and Expedient Reinforcement IO sets (Recharge Intensive Pets) do not actually provide any Accuracy or Damage to pets. The Enhancement Screen numbers look good, but the Combat Log will indicate that pets still have a base 75% chance to hit even level mobs and do unenhanced damage with their attacks.

You cannot do the Organ Grinder story arc (Steven Sheridan, level 30-35 I think) via Ouroboros. After the first mission, Steven will say that you're too busy, and will not give you another mission.

VEAT Widow Follow Up has a pause at the end. It is supposed to animate in under a second, but it takes nearly twice as long as it should.

Updated build, geared for soloing RWZ pylons, AVs, etc. I can have soft capped Def while running very few toggles. And I made sure to squeeze in all of the Tactical Training powers. Once BABs fixes the animation time for Follow Up, it'll be great.


Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/

[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]

Little Widow PvE: Level 50 Natural Arachnos Widow
Primary Power Set: Night Widow Training
Secondary Power Set: Widow Teamwork
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Medicine
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Swipe -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx:50(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg:50(29), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(37), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(37), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(39), Mako-Dam%:50(48)
Level 1: Combat Training: Defensive -- LkGmblr-Def:50(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(3)
Level 2: Strike -- Hectmb-Dmg:50(A), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(3), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg:50(11), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx:50(13), Hectmb-Dam%:50(13), EndRdx-I:50(15)
Level 4: Tactical Training: Maneuvers -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx:50(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg:50(5), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(5), RedFtn-Def:50(9), RedFtn-EndRdx:50(33), LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(40)
Level 6: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(7), RechRdx-I:50(7)
Level 8: Follow Up -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx:50(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg:50(9), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(11), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(19), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(19), Mako-Dam%:50(39)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- EndRdx-I:50(A)
Level 12: Lunge -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx:50(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg:50(15), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(17), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(17), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(40), Mako-Dam%:50(46)
Level 14: Super Speed -- Winter-ResSlow:50(A), Zephyr-Travel:23(34), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx:23(34), Zephyr-ResKB:10(39)
Level 16: Hurdle -- Jump-I:50(A)
Level 18: Health -- RgnTis-Regen+:30(A), Mrcl-Heal:40(23), Mrcl-Rcvry+:40(27), Numna-Heal:50(34), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+:50(50)
Level 20: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod/Acc:50(A), P'Shift-EndMod:50(21), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg:50(21), P'Shift-End%:21(50)
Level 22: Foresight -- DefBuff-I:50(A), LkGmblr-Def:50(23), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+:10(27), LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(46)
Level 24: Mind Link -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx:50(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg:50(25), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(25), RedFtn-Def:50(29), RedFtn-EndRdx:50(33), LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(40)
Level 26: Mask Presence -- HO:Cyto(A), HO:Cyto(48)
Level 28: Aid Other -- Heal-I:50(A)
Level 30: Aid Self -- Mrcl-Heal/EndRdx:33(A), Mrcl-Heal/Rchg:33(31), Mrcl-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:33(31), Mrcl-Heal:33(31)
Level 32: Combat Jumping -- Zephyr-Travel:23(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx:23(33), Zephyr-ResKB:10(43)
Level 35: Spin -- Armgdn-Dmg:50(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(36), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg:50(36), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx:50(36), Armgdn-Dam%:50(37)
Level 38: Mental Training -- Run-I:25(A)
Level 41: Gloom -- Apoc-Dmg:50(A), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(42), Apoc-Acc/Rchg:50(42), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx:50(42), Apoc-Dam%:50(43), EndRdx-I:50(43)
Level 44: Dart Burst -- Ragnrk-Dmg:50(A), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(45), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg:50(45), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), Ragnrk-Knock%:50(46)
Level 47: Tactical Training: Leadership -- HO:Cyto(A), HO:Cyto(48)
Level 49: Tactical Training: Assault -- EndRdx-I:25(A), EndRdx-I:25(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I:50(A)
Level 1: Conditioning
------------
------------
[u]Set Bonus Totals:[u]<ul type="square">[*]8% DamageBuff(Smashing)[*]8% DamageBuff(Lethal)[*]8% DamageBuff(Fire)[*]8% DamageBuff(Cold)[*]8% DamageBuff(Energy)[*]8% DamageBuff(Negative)[*]8% DamageBuff(Toxic)[*]8% DamageBuff(Psionic)[*]3% Defense(Smashing)[*]3% Defense(Lethal)[*]6.13% Defense(Fire)[*]6.13% Defense(Cold)[*]6.13% Defense(Energy)[*]6.13% Defense(Negative)[*]3% Defense(Psionic)[*]3% Defense(Melee)[*]9.25% Defense(Ranged)[*]9.25% Defense(AoE)[*]95% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*]5% Enhancement(Heal)[*]66% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*]5% FlySpeed[*]108.4 HP (10.1%) HitPoints[*]5% JumpHeight[*]5% JumpSpeed[*]Knockback (Mag -8)[*]Knockup (Mag -8)[*]MezResist(Immobilize) 11%[*]19.5% (0.34 End/sec) Recovery[*]48% (2.58 HP/sec) Regeneration[*]20% ResEffect(FlySpeed)[*]20% ResEffect(RechargeTime)[*]20% ResEffect(RunSpeed)[*]10.1% Resistance(Fire)[*]10.1% Resistance(Cold)[*]5% RunSpeed[/list]


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|303B5287E728DF9179C602E31A61F43AE1368439264319CB0 392E21734272BFB9B9|
|DA255133A639A3143982C30F8ABF808E7E6E4B9B98B343375 8931CBB84CC85F21AC|
|C2B93A2F57F43FCAB3027333B27433698AA9C0E8575B1714F EE011E5BF2C9B6AEBD|
|209853FFD3B6AEB86FED7F33578E6C777176254B6F0E6EFA0 ECE1F01ECA7D940768|
|7B88F208C54039FDD6FA7589CC61405751E65116505EE2220 D2F56002588124209A|
|34450A2285D2871945E947728A7BF01D29CF4A2|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|</pre><hr />

Yep, I've solod many of the Giant Monsters in the game, including Lusca, with my Ill/Rad Troller. Haven't tried redside yet though, but I've got a 50 Thugs/Traps I was considering using.