Thundorn

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If you are dual logging its quite possible to get the atlas medallion at lvl 1. takes a couple of hours but you can find enough vampyri and war wolves in Founders falls. Not that theres much point getting it at lvl 1 but just so you know you could have it really.

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MY bad, got myself confuddled. Its actually lvl 10

If you are dual logging its quite possible to get the atlas medallion at lvl 1. takes a couple of hours but you can find enough vampyri and war wolves in Founders falls. Not that theres much point getting it at lvl 1 but just so you know you could have it really.

Why would u need to have several tanks for each level range? I use SO's until lvl 35 after which i set about gradually building my toons with 35-41 io's so that should i decide to wander into wb i keep the set bonuses. As for the lower pvp zones, you dont really need the set bonuses as its pretty easy to mak an SO'd toon strong in SC and BB.

I DO see your point Saxtus, but I was more referring to the upper spectrum of levels anyway, as until lvl 30 odd most toons are too lacking in powers to work at full potential. As for having an empath or rad around, definately not, i think TG was using that as an example of how the figures match up with Pre ED. Any tanker worth his salt is more then capable of managing the aggro cap on his own, Having an emp, rad or kin about merely speeds thing up a bit.

I know that with a unique enhancement to break the aggro cap, that it could cause problems if you were to exemp, but then this once again would solely rely on the tanker being careful, with the precep range of mobs being pretty low, as long as the tanker doesnt go nuts and start trying to bounce between three mobs as if he weren't exemped there wouldnt be a problem.

On the other hand i would have to agree with you that unfortunately a large amount of the population arent competent tankers. The amount of times ive been playing a blaster or scrapper and had some idiot making us wait for ten minutes while they try to gather enough mobs at a herd point becasue they dont know any other way of tanking, or worse still DDT's. I know that there would be a high percentage of idiots out there who would slot one of these enhancements and then not be able to cope, but then that would eventually encourage darwinism to kick in. One would hope so anyway.

id have to agree with TG here. From th figures i have seen. The IO sets that are already available take most toons very close to pre ED. Saying that Nobody said we HAD to take the invention sets is just daft, and heres why, With i9, the value of inf went down dramatically, people who were just starting out in the game were earning millions of inf by lvl 12 and by the time they hit lvl 22 and were ready for SO's the challenge that used to be saving up for SO's was non existent. They took away one of the key challanges of the gme for new players by allowing anyone to be a millionaire within a matter of days of play. The challenge that was taken away was replaced with the challenge of getting io sets and slotting a toon with a good balance. So are you saying that the devs dont want us to take this as a challenge and jsut roll down easy street being happy with our SO's? when tommy one toon has 23 million inf and is laughing all the way to the bank because the rest of us arent keeping the rare recipes rare?

I dont know about the rest of you think but i was a bit miffed when i9 first came out because, as is always the case when new content comes in, people went nuts on it and the market was flooded with people paying stupid money for virtually nothing. This has now levelled out but the challenge that we used to face, of being able to afford the enhancements we needed to buy every 5 levels, has now completely dissapeared. Its only natural therefore that we take the IO sets. Besides which only an idiot would dangle a carrot in front of a donkeys nose and expect it to ignore it, in the same vein only an idiot would make it possible to make our toons uber and expect us not to want to do it.

Im not saying things should be back the way they used to be, but i think its entirely feasable to create another unique io that allows a tank to maybe double or tripple the aggro cap on that toon. I tell ya now, My tanks beiong able to taunt more then 17 would be anything except boring, The tank i used in this video has NO io's, and yet he coped with 17 +2 freaks with ease. Imagine what he would be capable of if i could be bothered to spend the money to io him fully. It would be nice to be able to at least get a challenge. 17 mobs that cant challenge me = tedium

I'd have to agree with saxtus really. For guys who know how to tank and could cope with the huge influx of critters it would be fun, but imagine those poor newbies trying to clear out Atta's cave. *shudders*

I still think they should put a pre ED week on test, jsut so oldies can go back and relive the experience and maybe newbies can go in and see what the oldies are on about.

Aye, The aggro cap is visible there, What i was trying to achieve, as shannon sort of explained, was getting as many as i could to follow me, then taking them into the vicinity of more, which will give you a constant flow of baddies until they run out. and with any luck burn or footsomp will catch a few extras on the way. It is possible to manipulate the game mechanics to your advantage in this situation. Also its possible to keep the interest of more minions then the aggro cap sort of, but that requires a lot more running about using footstomp and other attacks, basically not holding aggro, more grouping as many as you can together, and then letting the blasters on the team have the pleasure of going AoE bonkers. BUt as i said this isnt a method i use often as its particularly risky, ill only have aggro of 17 of them and the blaster will be vulnerable. But its always good for a laugh.

So you need a team to take them down?
Ah well i expected some black catting when i made this post.
Not to mention i wouldnt do this if i was with a team as it defies the point of tanking. This was me using one of my fire tanks to see if i could herd AND kill lots on my own. So im not impressed by claims that people can herd loads when thay have a team to back them up. especially when they also claim that they need an awesome team to do it.

Ok before anyone says it. i know if i had been with other people i wouldnt have managed this. And also this vid isnt the most ive ever herded in one go, its just the most ive herded in one go whilst recording it.

See what you think

Clicky to see!

enjoy

Not one to wee wee on the preverbial bonfire. But a good stalker doesnt really need extra hp or dmg. Prime example. A friend of mine has successfully io'd his stalker to get a 25% damage buff. And stalkers are hard enough to kill without adding the extra hp. TBH giving stalekrs a little extra endurance is cool, but the balance between stalkers and other AT's is pretty good. This particluar AT isnt supposed to be able to go toe to toe with tanks and scrappers, if they could it would be an rediculous advantage over other AT's.

true, But IMO any sensible soul wouldnt set up theier base for Raids until they had sufficient prestige to be able to cover the cost of repairs, To take part in raids without a decent reserve to take care of the matter would jsut be daft really

in order to run a base with that kind of prestige drain, would require some stern management. Certain SG/VG's run a 3 day policy believe it or not, where if you havent logged on for 3 days you get kicked. That mentailty is a bit hard to understand from my perspective as i run my SG as a collective of friends who enjoy playing together rather then some kind of race to the top. Maybe its becasuse i get more pleasure out of playing the game and being good at the toons i play, then being able to say "My SG PWNS"

Kicking ppl for not logging on due to RL situations and all that is in contradictio to the whole purpose of MMO's in my humble opinion. What kind of community can you form with ppl when you remove them from your group for not being about for a week?

The community is one of the major selling points of CoX, as no other MMO has a community quite like it. Maybe this is something the Devs have looked at Maybe not. But in all honesty, if you manage to raise the 138 million prestige required, the 5 million a month base rent isnt giong to be much of a problem anyway.

Its like the saying goes, "Why by a porsche when you cant afford the petrol?"

*shudders.

Lets not compare Dwarf and tanker too closely as i may have a coronary.

I tend to find that the turning principle isnt always the best tactic. It has its many uses as do herding, Point blanking and taunt pulling. The key to being a good tank isnt just being able to take all the hits and bounce round like a man/woman posessed trying to keep all the aggro. Its also about keeping the team informed of what you are trying to achieve and where YOU NEED THEM to be. Its all well and good saying i like to bounce over their heads and taunt them away from the rest of the team, but how is that going to work when you cant see round that corner they are stood on, or just as you leap over, one of the blasters lets off a shot and all hell breaks loose.

So what is the most important part of baing a tank? is it remembering your basics?

Nope, any idiot can stand there and spam taunt till their fingers are sore, but whats the point in that when your suicidal scrapper mate has just legged it into the next mob without warning.

Is it knowing the best way to tank every different kind of enemy?

Nope. Ok great you know how to deal with those Nemesis ranges AoE's lovely, now watch the team empath stand right next to you and get bounced across the map.

Is it Being able to stand in the "Room of death" and take the whole room on without dying?

Nope. there is an aggro cap for a reason, and if you P**S if the whole room they arent just goin to take it out on you!

Its Communication, plain and simple. Not barking orders like "Herding to here!! dont attack until i say ready!"
its letting the whole team know what you intend to do in each situation, and checking that everyone is singing from the same hymn sheet, ok that scrapper has run off to do his own thing, some would say let him die and he will learn, sorry but that attitude dont sit well with me, communicate with them, ask them what they are doing, explain that you are a team and will do things as such, if they dont like playing as a team, then there are plenty of contacts that they can get their own missions from and solo to their hearts content.

Digression over,

Point i am trying to make is that you can build the best tanker in the world and break all records on one team, but when you join a PuG, if nobody says, "ok follow the tankers lead" etc etc, how do you know that they are going to know what you are doing?

KNowing the basics is fine but its as much about sharing this knowledge with everyone else as it is actually doin it.

For in i would say it dont really make that much difference, SS compliments sets like fire well due to the ability to hold the badguys in your AoE's well with Foot Stomp. But since Inv has no Dmg AoE thats a bit of an academic point.

Enegy Melee if slotted correctly can out Dmg some scrappers and the Endurance usage isnt too bad either, also the Animation times of the powers are similar. Total focus is a long animation but i wouldnt say any longer then that of Knockout Blow, where Energy Transfer is Quite fast, as is Foot Stomp. Whirling hands is quite tasty purely from the +stun effect point of view, were i would say EM has the Upper hand would be during solo play, when the mobs arent too big and single target tanking is probably more appropriate.

Knockout blow is a very sexy power mind you, the animation is cool and you can compete with your mates to see who can knock the bad guys highest into the air =D

Not sure bout the prestige remark. My latest toon, earned 400k in two weeks, just by soloing when there werent teams about, and Killing everything in sight. Solo prestige is gretaer then that in a team (unless you are teamed with 7 other sg members in which case obviously the sg itself will earn more) Its a shame that the CoP was such a flop. Would be great to be able to do some SG only content. But thats where imagination has to come in at this point.

Besides which they cant fiddle about with prestige earning too much, as like all things in this game, the fun is in the challenge. Giving supergroups a bonus amount of prestige for the first few joiners is ample IMO. if it was too easy to earn prestige, you would miss out on the whole, we need to work hard to save up for this base item, challenge.

The whole stamina thing is ideal the way it is IMO. Its a part of the game that adds an extra challenge dynamic to it. The idea of having it as part of a power pool and the number of pools being limited is a good way of making players actually think more about what pools they actually are goin to take. As for diversity, Nobody is forcing you to take these powers. A toon can get around not having stamina nowaday in particular due to Set bonuses, and being able to get the equivalent of 9 SO's on one power using a full set on that power. People confuse better and more diverse with ease all to often. If stamina was to become inherant, one of the challenges of building your toon would be gone and thus part of the gameplay with it.

How bizaare. An unexpected tangent one might say. I understand that some people like to go the heavy offense route with a tank, and that is their perogative. But that shouldnt detract from the fact that if a team says thay need a tanker, to most people that means they need aggro control. It so i think any person would be correct in assuming that if they are "needed" they are going to actually be used for their purpose. It seems that half the time i am invited to a team under these conditions its due to the team leader being the cause of several deaths, for whatever reason, and rather then admit they are doing something wrong they insist on "needing" a tank, and therefore managing to shift the blame for these deaths when they still happen becasue of sloppy method. a tank can hold aggro and keep everyone alive, assuming that everyone is fighting the same mob and that the tank is given the time to actually taunt before some nitwit with an itchy trigger finger scatters them all over the shop.

I agree that not all can fulfil every role, but thats as much down to playstyle as it is build.

What i am saying is that if someone tells me that they are a GOOD tanker. I expect a lot of them.

your reading too much into it m8. Comedy builds is what it sayd on the tin. builds that are just funny. not having taunt is fair dinkum if you can fill your role using Blazing aura or somehow using gauntlet.

Just talking about funny builds, as opposed to mocking people who may have slightly borked their toons

Had an interesting incident occur a few days back, which i have made a post about elsewhere, but part of this incident involved a heated discussion about Tanking techniques.

The person with whom i was sharing this exchange, insisted that the only way to tank was to herd, and let a blaster nuke. My retort was that actually this was slower DPS then normal aoe's due to the delay caused by the recharge and side effects of blaster nukes.

I was explaining to him that herding is not always (in fact i would say rarely) the best way to tank, and that i would much prefer to point blank a mob then herd pull, unless the mobs are close together and its for the good of the team.

Bear in mind this guy was Inv/EM which is a horrible combination imo. (please note that im referring to PvE before you PvPers get the hump).

He was quite simply not budging and constantly screaming at me to herd and then at the blaster to nova. Needless to say we started ignoring him quite quickly and just carried on our business.

This whole conversation brought something to my attention. Gameplay seems to move in trends, One week the game seems inindated with badly built kamikazee tankers who try to over do it. So we pull away and try to coax them into proper tanking. Maybe we pull to far, maybe not. But the next week we find that tankers are being over cautious and what would take and experienced team ten minutes, is taking the team with this tanker two hours.

Of course the technique a tanker uses depends a lot on his build and the team he is with. AN inv/em tanker is pretty much gonna have to rely on the team as they are lacking in AoE's with any serious dmg. One thing i do think is important is to clear things up at the very beginning. theres nothing worse for a tanker then jumping into a mob. and before his taunt aura has even hit, the mob either gets launched across the room or they are immob'ed where they stand by the over zealous troller and now the aoe's dont mean squat.

So many posts about herding, and whether it is the best policy, or in some cases if we should do it at all. The important thing to remember is that a well built tanker can adapt to all situations, and master all styles of tanking. Any tanker who relies solely on one method and one method alone, needs to get themselves into terra volta, and back to the drawing board.

Ive been playing as a blaster a reasonable amount recently, and on a few occasions ive been asked to invite a tanker to my team, being told "hes a good tanker, knows what he is doing" and been sorely dissapointed. which leads me to believe that not only are there too many tankers who only know one method, but there are also too many teams who only know that one method. Fine if they stick together of course, but once they branch out into more experienced teams, they will have problems.

So for all those tankers, that rely on or believe that theres only one way of doing it....

Time to go back to school cos youve got a lot to learn.

You are of course referring to conditions which are somewhat more excusable. But if you are joining a team thats On the surface not too badly made up, i.e couple of blasters, a scrapper, two trollers and a kin defender, you would expect things to go pretty smoothly. But of course only if the whole team is working on the same mob. if one of the blasters decides to go and chase down a different to the one you are tanking, it wont take long before you have lost one of your main dmg dealers. Next thig you know the kin and one of the trollers is down too because they, trying to be good team players run after the blaster to try and keep them alive (at least thats what i convince myself they are doing) and they drop as well. Team splits due to stupidity are an all too common occurence. what im saying is that i dont want to be they guy who joins a team and starts barking at people for being idiots, but ive been getting a lot of these teams lately and it worries me to be completely honest. TOo many people have i met who think they are awesome because they have a 50, and having teamed with them its a wonder they managed to get a toon to 50 and never learn what a tank does.

Aye that works most of the time. just recently though i seem to be teaming with people who go the wrong way and leave me stood there getting my backside handed to me while they chase a different mob. I think im just unlucky to be honest. I seem to team with nut cases. On the upside those debt badges are looking good

seems daft that ppl would complain about the screen shaking for ss powers. i liked it too. I would have thought the devs time would be better spent fixing the Consignment house issue. i.e having to wait half an hour before the thing registers you actually selling something.

Autohit in pve as far is i know, there have however been a couple of occasions where ive been forced to ask that question, i.e fighting +4 mobs, and the fire blaster 2 levels above me seems to have a firm hold on that aggro no matter how much i spam taunts. but then that may be due to the aggro cap, i get lost in the moment sometimes ya know

You have to make room for both camps really. As annoying as it is when a tank aggros more then he is capable of, (sometimes accidentally or in a situation where it is unavoidable) its equally as annoying waiting for the tanker to run off and find another mob while the rest of the team has to hang around or suffer the wrath of the megalomanic stoney.