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Quote:I don't think you'll find a SINGLE good oldschool PvP'er that would disagree with that. Literally. Not one in the whole game.How the devs retooled PvP to me is completely asinine if their goal was to make it more friendly for PvErs.
As far as good controller builds, /rad and /storm are still decent, and /therm can be very good. /TA can do well still too.
They're no doms, but as part of a team, trollers can add a lot. For example, team a good rad with a blaster, and the blaster will be killing things almost automatically (held targets with EF on them die fast). -
Quote:That doesn't make any sense, considering bots are more survivable than thugs. The real difference is that thugs do more damage, but bots are more survivable. Overall, thugs are better, since paindom is all the survivability you need.Bots/pain takes a bit more skill, it's not as easy as thugs/pains, and i've seen bots/pain die if they didn't know what they were doing.
Keep in mind, as a /paindom, you will be basically unkillable by any single player, but it will also be hard to kill people, since it has no offensive capabilities, unlike poison or something. -
Well for stalkers, leaving hibernate is very easy. Kinda automatic actually. Especially considering they all have phase too. But yeah, you can tell a lot about a player by the way they come out of hibernoob.
I also know another automatic way to get out that can be done by anybody, but don't want to discuss that here -
You're foiling all my attempts at jokes, you ***!
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They do have a point Tokyo. Doms are one of the top 3 or so AT's in the game right now. They're capable of the same damage as blasters basically, except with more mezzing. While overall their mezzing was obviously ruined, they do ridiculously more damage now than before. And in a game where literally nothing matters except damage, a high ranged damage AT is king.
You're right that defs and controllers are pretty weak compared to how they used to be. But considering they were totally godlike before, "pretty weak compared to" is still not that bad. -
For troller/dom holds, PB might make a noticeable difference. But boosting something with a 2 second base duration won't make much difference. A 3-4 sec stun vs a 5-6 sec stun is not really relevant, imo.
Sure, it does give PB at least some use, but it's still not really worth the power pick. -
Any /em blaster will hit you easily, but I guess that's only in arena or warburg. Other than that, anybody else that specifically slots for range (like you) will also probably hit you.
But still, +range is a big deal and helps a lot. In regards to phase, it works, but if that's your only escape from -fly, you'll die anyway. -fly lasts 30 seconds for some powers. So does phase. When phase drops, you're still sitting in the same spot as before, with the same people there to kill you. And that's assuming they DON'T simply turn on phase themselves and kill you right through yours.
Really, if you plan to use fly, you also need super speed or teleport for the times you get webbed. That combined with phase, and you will not die much. -
I spammed a lot of sharks last night. Finished the night off by spamming impale in sirens. Apparently blasters don't like impale spam :P
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I would personally go with concealment for phase...so the cloaking device would be useless. Fire/dev is very good though. Just spam flares, blast, and webnade, and things die.
Also, while PB'd rad blasts might sound good, in reality, it's probably overkill. A blaster can already hit pretty much anything, and rad already has a big -def debuff, so making it bigger with PB really won't make THAT much difference. Kind of like peeing in the ocean
/em is mostly about boost range, and that helps fire as much as anything. -
Wow, to think this thread was about power customization.....
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[QUOTE=Crim_the_Cold;2308098]Is there a timer on -fly in pvp?
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You mean is there suppression? No, there isn't. You can keep a flier grounded permanently with continuous applications of -fly (as long as the -fly mag overcomes the fly mag).
This is why fly by itself is pretty much a death sentence in PvP. You need to combine it with super speed or teleport if you want to not die every single time you get -fly on you. -
Quote:Good point. It definitely would not. In fact, even if it was an option, I think new players would still keep the customization on, just because it's available.Look at it another way: if they make a customization off feature is it going to attract any new pvp'ers?
You guys seem to think it's not a big deal, but wait a few months. I think this will affect PvE too, making PUGs even more horrible with clueless players. How do new people learn the game? From repetition. They see the same green radiation on their targets over and over...and eventually they learn that the green radiation debuffs their target in certain ways. Now instead of that, each time they see the radiation, it's a different color...sometimes the color of a completely different powerset, like dark miasma. Of course they can still learn things. It'll just take a lot longer, since there is no repetition.
Lastly, Hyperstrike, if "I can't adapt because the power customizations make it tough for me to tell what I'm being hit with and adapt" is what you got from my post, you need to learn to read. Because it personally doesn't affect me at all, as I clearly mentioned in the OP. -
I think with the right powerset it's possible to get to the cap...or almost to it. My friend has an ice tank that he says is right around that 45% mark in PvP. All from the ice shields + bonuses. It must be totally crazy in PvE.
Other than that, I've teamed with Ronin in the past, and with like 3-4 stacked vengeances, a defense based melee toon will get to the cap. But obviously that's a lot of external buffs. -
I only have 2 power picks available, so the question is...should I take shark + the shark hold...or shark + hibernoob? I'm leaning towards the hold, since it's a very good extra ranged attack, and I already have phase.
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Well of course they're a huge deal. Playing without them is like a handicap, and I did mention that. I just meant it's not impossible. You do have to be a better player than your opponent though.
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I never saw anyone mention this, but it only took me a few minutes of I16 to realize that power customization will be bad for PvP. Basically, it makes entry for new players even more difficult. It was already insanely hard for someone new to get into PvP, considering it's a completely separate and different game from PvE.
Now, there isn't even any consistency to anything. Any powerset can look like any other powerset. For me, it doesn't matter, since everything in the game is so engraved in my brain, I immediately recognize powers, regardless of what color they are. I'm sure other old school PvP'ers are the same. But what about new people? It just seems like this will ensure that we'll never get new additions to the PvP community. It's just too much work to learn the game at this point.
Is there a way to completely turn off all power customization, so that all powers appear as they normally do? That would be a good start.
Obviously the customization is good for the game overall, since it opens up so many options. I just feel it's going to kill PvP even more. I really can't imagine being a new player, trying to learn PvP in this game. Nothing works like it does normally, and now even all powers look different from how they're supposed to look. Poor, poor newbies -
Quote:Absolutely. I think the best solution for someone that truly wants to learn PvP is to make friends with one of the top PvP'ers, team with them, and learn from them. There are still people around that, even though they've become jaded by the devs' ignorance, will help out anybody that asks for help.having to accumulate a billion inf, invest strategically, and THEN learn the skills is a bit rough.
The idea that you need billions to do well in PvP is a misconception, at least for normal PvP. For top-tier arena stuff, you're competing with the best, so you can't handicap yourself. But top-tier arena doesn't exist anymore at all, thanks to the devs. So that doesn't really matter.
The point is that in zones, if you're a good player, you can get by even with just SO's. I do. Of course I'm also probably the most oldschool PvP'er left in the game, so I do have the experience. But that can be learned.
Doing arena matches on SO'd toons vs purpled out doms isn't going to teach you very much. Instead, go to RV, get on a team with some good players (you can usually tell who they are), and do what they do. I think that's the best way to learn, and with a team backing you up, your handicap of having a cheap build will be covered up pretty well. -
Quote:Well, sorry...but I changed my mind last night lol. I might end up getting the sharks on my em/regen as well, adding to the bad shark spammersI simply have the annoyance of the generalization that all stalkers are bad shark spammers.
Being regen, I already basically cannot possibly die, unless it's like 6v1, in which case I do have a slight chance of dying. So shadow meld only marginally helps me, and the dark blast is just completely useless. It's intended to be a ranged followup, but as such, it does practically nothing. It's just laughably bad compared to a shark. So yeah, haven't completely decided yet, but I'll probably change to a shark spammer -
After coming back this weekend, I respecced my spines/nin into sharks. Had the dark set before, with shadow meld. Really loving the sharks. And yes, it's made me use AS less. Simply because I don't have to. The extreme shark damage actually gives a stalker a slight chance of killing something without AS.
But on my EM/regen, I plan to stay with shadow meld, so I'll still be relying on AS for the most part. -
Exactly. I forgot to mention that. At one time (in I13 I think) I actually did use FoN for the +end. But then I realized my blaster had zero end problems anyway, so I dropped it.
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Makes it completely useless, just like for blasters. With the shield and PvP res, you're already basically at the cap. All the surge (or FoN) does is give some very minimal extra res. Definitely not worth the power pick.
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Probably an emp or therm + a dom.
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The fire/fire brute, em/SR stalker, and spines/fire scrapper would also be fairly good, if you like playing melee. Not top tier, but you could make them work.
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Melee damage on a blaster was destroyed in I13. It serves zero purpose now, since you can do basically the same damage from range. This completely killed /elec, since melee damage was all it had going for it.
If you don't want /EM, I think /dev is the only choice. It's also excellent, mainly because of the webnade spam. /MM is #3, but it's very far behind the first 2.