Starsman
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Quote:You will be busy, even in your first year. Academically that may be your easiest year for two reasons: enthusasm (new stuff always has a better chance of keeping your attention) and off course, it's the year of the basic stuff. Sometimes I wish I had been able to start with the hard stuff first, when I was extremely enthusiastic about it!!! It's the second year and going forth that you may start to feel your breath lacking even if the subjects don't become any harder.Originally Posted by Angry_Citizen
The game, however, must go. I cannot sit idly by and be sucked into a game when education demands my concentration. I realise I will not be that busy during college, especially the first year, but I am not going to run the risk.
Anyways, I said you would be busy that year and still have to say why: it's a new life and as such, you will be busy with all new relationships. You need to take care of those friendships and they may take too much care of you (too many parties.) So you will see little time for games anyways... unless you end in one of the cool geek circles, that is
I guess my biggest tip is: don't be ashamed of look stupid. I say this as one of my biggest issues back in the day. You will be surrounded with great minds and many professors (not all) just LOVE to humiliate their students with their all mighty brains. You may eventually find they are not that smart. I still to this day rejoice on the day I corrected a professor 3 times in one single class. Anyways, the point is: you will meet at least one professor like this during your entire education and that's if you are lucky. Chances are not bad you may find more than one per semester, though.Quote:You may have been wondering when I'd be soliciting advice... well, this is it. I'm a first generation college student. None of my friends are college graduates (except for the two I've mentioned by name above), none of my family are college graduates, and in general, I am completely and totally alone in my desire to pursue higher education. I know nothing about it - nothing. If anyone, anyone has any tips they wish they'd known, or habits they wish they'd gotten into, or just anything you can think of... please, let me know now.
Don't let these humiliating "I'm smarter than you and am here to prove you stupid" professors discourage you. As for their intent, some of them are serious bullies while others are just trying to roughen up their students. It does not matter, just imagine they are challenging you. Make it your own goal to prove you are smart even if they keep humiliating you. In short: It's the Army Physical Training for the Brain. -
Quote:Not only that, these people complain their boss farms are too easy now. Well, how about getting off their lazy boss farms and make some EB farms instead? Too easy? Then push it, make AV farms and see how easily you go through those.Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
As a complete aside, I do find it a little odd that people spend a lot of time getting their characters uber-ed out with IOs, then complain that the game offers them little challenge. Well, that's because the game is still balanced around SOs. IOs allowed you to make tings easier. If you have a fully-IOed out character, and want some challenge, use the second build as an SO build, and make things tough for yourself again. But hey, maybe that's just me.
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Quote:In the mornings, I add pepper and salt on my Cocoa Pebbles to make them less fun to eat.Originally Posted by Grey_Pilgrim
Sorciere, you're disagreeing with them, which means you want to only fight 1-2 mobs. Somehow my discussing the aggro cap as being okay where it is meant I wanted to fight only 7 mobs at once, a few pages back. If you're against raising the aggro cap, you're against having fun in the game and being heroic, that's clear.
It has nothing to do with the fact that some are arguing this idea won't really help things out for the game or tanks. Nope, anyone against it is just plain not fun. Nasty, not fun people, get out of this thread!
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J_B has actually suggested equal damage to scrappers or more.
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Quote:You keep up that perception of actually affecting people's life, don't you?Originally Posted by Kruunch
I hurt your little feelings?
I'm sorry.
Anyways, carry on, Big K.
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Quote:That's Big K in a nutshell.Originally Posted by Failsight
Wow, it's a good thing you weren't calling out people just now for telling you how they like to play...
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Quote:I apologize if my objective view was so horribly offensive to you and your play style that you feel that giving back an insult of mine was "giving what i gave", Big K.Originally Posted by Kruunch
You get what you give sparky.
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Quote:Good thing I was not expecting an intelligent argument.Originally Posted by Kruunch
Yeah we all know about how you (and Sorciere) play the game though.
ZZZzzzzzzzz. -
Quote:I would say thats based on how SHE feels, not on whoever cared but it's not my place to guess her position. I can talk about mine, though. In my eyes:Originally Posted by Kruunch
And that was based on *never* hearing people go "OH CRAP!" when I've pulled 3-7 mobs before.
3-7 minnion/lts? nah, not heroic.
3-7 bosses? Depends on AT.
3-7 EBs? Now thats heroic.
3-7 AVs? Now THATS SUPER-Heroic
100 minnions/lts with occasional boss, not heroic, just bullying and farming. Nothing heroic about it in MY book.
But for each his own.
Edit to add: all this aside, the main reason to kill herding was NOT powergaming. Making the team feel useless in the face of a herding tank may had definitively helped, but the true reason behind it is the servers were not able to handle it. People that herded enough may remember occasionally causing zone crashes with their herds and this was in a time where the server handled less than it does now. The server just can't handle every tank going out there herding full maps and having them all active at once. Heck, it can barely handle the AE as it is. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Turbo_Ski
Irrelevant starsman since as I said with the Kheldian example, they don't consider -res/+dmg powers from powersets when balancing damage modifiers.
I would love to see Castle's opinion on that. -
Quote:As I just posted, its far from the only power out there but when solo, you really don't have to worry about who you going to target with it because you have full control of who dies first. EVEN if you "wasted time" in such mundane actions, you waste more time in a scrapper just walking to the targets so doubt that works as an argument at all.Originally Posted by StratoNexus
It must be considered. You can't just ignore it. That being said, I think its effect is overblown and should not prevent a damage increase.
I am interested in seeing why I am wrong, but simply flashing some numbers going 1.3*X without considering things like tabbing through a spawn to find which target you will toggle, the animation time of the power itself, the fact that you aggrod without dealing any damage, the enemies you have to kill outside the area of effect, etc. will be mitigated in my head by those factors. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Turbo_Ski
So you feel that all support AT base damage should be balanced around the assumption that you have access to Enervating Field? Yeah that makes so much sense /sarcasm
Cold Domination
- Sleet -30% (97.5% potential uptime)
- Heat Loss -30% (16.25% potential uptime)
Dark Misma
- Tar Patch -30% (97.5% potential uptime)
Empathy
- Fortitude 31.25% (390% potential uptime) Ally only
Force Fields
- Nothing
Kinetics
- Siphon Power 25% (130% potential uptime) (stacks)
- Fulkrum Shift 50% + 25% x foe (146.25% potential uptime)
Radiation
- Accelerate Metabolism 0.25 (55.45% potential uptime)
- Enervating Field -30% (toggle)
- Fallout -50% (20.15% potential uptime)
Sonic
- Sonic Siphon -30% (365.625% potential uptime)
- Disruption Field -30% (toggle) Requires ally or pet
Storm
- Freezing Rain -35% (146.25% potential uptime)
Trick Arrow
- Acid Arrow -20% (195% potential uptime)
- Disruption Arrow -20% (113.75% potential uptime)
Thermal Radiation (assumes defender values)
- Forge 25% (390% potential uptime) Ally only
- Melt Armor -30% (52% potential uptime)
Pain Domination (assumes defender values)
- Share Pain 31.25% (195% potential uptime) Requires ally or pet
- Conduit Pain 37.5% (65% potential uptime) Requires dead ally
- Word of Pain 20% (73.125% potential uptime)
- Anguishing Pain -30% (48.75% potential uptime)
- Painbringer 62.5% (58.5% potential uptime)
Traps (assumes defender values)
- Acid Morar -26.67% (130% potential uptime) Has potential of double duration since last mortar shot can last 60 more seconds)
- Trip Mine and Time Bomb, Not buffs or debuffs but KABOOM damage
Poison (assumes defender values)
- Envenom 37.5% (487.5% potential uptime)
- Noxious Gas -30% (permanent grant power) (requires pet, would assume ally to require if corruptor or defender)
Some are single target, some are AoE, not that different from how attack sets are built. Some have their access late in the game, Fire is one that actually seems weak with just 50% uptime of Melt Armor and it being late game on top of that, but damage boosts are on every set other than Force Fields. Enervating Field is far from being the only damage boosting power available in buff sets. -
Quote:That is entirely false.Originally Posted by Turbo_Ski
Unless you're suggesting to make Enervating Field an inherent for all defenders and corruptors and controllers, I don't see how that is relevant to balancing damage modifiers. You can't include anything that isn't available to all sets at lvl 1 thru lvl 50 when balancing damage modifiers, unless it's a recurring consistent theme like Assasin's Strikes/Placate/hide for stalkers. -Res/+dmg support powers aren't consistently the same value or available at the same levels or even available at all for some sets.
The only thing that is "never accounted" during balance are pool powers and even those you can be sure ARE looked at, just not expected.
All ATs are balanced around goals. The defender is given very low damage modifiers but very high damage buff and debuff modifiers. That should give you a clue about how they expect the defender to work their offensive. The only way you can ever expect defenders to get a damage buff, is to suffer a damage buff nerf and I doubt you will ever see that happen.
The fact that two sets cant ever get the tools needed is what is questionable.
All sets across defenders, controllers, corruptors and masterminds have the tools to increase their own damage but two, i think that leaves a lot to say about those two, not about the AT.
The progression of sets is a set design issue that is present all over the game but all ATs are balanced around access to the full sets, not just what they had at level 1. If it was, then I'd start asking Castle to give mez protection and inherent taunt to scrappers right now, and make assassination available at lvl 1 not lvl 8, etc. -
Quote:Because in theory, a defender that can debuff the foe's resistance by 30% already has in average a modifier of about .84, higher than tankers. Make that .9 and you suddenly have the defender at a theoretical 1.17. Add a second one and it becomes average of 1.44 per defender. At this point why bother with anything but defenders? Only reason not to do so is because there are no defenders around to pick into your team.Originally Posted by StratoNexus
Why? If a Rad/ defender puts EF on an enemy, the defender's damage is increased. It is also true that a scrapper's and blaster's higher damage is increased. The defender does not replace them. If a Kin gets a big damage buff from FS, yes, his damage is increased, but so is his tanker and blaster teammates. The defender does not replace them.
I fail to see the danger, but am willing to try.
The idea with defenders buffing damage is not that they should be dealing damage, is that they make others better at dealing damage. Wanting both is wanting to have a cake and eating it too. You can't have it both ways. -
Quote:Its dangerous to improve the base values of all sets when all but two sets have the ability to make those attacks even stronger. Would be less risky to just give those two sets the tools to make their blasts stronger.Originally Posted by StratoNexus
IMO, Empathy and FF are not the only sets that should be improved. That is a soloing argument, and while I do believe helping defenders solo is an important aspect of any plan to improve defenders, I feel it is more important to improve the performance of their blasts in a team setting.
The debuff values are generally already very high so improving those is not a viable option, IMO. As good as they are, those debuffs are also not readily apparent to most players. Improving the damage will have a visible impact that will encourage more players to appreciate the blasts. It will be a good contribution to a team, as well as an aid in soloing. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Star_Seer
So let me get this straight, the devs don't like stacking buffs and then they released VEATs???
No I don't get it...
Seems like a vendetta against defenders now.
You are right, they removed the ability to self buff recently. It was never part of their design. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Dersk
Most all targeted AE attacks (not cones) affect up to 16 targets. Defender, corrupter and blaster PBAEs are capped at 16, too. Without commenting on rains or patches, which I really can't recall offhand, fireball is the only tanker attack that hits more than 10, but ranged attackers aren't quite so limited.
Thats because Fireball is a ranged AoE.
the rule of thumb is:
Ranged AoE: 16 max
Ranged Cone: 10 max
Melee AoE: 10 max
Melee Cone: 5 max
Actual exceptions are things like Crowd Control, that can hit 10 foes being a melee cone and the new Dominator's Psichic Shockwave that is melee and can hit 16 foes.
Fiery Melee Breath of Fire and Ice Melee's Frost are considered ranged (take ranged aoe IOs and are enhanceable for range) and therefore can hit 10 foes each even if they use melee modifiers.
Defender's Radiation's Irradiate is PBAoE but is considered ranged (ranged mods) and so is capped at 16 foes.
There are other exceptions but those are the ones that come off the top of my head. -
Quote:Does not help soloing and that's the place where certain builds (not all) need help.Originally Posted by Raithnor_Mal
How about this idea: For every Buff the Defender casts that affects another player, a percentage of the Buff comes back to the caster.
As for the other points, debuffing sets are not in dire need of help either, they already benefit from all their debuffs. -
Quote:As I been told by Castle: too wrongs don't make a right.Originally Posted by Star_Seer
So by that logic tanks are are already obsolete due to IOs, so why are you punishing defenders by dissalowing self buffs?
In teams Defenders are already considered overpowered and the devs have expressed they are not really too happy with their power multiplier nature.
Any buff to the soloing experience must have minimal impact on their teaming capabilities, this includes their team support AND their personal safety in extreme hazard situations (teams.) -
Quote:Stand corrected on that one, but you still have the ability to get that aggro off your team mate by doing some damage to the target. Epics are ideal for this but you can always just go there.Originally Posted by Sarrate
Taunt alone won't do the trick, you need to deal damage in order to peel mobs off. I've noticed this every time I tested the aggro cap. Go to monkey island in PI and herd up 17 mobs and try to Taunt more - they will not come to you. Use a low damage ranged attack (like the crumby origin attack) and they'll suddenly be able to aggro onto you. (This is also when you'll lose one that was previously on you.) My suspicion is this is to prevent aggro capping youself (to say minions) then attacking a much harder target (EB/AV) without them being able to attack back.
Now, on a team it's possible that a mob dies and the fresh mob you Taunted will come to you, but it's not a guarantee (if mobs are taking a while to be put down or whatever). -
Quote:As I noted, there is only one set that does not have a form of damage boost: Force Fields.Originally Posted by Turbo_Ski
Damage advantage gained through -res/+dmg powers is irrelevant to the discussion since those aren't available in every set, and a 25% advantage in a -res/+dmg power doesn't translate into a 25% damage advantage. We're talking about base+inherent damage here, a subject that covers every level range and isn't balanced around when you finally get that special -res/+dmg power from whatever set you chose, if there even is one.
Of the remaining, Emp is the only one that can't use any of it's damage buffing solo and is limited to only buffing the team partially (due to very bad recharge/duration ratios) -
Quote:The threat to tanks is not a direct one. Not in all, and its a bit of a failed design but one of the things that make tankers useful in teams is that even if the defender makes everyone nigh-tanks, the defender himself is too vulnerable and needs aggro taken care off to keep the rest of the team alive.Originally Posted by Star_Seer
I highly dought that defenders are a threat to a tanks postion if they can self buff. At best they would have to take a third rate taunt from the presence pool to even have a chance of holding aggro.
There is no way in hell I would want a defender to try and tank for my fire/fire blaster, willpower tanks give me enough cause to hesitate already :P
Even if a defender can match the defence their resistance and hitpoint caps are not even in the same universe as a tanks.
If even the defender can tankify himself, then there is just no use for tankers to be on a team that has defenders on it. -
I take it Ski is talking about damage and sticking to the "there is enough survivability as it is" side of the arguments.
That being told, here is a quick breakdown of things:
Lets say you have 7 scrappers without criticals (for simplicity.) Now, they do base 1.125 damage and the defender does .65 damage.
All together, they do 8.525 dps (keeping it simple at one ds per second.)
Enhanced this goes to 16.62 dps.
Lets do the same now with corruptors: 7 scrappers and a corruptor. Lets assume that Scourge gives a 21% damage benefit, although this is extremely optimistic and only realistic soloing bosses/ebs/AVs and GMs.
The result is 8.78 total dps by the team or 17.13 once fully enhanced.
OK, the corruptor team puts a bit more damage. Lets give both ATs the Pool power Assault. That is for defenders 18.5% and for Corruptors 14.8%
Will skip the math but in the end:
Corruptor team 18.43 dps
Defender team 18.2 dps
OK, the corruptor wins by a hair. Now lets add Tar Patch to the mix. That power is 30% for defenders and 24% for corruptors. The end result is:
Corruptor team 22.85 dps
Defender team 23.66 dps
As you can see, the defender came up ahead rather fast. Lets remove Assault and relly purely on Tar Patch and we get:
Corruptor team 21.24
Defender team 21.61
Its by a hair but the defender team once more wins.
I ran the same test with 7 tankers and a defender, the team still got more damage from the defender than from the scrapper with the defender team being at 15.84 and the corruptor team being at 15.74, a very thin hair, but the defender team still is ahead.
In the end: I think defenders and corruptors will be rather interchangeable in basic teams, but trully min-maxed teams will prefer a defender over an equivalent corruptor. I can see them picking a Kin corruptor over a empath defender, though, but that happens right now with controllers.
Going Rogue will not make the defender any less desirable, it may, however, make it less popular than it already is as it's much less solo friendly than the corruptor equivalent while the corruptor equivalent will have almost as much demand in teams. This just brings the question of making defender solo experience more enjoyable but not as good as the corruptor. Well, I do can see the defender solo experience exceeding the corruptor only when heavy settup is involved (high debuff situations) that require a bit more gamble and risk plus more susceptibility to purple patch than the corruptor equivalent. -
Quote:Have you tried? Because that's not how the aggro cap works. If you see a team-mate in trouble, you can taunt his aggro even if you are at the cap. This guy will turn to you, and the guy that you have not touched the longest will ignore you and go for the next guy in his aggro list.Originally Posted by Xanatos_NA
Doubling the tanker aggro cap, but leaving every other AT at 17 would be a great solution. There's nothing worse than being at the cap, and then a team-mate aggro's another group. There is literally NOTHING you can do to take aggro off-of them.
Yes, its possible the next target is the same blaster you trying to save, but in my experience WHEN this happens the ones I loose go to the nearby scrapper when I'm trying to save the faraway debuffing defender.
This is just an argument to lower the brute/scrapper/whatever aggro caps, not increasing tanks. This would have a dangerous side effect of making the game a bit too easy for those ATs, though, because suddenly they just have to worry about only 7 or so foes ever aggroing them.Quote:THIS dynamic needs to be fixed. A tanker is, in my eyes, supposed to control aggro. Taking damage is just a part of that. If a tanker can only hold as much aggro as a scrapper/brute/whatever else then his role as the meat-shield is diminished. -
Quote:Allowing all defenders to use all buffs on self can be dangerous. Things would have to be done on a power-per power deal. One workaround I can see for Fortitude to buff self is making the power work on both, allies and foes. Then add two sets of effects, the normal current target buffs and duplicates that target self.Originally Posted by BlackSly
It seems possible to make an ally-buff power be also a self-buff at the same time. The limitation would be that you would need an allied target in range and LOS in order to be able to activate the power, but that could be circumvented by giving Defenders an inherent pet that has no game effect other than allowing you to fire off the ally buffs upon it.
The self target will only trigger if the targeted entitie is a foe. The targeted portion will only trigger if the target is an ally.
This would allow the power to still work only on as many entities as recharge dictates, but usable on either self OR ally, but not both at once.