Snow Globe

Again, thanks for finally explaining the reasons behind this change.

[ QUOTE ]
The reasoning behind this change was it made these badges a little TOO easy to get, there is a lot of Base Salvage sitting around in storage racks gathering database dust. Crafting the actual base items still count towards the badge (as they always have), it’s simply the conversion from Base-to-Invention that has been removed from counting.

[/ QUOTE ]
Actually, it was far more before issue 13. This is because you could convert Invention Salvage to Base Components, then convert those base components to empowerment buffs (which then were deleted).

Also, there is the fact that base salvage and brainstorms are a finite supply (unless you plan to reintroduce either).

[ QUOTE ]
We’re going to see what this does to the numbers of characters earning the Crafting badges through datamining. If, by the time Issue 14 is getting ready to launch, we see that it is now too hard to achieve those badges, then we will make another change to them (not saying that we will make the conversion count again, but that remains an option on the table in that case.)

[/ QUOTE ]
Can't you look back at the data and filter out "crafted salvage" or find out how many enhancements were crafted in Issue 12. That last should give you a clear idea how fast characters craft.

On the other hand, given the amount that has to be crafted for the last two badges (especially the last one), it doesn't seem unreasonable to reduce Fabricator a LOT. No character could possibly use all the crafts needed, and there isn't any easy way to get rid of the surplus.

[ QUOTE ]
Here’s a bit of a teaser: We have big plans for these (and other) badges, and we really want them to mean something to your character. If you are in a dialog tree that involves creating something, we have the ability to look at your badges and see if you have taken the effort to prove yourself as a crafter. This effort would be rewarded with special options in the dialog tree that earn you better results, enable you to skip steps, etc. For this system to work, we’ll need them to be a reasonable indicator of the amount of work a crafter has put into crafting. And it’s not just dialog trees that are going to look at badges, and it’s not just crafting badges that will be looked at, so you guys can speculate away!

[/ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the teaser, but it wasn't necessary. This could have waited for an official announcement.

First off, let me thank you for coming forward with this.

[ QUOTE ]
Fast Forward to Issue 13: Power and Responsibility. I am no longer “the man” when it comes to badges. Phil “Synapse” Zeleski has the dubious task of managing these and a lot of the other reward systems in CoH/V.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ooh, new target.

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Yes, I had heard the concerns of a few vocal badge aficionados, and I fell on the wrong side of the argument (it’s amazing, but sometimes being insulted makes you feel MORE right than you probably should).

[/ QUOTE ]
I've never doubted for a second you were human.

[ QUOTE ]
After sitting down with Phil and going over the history of EVERYTHING badge related with this issue, Phil and I decided to go back and reinstate the Reformed badge for Heroes. This will be in Issue 14: Architect, but your credit should still be being counted from now until that releases. Of course, you have no progress bar, and something might have happened elsewhere that I don’t know about, so if you really want to make progress towards the badge, I would wait until Issue 14 is released to do it.

[/ QUOTE ]
Thank you both.

As a final point, you two need to decide about these badges as well:
<ul type="square">[*]Hero accessible only with the 1st mission villain side during the Valentine's event.
* Coldblooded | Coldhearted
* Hellfrost Gladiator
* Weed Whacker
* Hordeling Lasher Gladiator[*] Villain accessible only through winter event.
* Cap Buster
* Bane of Dannon[*]Hero side extremely rare spawns
* Venomous
* Tarantula Gladiator
* Ink Man Gladiator &lt;-Talos Safeguard is the only mission blue side that has Blue Ink Men. (edit: a couple are in Siren's Call as well)[*]Villain side extremely rare spawns
* Weatherman/Weatherwoman &lt;-only 3 Outcast bosses total in CoV, under highly select conditions.
* Skull Crusher &lt;-Atlas Park mayhem, and radio missions.
* Regenerator &lt;-Atlas Park mayhem, and radio missions.
* Illusionist &lt;- Radio missions
* Untouchable (see note below)[/list]The problem is that at least two of the villain badges (Cap Buster and Untouchable) unlock custom weapons.

Someone really needs to look at those COV family though. The untouchable badge requires CoH Family bosses, they are sparsely scattered in missions and in Nerva, and some of the Family bosses in Nerva give credit towards gangbuster instead. Ask Phil and the people that place mobs to look at the family bosses for Marcone in the description (placed mobs in Nerva and Sharkhead).

Edit:
Also when the rewards were removed from the infamous family farms, those family bosses lost all ability to earn credit towards the Untouchable badge.

Just tried this on the test server.

Scorpion - Uses secondary color (one of the inverted symbols).
Skull - appears, but extremely low-res
Skull with crossbones - appears, but extremely low-res

Did you use black or other dark color?

[ QUOTE ]
You and Snow are just Godwin's Law Deniers.

[/ QUOTE ]
No, I just think there needs to be a better standard than you just tried to apply.

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Some of the images I tried are not the ones listed, even though my default symbol was on the list.

[/ QUOTE ]
Which ones exactly?

[ QUOTE ]
Oblique Nazi reference.

I am hereby officially invoking Godwin's Law and declaring the thread to be at an end.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm pretty sure that has to be a direct reference, not oblique.

Quoting the link you gave:
[ QUOTE ]
It is considered poor form to raise such a comparison arbitrarily with the motive of ending the thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

Order is wrong.

PVP, Bases, THEN badges, then the Marketplace (lost out of sales of the crafting results).

[ QUOTE ]
They'll get to it later, because invariably, there'll be a similar issue with another badge or something, and it will have a similar reason behind why a change was made. It's happened before.

[/ QUOTE ]
That is exactly why the silence is so troubling. Because when they don't talk about the changes future changes tend to be even worse.

[ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
There was nothing preventing direct developer response in closed beta (player concerns fell on deaf ears then). There was a opportunity that they let slip through their fingers when they failed to be up front with the players.


[/ QUOTE ]

Personally, I think this issue is more about the players being too stubborn to accept the reasons that were given for those particular changes. I don't think there's very many people that could honestly say they were completely happy with pre-I13 PvP. When the Devs made steps to change it, players suddenly cried foul. They cried knowing that the Devs were only partially done with said changes (still working on Zones and Raiding). When you get yelled at for not doing something, and then yelled at again by the same people when you do do something, isn't that a confusing message the players are sending to the Devs?

[/ QUOTE ]
Here is the problem:
<ul type="square">[*]Base salvage was never identified by players as being a problem. We had a lot of higher priority issues. One of them was made worse with the change.[*]The announced base changes happened in a PVP thread (which Sunstorm admitted that the Base Raiders are only one of three groups in the base building community).[*]The removal affected not only affected base builders, but it also affected badge collectors (seeking crafting badges) and caused problems with supply in the markets (at a time when the markets were going to get pummeled with dual builds and merits).[*]They created yet another monetary system and unleashed it to the public without fixing existing security holes creating an even worse problem with group leaders.[/list]Others in the closed beta gave the developers the same list of concerns (while I was on the outside saying the same thing), we (base builders) made them aware of these facts during open beta, and people came forward after it went live yet the only reason given was that "base salvage was too confusing". Sorry, but I don't like thinking I'm being lied to.

Now to add insult to injury, credit for the crafting badges got further nerfed with the change of crafting to or from Brainstorms not giving credit.

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The problem isn't that these issues are bugs, it is that they are considered "working as designed" without explanation even though the changes are detrimental in the player's eyes

[/ QUOTE ]

I hope you don't mean all players' eyes, because there are plenty of folks that don't care one way or the other about changes to badges, or changes to crafting, or any other little change you can name. As has been said by many, everyone's idea of fun is different. There are few changes that affect everyone.

[/ QUOTE ]
I specifically avoided saying everyone. However I've talked to players that do not come to the forums, who don't care about badges or base designers, and are long time players yet even they are shaking their heads over these changes.

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There should be nothing preventing the community reps from telling the team that players are upset because of X, getting a response, and then relaying a response back to the players.


[/ QUOTE ]

There shouldn't, but there is. It's called a PR department. The Devs don't have free reign to respond to every concern, especially when it deals with any future content. It sucks, but that's the way it goes.

[/ QUOTE ]
I've said it before, and I'll likely say it again: The marketing division is the Achilles Heel of this game. The list of bad decisions that could be directly traced back to it is monumental. The exclusive deal with Wal-Mart comes instantly to mind. That survey that keeps popping up for another example.

This week we did have someone double check on the spelling/grammar this issue. While we do check for spelling/grammar, we don't want to edit out the person being interviewed personality either.

The group name did get caught by the proofreader, but apparently too late (and too vaguely) to be more correct than the acronym.

[ QUOTE ]
I see by this response you missed the point of my previous post.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think I got it. I don't think that you've gotten my point. The developer team is compartmentalized. There should be nothing preventing the community reps from telling the team that players are upset because of X, getting a response, and then relaying a response back to the players.

There was nothing preventing direct developer response in closed beta (player concerns fell on deaf ears then). There was a opportunity that they let slip through their fingers when they failed to be up front with the players.

We understand that they are human. Yes, some of us are frustrated. A lot of PVPers quit. Who's next?

[ QUOTE ]
We get that you and the like-minded are upset. 100x, we get it. The Devs get it too, as evidenced by recent posts. You keep saying they aren't explaining things, and yet we're told that the Devs have their hands full with new stuff at the moment.

[/ QUOTE ]
Which ones? Those from BAB? As BAB said, he isn't the one responsible for these decisions.

[ QUOTE ]
We also know that Ex, who is our sole Community Rep after Lighthouse left, has her hands full with two jobs.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ex moved into Lighthouse's spot, true. Niviene moved into Ex's old spot.

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure what you're expecting, as far as what a reasonable response time should be. When they say "We can't talk about it yet" people get upset because they think the Devs are witholding info. When they say "We'll get back to you on that (or something along those lines)" people get upset because they think they're getting blown off. Neither one is true. When they have a better answer, they'll give it, and not before.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yet we did not get either "We can't talk about it yet" or "We'll get back to you on that". Instead, Ex responded "We are aware internally of the badgers concerns over the removal of this badge. However at this time the Developers are choosing to not comment."

Not that they will get back at a later date, just that they don't want to comment at all.

Heck, I'd love it if they could at least say that several bugs in the base editor and the badge system will be fixed for issue 14 or 15. While some of the bugs are not trivial, other long standing ones are trivial. We've suggested plenty of solutions, some of which only need text changes.

However, getting an acknowledgment that they are at least planning to address some of the player concerns that they ignored during both Issue 13 closed and open beta would possibly help. However it would have helped more during closed beta, or at the release to the live servers at the latest.

[ QUOTE ]
When there's a shift in the flow of info, how is it logical to jump to the conclusion that there's been some sort of policy change, as many have alluded to?

[/ QUOTE ]
Well, in the Brainstorms not counting for crafting I didn't have to jump to any conclusion. I took the Lead Developer at his word (you think I'd quit doing that by this point) and trusted that what he said was true. Then we got a change (without a patch note) that upended that word. The patch note was then added retroactively. You can only do this so many times before people hear "trust us" and they stop believing the person.

Player trust has been lost. What is being done to restore it?

[ QUOTE ]
does it really make any sense to keep asking, and asking, and asking (sometimes in a demanding tone) the same questions?

[/ QUOTE ]
I want to believe the developers, but I've been burned too many times recently. Vague promises that "it will be better" just are not stepping up to the task.

[ QUOTE ]
Believe me, I want the buggy stuff fixed too

[/ QUOTE ]
The problem isn't that these issues are bugs, it is that they are considered "working as designed" without explanation even though the changes are detrimental in the player's eyes. If an explanation is given then it has to be at least believable (base salvage being too complicated to understand was not).

I agree that blaming anyone at this point would be counter productive. However I would like your (and other people's) ideas on how we could try to prevent problems like this happening again.

Maybe we should ask for a set maximum of priority pictures, and a link to a larger gallery.

I'll see what we can do in the future to try minimize this from happening again.

[ QUOTE ]
No...see, "waiting" implies that you cease your actions and allow what you're waiting for to happen (a response).

[/ QUOTE ]
Actually waiting in this case could also be defined as "expecting", and that implies no such thing as ceasing actions. Additionally it could also mean any period of time between asking for an answer and finally getting one. If you are going to say someone is implying something you might not want to narrowly define a potentially vague term.

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The most vocal players in this thread are not waiting, nor have they been waiting, nor will they wait. They continue to press the issue at every opportunity, thereby making it a one-sided struggle.

[/ QUOTE ]
Well as part of running a fan newsletter, at least part of my duties are fact-finding and being a reporter.

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The avalanche of "why won't they say something?1!!?" or "still no answers even though it's been ten minutes since my last post on the same subject" makes the perceived silence from the Devs worse than it actually is.

[/ QUOTE ]
No, the 4 month delay (since the start of Issue 13 Closed Beta) for a believable response as to why base salvage was removed makes the silence from the developers worse than it should have been. The lame duck "party line" reply that Sunstorm made two months ago isn't believable by anyone on these forums except possibly the Red Names.

Making more changes that upset players with no explanation is only fueling the hostility against the developers. Going back on the lead developer's statements without explanation is just the icing on the cake of the whole thing.

[ QUOTE ]
Next, it'll be posts claiming that the Devs are hatching a Nemesis plot.

[/ QUOTE ]
You kidding? At this point the developers ARE a Nemesis plot.

[ QUOTE ]
Of course not, and we have a good time. :P

Our only annoyance is, why was it labeled as P.O.T. and not our full name, Pinnacle on Tap?

[/ QUOTE ]
Layout was not provided with the full name and had to infer it from the screenshots.

For anyone wishing to submit their base in the future, I would suggest including your group's name in one of the responses.

[ QUOTE ]
Hm, no pics of our extraordinary movie theater either that I can see.

Ah well, still very cool!

[/ QUOTE ]
Well there is one of the projection booth. You submitted 30 pictures. We used 20 of them. While we would love to include as many pictures as possible, sometimes there just isn't room for all of them.

Here are the pictures we didn't use:

club six pack
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot03.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot04.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot06.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot08.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...lla/pot09c.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot09.jpg

Theater
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot11.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot12.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot14.jpg
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...illa/pot15.jpg

[ QUOTE ]
We're departmentalized here. The people who would be responsible for fixing things like game crashes, bugs with text chat, etc are not the same people who do things like tweak powers, change badges, or fiddle with animation/FX. I've said this many times before, but people keep using this "Why did they do X instead of fixing Y" arguement and unless you're a producer here, you cannot know which things are getting addressed in lieu of other things. (I myself only know which animation/FX issues are taking priority of other animation/FX issues)

[/ QUOTE ]
I get this. I really do. However at that point I would like to say that I would like a response from some of the following people:

* The producer. &lt;-The buck stops at this point.
* Positron as the lead developer (and at last I've heard badge person) he is supposed to be "in charge" of the day to day operations.
* If Positron is not the badge person, that person has a LOT of explaining to do in regards to both the reformed and the brainstorm crafting issues.
* Sunstorm or whoever is in charge of salvage. The removal of base salvage was not adequately explained, and despite how the player base's reaction, was shoved down our throats.

[ QUOTE ]
After all this, aren't we about due a "The developers are aware of these concerns but choose not to reply." I wouldn't be happy with it, I think we deserve something more, particularly given the quotes found from Positron and that old bit about "give the players what they want within reason", but doubt we'll get it. But I really did expect at least something recognizing the unhappiness over this.

[/ QUOTE ]
At a guess, it will likely be a bullet point from the community reps at a meeting talking about player feedback. Something along the lines of "Players are upset about this change."

Then they'll have to debate this or something else they deem more important (at which point this will get lost in the shuffle).

[ QUOTE ]
But I’m still not onboard with your idea to reduce the craftings needed for Fabricator. Sorry. Truth be told, I’d have been [/i] much[/i] happier if things had remained as they were. Since that clearly isn’t going to happen, returning the crafting credit for brainstorm conversions only seems fair.

[/ QUOTE ]
I can understand your position on this. For myself, returning the crafting credit for brainstorm conversions and fixing the ability to remove buffs from the icon bar is the absolute minimum that needs to happen.

[ QUOTE ]
I meant that it would have been nice for them to allow a last-minute opportunity for those who intended to use the base salvage --&gt; brainstorm --&gt; IO salvage route to Fabricator to do so before the door was slammed in our faces.

[/ QUOTE ]
Given the large amount of brainstorms and base salvage floating around, I doubt that anyone could hold that much salvage.

[ QUOTE ]
(IMO) - Odds are anyone arguing this should be the case, already has it on their 'main' badger(s?) or they're just a hater.

[/ QUOTE ]
Or perhaps just someone who doesn't want options removed, even if they never intend to use that option themselves.

I don't have fabricator (I'm around 1,800 crafts) on my badge character. I could see where people are upset over its removal though.

As to being able to delete buffs from the powers window, that is prone to accidentally deleting something by mistake.

Edit: I just tested this with the +Run Speed enhancement, and you [u]CAN NOT[u] delete the buff.

[ QUOTE ]
I think that the worst side effect of these changes is this:

Not what it does to the badge community, but what it does to the regular playerbase.

I'm a perfect example of this. I'm not a badger, but at one point I thought that one of my characters might be able to get Fabricator. I was actually looking forward to it. I like the accolade powers, even that silly freeze pistol that you get off the Crey that never hits anything.

But now I know that I will never get Fabricator. 10,000 crafts? Sorry, I probably won't craft 10,000 things over the entire lifespan of this game. I'm a casual player, remember us? Because of that Empath and Fabricator will forever be out of my reach.

[/ QUOTE ]
Well to be fair, Fabricator is not a requirement for the Field Crafter accolade. "Only" Master Craftsman (1,000 crafts) is needed for it. The only "official" epic badge required for an accolade is the 4th debt badge. The damage taken one might as well be though. (Both villain side).

The sad thing is that while the developers seem to want to stretch out the time it takes to get badges, they are shooting themselves in the foot by putting them so far out of reach that players just give up. The carrot doesn't work if it is too far out of sight.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

http://coh.nofuture.org.uk/digest/in...p;post=7984068
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Master Craftsman isn't impossible for a character to get sub-40, especially if they are crafting for most of their levelling. That series of badges counts ANY use of a crafting table (converting base salvage as well), and the other badges needed for the Accolade get you almost halfway to Master Craftsman on their own.

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, you’re correct that the “any crafting = credit toward Fabricator” rule has been rescinded. But I still don’t see this as automatically requiring an epic level badge to be rolled back. (I didn’t agree with dropping the Zookeeper numbers either, as a matter of fact). At a mere 2000 craftings, by the time someone has obtained all of the common IO crafting badges and gotten the Workbench power, they will be nearly half way to Fabricator. I really do see dropping badge requirements as cheapening the effort that the players put into obtaining them in the first place.

[/ QUOTE ]
The formerly legitimate (and Dev approved by Positron's own words) methods (not only base salvage, but also making/deleting empowerment buffs) have now been removed. I would say that at least 2/3 the crafts needed for the Master Craftsman AND Fabricator have been removed. Basic IOs count for around 460 crafts.

[ QUOTE ]
Now GadgetDon made a good point in saying that the base salvage --&gt; base component method of gaining progress toward Fabricator has been removed. And this is something that could be discussed. But still… I believe that reducing a badge requirement should be a very rare thing, like in the case of an obvious bug or order-of-magnitude error (*looks sideways at Empath*). I just don’t think that this one change rises to the level of problem that would necessitate a rollback of the effort that a LOT of people put into Fabricator when it first appeared.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ok, I'd settle for them to keep the badge at 10,000 crafts if:
<ul type="square">[*] They restore the base salvage drops.[*] They restore the base salvage recipes.[*] They restore the inventions to base salvage conversions[*] They restore all crafts at any table to count towards the crafting badges[*] The restored ability to delete empowerment buffs.[/list]The developers actions have put these badges out of player reach. Now it is their responsibility to balance the badges that were unbalanced by their actions.

Current Sequence:

1. Artisan Badge (50 items crafted)
2. Master Artisan Badge (100 items crafted)
&lt;- All the 10-40 badges would get players to here.
3. Craftsman Badge (500 items crafted)
4. Master Craftsman Badge (1,000 items crafted)
5. Fabricator Badge (10,000 items crafted)

Note that even the current sequence isn't "even" and Fabricator is about double of what the sequence "should be".

Proposed Sequence:

1. Artisan Badge (75 items crafted)
2. Master Artisan Badge (125 items crafted)
3. Craftsman Badge (250 items crafted)
&lt;- All the 10-40 badges would get players to here.
4. Master Craftsman Badge (750 items crafted) This would set the badge at just under double the crafts needed for the 10-40 IO badges.
5. Fabricator Badge (1,500 items crafted) This would be double the amount of the Master craftsman badge.

Even if the developers insist in keeping Master Craftsman at 1,000 crafts, then Fabricator needs reducing. 2,000 to 2,500 seems to be a right number if Master Craftsman is left alone.

[ QUOTE ]
Now I DO agree with those complaining about the way this change was made as a stealth-nerf. THAT was uncool. And like I already said, a little advanced warning would have been appropriate.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think advanced warning would have helped a lot, because even with well-reasoned arguments a lot of player hated changes got shoved down our throats without any explanations.

[ QUOTE ]
There are 4 reasons to block teleport function:
- Prevent using teleport-self powers. No reason to do that in a tiny zone, and other travel powers are unaffected. And why teleport-specific if they could turn off all powers? (eg, dont' tell me Shield Charge was broken if I can still drop Rain of Fire if I want to.)
- Prevent you from teleporting others. Unlike Pocket D, where there were hero-only and villain-only areas, there's no exploit in the MC where pulling your friends somewhere would be an exploit.
- Prevent you from getting teleported by others. We have teleport prompts. And again, there are no hero-only or villain-only spots like pocket D, so I can't see a place where it'd annoy someone if they got brought there.
- Prevent using the zone teleport powers. Base-, Market-, PocketD- and Mission- Porters. There's already code to stop people from using such powers to go to the wrong faction places. There's no limit on Obos portals. I can't fathom a reason to limit this, especially with the desire to use these with a contact in the MC giving a mission.

[/ QUOTE ]
Actually I can think of:
- Prevent people from getting teleported to a VIP area, (AKA VIP lounge). Perhaps (and this is pure speculation) there will be a special area with the magic booster. This sort of fits as the Midnighter Club is a magic based group, and would be a possible perk for buying the booster pack.

Also the Ouroboros Zone is not a co-op zone (separate instances for heroes and villains). The Pocket D, Cimerora, Midnighter Club Rikti War Zones are all co-op.

[ QUOTE ]
It takes 453 specific craftings to get the 36 recipe memorization badges required for Field Crafter.

That leaves 547 craftings to grind out to finish off Master Craftsman to get the Accolade.

That was already a large number to start with.

It took a big hit in I13 with Empowerment changes. Pre-I13 the average recipe meant 4 craftings per one buff; 3 components and the buff itself. Now you get 1 crafting per buff, and it demands the same salvage that would be going in to the memorization recipes. You also can't get crafting credit by making components for others to buff with.

Now it's taken another hit with no Brainstorm progress.

I'm just not seeing how this is still possible before level 40.
Perhaps Field Crafter needs to drop the Master Craftsman requirement and just require 47 craftings to finish off Craftsman?

[/ QUOTE ]
Not only Master Craftsman, but what about Fabricator (10k crafts)? At this point Fabricator would take the equal of crafting the full set of 10-40 IO Badges for 22 characters.

Seriously doubt anyone would do this, even with an abundance of invention salvage (which at last glance doesn't exist).

[ QUOTE ]
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As to the Brainstorm conversions: in light of this change Fabricator should be reduced to 2,000 crafts. The 1,000 to 10,000 jump never made much sense anyways.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not at all.

I got it well before brainstorms ever existed. So did every other person who really wanted it. Fabricator is an epic badge. It was obviously intended to require epic level effort to receive. So a later issue has a feature that makes it much easier to get the epic badge, but that ability was unintended, how does the removal of that feature somehow retroactively mean that the badge was never intended to be epic in the first place? Heck, when Fabricator's requirements were set the Devs probably hadn't even considered removing base salvage yet or creating the whole Brainstorm system.

The badge is still available (not like some &gt;cough&lt. Anyone can still get it the same way everyone else got it prior to i13. Easy-mode for this badge has been removed, that's all.

[/ QUOTE ]
Zub, I respect you a lot, but you are wrong. If the forum monster didn't purge a couple of threads in this section, I would be able to directly link you to Positron's posts.

Good thing that Red Tomax City of Digest keeps copies :
http://coh.nofuture.org.uk/digest/in...p;post=7984068
[ QUOTE ]
Master Craftsman isn't impossible for a character to get sub-40, especially if they are crafting for most of their levelling. That series of badges counts ANY use of a crafting table (converting base salvage as well), and the other badges needed for the Accolade get you almost halfway to Master Craftsman on their own.

[/ QUOTE ]

http://coh.nofuture.org.uk/digest/in...p;post=8018477
[ QUOTE ]
The "1000" badge is for any use of the crafting table... making base items, converting Salvage, etc. all count towards it. Not just Enhancements.

[/ QUOTE ]
They are going back on Positron's words that any use of the crafting tables count for that series of badges.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) You are being far too literal in reading the badge text/name.
2) There was a way to fix this without any coding needed: Change the text &amp; name of the badge.

[/ QUOTE ]
course, prior to this change, I didn't hear anyone raise issue with the roleplay elements of this badge. Did you? (Snow, you made the last list of badge issues. If anyone can come up with evidence to the contrary, you can.)

[/ QUOTE ]
Not to my knowledge or my backup list.

[ QUOTE ]
People did raise other roleplay issues with badge text. Issues that got fixed.
Ergo, it seems the community was happy with the roleplay text up until now, when people are trying to force it into some justification for an unrelated change.

[/ QUOTE ]
I keep saying people are raising their expectations over flimsy evidence. The developers at this point are doing themselves more harm than good by keeping silent on this. There is no way they could meet expectations at this point and the alleged feature hasn't even been announced.