SingStar

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Do they expect me to log onto the game now and have FUN?!?!!? Are they mad?!?!

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Do they expect people who have farmed a level or two (or fifty) to log in and play on their characters now?

No point in going back to normal-levelling a toon you've farmed up a few levels because they might nerf you.

No point in starting a new toon, either, because there's no-one to group with outside of the MA, which is of course verboten. It's still going on, of course, as the average CoHer doesn't read the forums and is still 'LFF' in Atlas.

Nice one, Shadow of Almighty Positron, you're really encouraging us, here.

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Yeah, don't do anything because we might consider it an exploit and smack you for it, just being good in a good team, getting insane xp because you have a good mix in a team of really good players is just soo wrong, isn't it.

Being vague was how Bush messed up the US totally and made it an undemocratic semi-fascist country (imho). "There's a threat, we can't say anymore, but be afraid and let us torture anyone we want. Trust us, we just cheated our way to the white house, but we really care". Ok, that was perhaps a bit over the top, but I'm off for the day, so I had to end with a totally over the top statement!

...and I'd be ok with posi saying he'll go hard on people continuing to explicitly try to exploit the system repeatedly. That's good bussiness!

But going back kicking on the people that "abused" the system while it was there. That's bad bussiness!

Edit: Imho you'd better go back and nerf any heroes that used Dreck, or villains that farmed the TV mission. Do you seriously suggest that? Anyone?

Yes, this was bad, and a harder stance against "abuse" is probably a good idea. But omg they're bad at PR and bussiness...

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Again farming comm officers is NOT an exploit.
I wrote several petitions in beta how easy those mobs can be farmed for xp.....they knew it.

If the devs thought of comm officers to be an exploit they could have removed them 1 week after I14 went live and it became obvious... they didnt.
But they did remove other mobs like prisoners in one day without much trouble.

They knew it, they could have removed the comm officers from MA in one day... they didnt.. so they have no right to blame players now.

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God.mmit! You're my hero, my idol! I think I love you, but not in - that - way!

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Soooo if i understand correctly.

You see a wallet on the table next to you. You tell the person whoms wallet it is, that a thief could grab it. He replies politely but the wallet stay on the table. It ends when you steal the wallet from the table and run away.

After all you did WARN him that there are thieves and that they could steal his wallet right?

So that means that you are NOT a thief right?

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One simple response: Comparison invalid: Useless!

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Wrong

Exploiting is illegal (in this game)
Stealing is illegal

stealing after warning is illegal
exploiting after warning is illegal

Comparison is very valid.

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Stealing an apple is illegal!
Killing 12 million people illegal!

Do you wanna compare those two?

Comparison rediculously invalid! NOONE got hurt IN ANY WAY by what the farmers did. Sure, I don't care what happens to them, besides the important point: How does it affect the game. It will affect the game badly whatever they end up doing now:

1. Do nothing, or very little: Loose credibility
2. Smack down hard: People leave: game dead!

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Again farming comm officers is NOT an exploit.
I wrote several petitions in beta how easy those mobs can be farmed for xp.....they knew it.

If the devs thought of comm officers to be an exploit they could have removed them 1 week after I14 went live and it became obvious... they didnt.
But they did remove other mobs like prisoners in one day without much trouble.

They knew it, they could have removed the comm officers from MA in one day... they didnt.. so they have no right to blame players now.

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God.mmit! You're my hero, my idol! I think I love you, but not in - that - way!

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Soooo if i understand correctly.

You see a wallet on the table next to you. You tell the person whoms wallet it is, that a thief could grab it. He replies politely but the wallet stay on the table. It ends when you steal the wallet from the table and run away.

After all you did WARN him that there are thieves and that they could steal his wallet right?

So that means that you are NOT a thief right?

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One simple response: Comparison invalid: Useless!
Edit: Explanation apparently required: Noone got robbed!

Ok, here's some more "great" suggestions:

Get rid of Freaks totally, they're so farmable
Get rid of the LK/SK system, because you can team with 7 ice/kin corruptors that nuke the living daylight out of anything
Get rid of ouroboros totally, it just has to go
Get rid of all the players because any team is clearly an exploit
get rid of inventions to stop interest in farming
..and the market of course, and inf, just let us chose whatever DO/SO we want whenever.
come to think of it there's so much to get rid of we'd better just get rid of the whole game!

oh, forgot, that IS Posi's plan!

ok, all of you that didn't like the farms:
How many of you used that red little button, complaining about it?

I've got one complaint of one of my missions for swearing, rather funny since there was no abusive language at all, but...

All you high and mighty "police officers" out there could've helped and I bet few of you did it, but now you've got time to spare whining about it on the forums that no devs read, instead of using the GLOBAL MA system to make an impact. I've reported AND commented several arcs for other things, and some where removed, others where actually "fixed".

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Again farming comm officers is NOT an exploit.
I wrote several petitions in beta how easy those mobs can be farmed for xp.....they knew it.

If the devs thought of comm officers to be an exploit they could have removed them 1 week after I14 went live and it became obvious... they didnt.
But they did remove other mobs like prisoners in one day without much trouble.

They knew it, they could have removed the comm officers from MA in one day... they didnt.. so they have no right to blame players now.

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God.mmit! You're my hero, my idol! I think I love you, but not in - that - way!

Why the - something - can't they hire some proper PR folks that actually KNOW what they're doing.

I still think this game should be as huuge as EVE, Lotro and some other games out there, even if it's getting rather obviously old. At times I can't stand the game I love because how they handle it.

I just think this was another nail in the coffin and hope it staggers on until something new and shine comes my way - not talking about CO or any other similar stuff.

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Scheses, you just don't WANT to even TRY to consider what the rest of us are saying:

WE AGREE: FARMING BAD!
WE AGREE: GOTTA DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!

BUT! And it's a big friggin' whoppin' whoooopin' BUT:
They COULD have done something, but chose not to for days. They COULD have done a lot of things, but chose not to do any of them and NOW they're gonna PUNISH people for THEIR mistake (e.g. not doing anything once the problem surfaced) in a time when they're about to face some SERIOUS competition.

We can all agree on the idea of getting those "6-account 30 new 50s in a few days" a good slap on the wrist but if they do that, someone has to draw a very shaky line somewhere.

THEY dropped the ball. THEY chose not to pick it up, and I bet they'll go on a whining spree when the other team scores.

YES, players used something that was *very obviously there*. It wasn't hidden and it got so widely abused even us non-grinders just HAD to test it to seee if it was as bad as people said, and yes it was and they still left it in there for days. It's like going to a prison full of murderers and rapists, giving them a bunch of high powered weapons and a free pass to the nearest girls-only party. Yes, that was a blatant disgusting, outrageous comparison, but god(censored) it applies. So give me a friggin forum ban for it and see me moan about that! (It's what I do(tm))

I'm mosty annoyed about that: They did nothing. Going mental now, as they're doing is too much too late.

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Not entirely true.
1) They put that paragraph GG pointed out.
2) They put farm-related terms into banlist in the very first patch.
3) They tried to fix most egregious exploits, like aforementioned multi-bubbling.
That's hardly "nothing".

Now, the only mistake they made is that threat of retroactive bannhammer, which made many people (including me) nervous. But, TBH, almost everything else they could do would cause adverse rreaction of some sort. (First Law of MMO, - devs never do things right, never ever.) Either some people would complain that measures were too harsh and indiscriminate or they would complain they weren't enough.

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If you look back, you'll see they could've done a LOT of things and chose not to. They left the RCOs in forever, probably causing that horrible rubberbanding/DC'ing [censored]. I hated that, and every day I hoped to get a patch that would rectify the situation!

I don't blame the players for using what was there, but I do blame the devs for not fixing it sooner and now taking it out on the players. They took down CoP (and it never came back btw) and I'd rather see them get rid of MA until they've re-thought it properly. Blaming the player base for doing what players do is childish, as childish as the farming whiners whining about them doing something about it.

They just seen intent on killing another of their MMOs. They're getting BLOODY good at that.

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Well, are you one of dev team members? If not, how do you know what they could and couldn't do? (Remember what sort of wail temporary removal of Prisoners caused? If they had to do something like that with Rikti, one of the game's signature factions, they as well might shut down the entire MA.

And fixing RCOs without removing them first might have taken that long. Of course,you might not believe devs' explaination that taking mobs out of MA makes fixing and reintroducing fixed version(*) much, much easier... But it looks plausible enough for me. ) Plus, anyone paying attention to test server or forum knew of RCO nerf well in advance, despite devs' explicit policy to not to announce exploit fixes until after it's fixed on live. Yes, rationale for that policy doesn't apply here, everyone knew those exploits anyway, but well, they stuck to it.

(*) notice the language in patchnotes, it implies that RCOs that spawn now are entirely different mob as far as the game engine is concerned.

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Uh, did I miss something. NOONEs complaining they got rid of the com officers. They left the game running for days knowing very well people would abuse it madly (NO I DIDN'T, GET IT???). They didn't even try to police the arcs or put out the obvious "goddammit, keep playing those arcs repeatedly and we'll smack you in the head".

I'm not saying they threw a bate at us, hoping for us to bite - intentionally - but they do have a weird way of taking care of the game.

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But comparing Positron to Bush? Isn't that a bit harsh?

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Um, if the shoe fits! This is a very typical post 9/11 reaction imho. Panic, drop a nuke, wonder why people hate you for doing it!

Paragon needs their own Obama, obviously! War Witch for president!

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I would vote for her.

But I think Positron made a bold step. Better late then never. How they will do this thing we will find out soon.

Will this be a fullscaled invasion or just some UN sanctions as a warning. Time will tell.

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Well, if they do pretty much nothing, they've REALLY killed off the game, because noone will heed the next warning.

They've painted themselves into a very small corner and now they can't go POOO until the paint is dry. Knowing them, I'd bet they'll POOO in the corner getting stuck with the smell.

Oh, heal badges, damage badges, held badges!
Noone exploiting game features there?

Yes, kick, ban, execute them all, including me for that!

It's one thing if they'd always been harsh to players, but starting after 5 years in a game that survived itself due to lack of competition (imho). We're talking bussiness here, and they don't know anything about it.

Edit: Not even talking about the stupid villain side weatherman badge...

Oh, by the way: Golden Girl abused the Recluse's victory turret grind for HOURS!

So did a lot others! We'd better data mine and steal those badges back! It was OBVIOUSLY an exploit and really hurt a lot of other players! (Yes, you ... it was a friggin' joke)

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But comparing Positron to Bush? Isn't that a bit harsh?

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Um, if the shoe fits! This is a very typical post 9/11 reaction imho. Panic, drop a nuke, wonder why people hate you for doing it!

Paragon needs their own Obama, obviously! War Witch for president!

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What about those people that heard about this and said:
"No it can't seriously be true?"

They go'n'try it, get 8 levels, leave disguested and end up getting their character locked because they did try it!

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Those are the players we're about to cull, we've taken out the PvPers and those who yearn for Dev Created Content already. Its all set out in the new manifesto.

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Yup, it's all part of scamming the investors somehow. Guild Wars next. Servers closing in 3 months [SIC]

This is just ED all over again!

What about those people that heard about this and said:
"No it can't seriously be true?"

They go'n'try it, get 8 levels, leave disguested and end up getting their character locked because they did try it!

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for me this "so called farming" made me feel like it was a game again and not a chore as i nor did the team had to run to the market or some other places and wait, for i never really like the idea of the market when it came out but i had fun in theser teams as people was joking making it fun for me. but now it seem we have to work in this game as it meant to be a job or something and not a fun thing to do >.> i come here for a socail life like many oother but i must be punished to make the game work there way <.<

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I really hope that was a joke post - seriously, I'm full of LOL

@Sing Star - so how many toons did you get from 1-50 and are now worried about?

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You little [censored]: I didn't farm. I tried ONE mission ONCE, and guess what: It was on my main 50, Sing Star!

That's my point: I don't care about that at all, but Posi's killing the game. Imagine this: Me and FFM actually AGREEs on something. That's a bloody first, not counting us both moaning about this useless forum system!

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It was not an exploit I hear people say.

Hello?

Did the Devs create a tool intended to be used as a quick farming device? NO THEY DID NOT.

They gave us a tool which as an unforeseen side effect proved to be the ultimate farming tool. A tool so efficient that any other farming methods pale by comparison. Even farmers started to complain about this!

This was common knowledge. And if you did not realize that, then you should stop playing this game because you are to young to do so unsupervised.

So what is it called when people misuse a tool like that to gain an advantage they should not have?

An exploit.

You do the crime, you do the time.

I think it a very good thing that they step on this once and for all. I just hope they do this with full speed and are not afraid to do more then a little slap on the wrist.

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It wasn't hard to find!
It was WIDELY used for DAYS!
It was KNOWN to the devs that people where WIDELY using it!
Devs did nothing for DAYS!
and no, it wasn't an obvious exploit for a lot of players, since obviously a lot of them where very new to the game.

So, how do you KNOW when something is against the Eula or an exploit? Where do you draw the line? and how does it benefit the game?

I'm REALLY glad the "exploit" is gone. REALLY, REALLY happy. I'm NOT happy about Mr Republican neo-Bush alias Posi is going about it. It's bad for the game. That's my one and only point.

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Scheses, you just don't WANT to even TRY to consider what the rest of us are saying:

WE AGREE: FARMING BAD!
WE AGREE: GOTTA DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!

BUT! And it's a big friggin' whoppin' whoooopin' BUT:
They COULD have done something, but chose not to for days. They COULD have done a lot of things, but chose not to do any of them and NOW they're gonna PUNISH people for THEIR mistake (e.g. not doing anything once the problem surfaced) in a time when they're about to face some SERIOUS competition.

We can all agree on the idea of getting those "6-account 30 new 50s in a few days" a good slap on the wrist but if they do that, someone has to draw a very shaky line somewhere.

THEY dropped the ball. THEY chose not to pick it up, and I bet they'll go on a whining spree when the other team scores.

YES, players used something that was *very obviously there*. It wasn't hidden and it got so widely abused even us non-grinders just HAD to test it to seee if it was as bad as people said, and yes it was and they still left it in there for days. It's like going to a prison full of murderers and rapists, giving them a bunch of high powered weapons and a free pass to the nearest girls-only party. Yes, that was a blatant disgusting, outrageous comparison, but god(censored) it applies. So give me a friggin forum ban for it and see me moan about that! (It's what I do(tm))

I'm mosty annoyed about that: They did nothing. Going mental now, as they're doing is too much too late.

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Not entirely true.
1) They put that paragraph GG pointed out.
2) They put farm-related terms into banlist in the very first patch.
3) They tried to fix most egregious exploits, like aforementioned multi-bubbling.
That's hardly "nothing".

Now, the only mistake they made is that threat of retroactive bannhammer, which made many people (including me) nervous. But, TBH, almost everything else they could do would cause adverse rreaction of some sort. (First Law of MMO, - devs never do things right, never ever.) Either some people would complain that measures were too harsh and indiscriminate or they would complain they weren't enough.

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If you look back, you'll see they could've done a LOT of things and chose not to. They left the RCOs in forever, probably causing that horrible rubberbanding/DC'ing [censored]. I hated that, and every day I hoped to get a patch that would rectify the situation!

I don't blame the players for using what was there, but I do blame the devs for not fixing it sooner and now taking it out on the players. They took down CoP (and it never came back btw) and I'd rather see them get rid of MA until they've re-thought it properly. Blaming the player base for doing what players do is childish, as childish as the farming whiners whining about them doing something about it.

They just seen intent on killing another of their MMOs. They're getting BLOODY good at that.

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Singstar, It's all good and well you saying us 'antifarmers' aren't considering your argument, but you keep overlooking the one really important point.

Nobody. Made. You. Farm.


As for the devs not picking up the ball as quickly as they could have, it's their ball and they can do with it whatever the hell they like.

What matters now is that they are picking up the ball and wiping mud off it too.

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You just don't stop do you!
1. I didn't farm!
2. READ THE FRIGGIN POST AGAIN!
3. How's that warshade going?

I just guess you can't respond to it, so you chose to repeat nonsense because that's all you got.

I don't give a bloody (censored) about farming/non-farming or even Posi going on a total Ban all accounts spree, besides one single important thing:

HE'S FRIGGIN' KILLING OUR GAME!!!

Yes a few loud-mouthed whiners will be happy to see some people leave the game, but those people are PAYING for OUR game, and no matter what you think about any players playing this game any way, every single player is important to keep the ball rolling.

Since you're obviously not gonna read my other post again:
Doing SOMETHING about that farm was not the wrong thing. They just did what needed to be done too late and now they're over reacting, doing more harm to the game, than good. It's ok to do something like this if you're head of WoW, or Steam. Doing it in this game... Insane!

I don't care about the farmers! I care about the friggin' game!

...also... as long as you friggin pay the sub, you friggin play the game whatever way you want. Get off those friggin high horses you all high and mighty "I did it the right way" whiners. Whatever you think about any farmer, no matter how they farm, the PAY FOR YOUR FRIGGIN GAME as much as you do. Without them your game would be Tabula Rasa, Auto Assault, whatever.

Yes, get it: Without them you'd be forced to play some worthless, even more boring, grindy or farm'ish game payed for by yes, oh, maaaan: OTHER FARMERS!

It's really as simple as that: People pay for the game: People play the game THEIR WAY: Game stays alive. People don't play the game: Game dead!

That means we NEED a (balanced) supply of all types: grinders, farmers, pvp'ers, casual players, chatterboxes, whiners'n'moaners, and ohmygod, even people on their high horses telling others they can't play whatever way they want because it's "wrong"(tm). But it sure would be a nicer world if people could at least TRY to get along and leave those they can't get along with alone.

So far I've yet to see anyone, ANYONE, give a single example of how farming hurts those that don't farm. I personally think it's mind-boggingly boring, but if others enjoy paying to work (after all, that's what farming is) that's bloody fine with me: I get cheaper stuff at the market. Those that can't make as much on the market, also get the opprtunity to buy cheap so they hardly get "hurt".

And leave B. Spears alone!

Scheses, you just don't WANT to even TRY to consider what the rest of us are saying:

WE AGREE: FARMING BAD!
WE AGREE: GOTTA DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!

BUT! And it's a big friggin' whoppin' whoooopin' BUT:
They COULD have done something, but chose not to for days. They COULD have done a lot of things, but chose not to do any of them and NOW they're gonna PUNISH people for THEIR mistake (e.g. not doing anything once the problem surfaced) in a time when they're about to face some SERIOUS competition.

We can all agree on the idea of getting those "6-account 30 new 50s in a few days" a good slap on the wrist but if they do that, someone has to draw a very shaky line somewhere.

THEY dropped the ball. THEY chose not to pick it up, and I bet they'll go on a whining spree when the other team scores.

YES, players used something that was *very obviously there*. It wasn't hidden and it got so widely abused even us non-grinders just HAD to test it to seee if it was as bad as people said, and yes it was and they still left it in there for days. It's like going to a prison full of murderers and rapists, giving them a bunch of high powered weapons and a free pass to the nearest girls-only party. Yes, that was a blatant disgusting, outrageous comparison, but god(censored) it applies. So give me a friggin forum ban for it and see me moan about that! (It's what I do(tm))

I'm mosty annoyed about that: They did nothing. Going mental now, as they're doing is too much too late.

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i dont see the point in putting this rule in. i mean farming happens in every MMORPG, its still leveling just a faster way, desnt really bother me if it stops or stays, just think its pathetic how the GM's are making such a big deal about it.

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Well said x

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Indeed! Of course they had to do something about it, that's their job. They COULD do something about it, and now they have although way too late. Punishing players (and I doubt they'd find any reason to do it to me) is just bad business.

..but bad bussiness is what NC is all about. Auto Assault, Tabula Rasa, Enhancement diversification, pvp changes, the incredible ads we've all seen everywhere [SIC]. Yup Bad bussiness'R'US (bad double pun intended)

Gratz to Posi for once again pulling the game one step further down into the grave with a simple post. He's really getting good at that! If Cryptic isn't already paying him, they really, really should!

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Rubbish, wouldnt stand up in court a good lawyer would walk all over that.

[/ QUOTE ]I don't think you quite understand how this MMO thing works.

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Yeah - it's Positron pointing a huge ban-gun at players and roaring "I AM THE LAW!"

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...thereby forcing people that aren't really interested in CO to actually go test it. You know what: I don't think they're coming back. Me: Don't think I wanna try another Cryptic or NCSoft game ever anyway and the battlefied remake's gonna be out soon enough!

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@Elementar - I understand your point there, but you're comparing chalk and cheese. The mobs in DA are SUPPOSED to vulnerable to fire and were designed that way. The MA was not supposed to become a farming paradise, and wasn't designed to be so.

@Singstar - I doubt very much I'm agreeing with you on anything. An exploit is anything that doesn't function as intended by the dev team. The MA was never intended as a mechanism to level from 1 to 50 in a matter of hours, therefore using to to do so is an exploit.

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Hmm, someone mentioned something about a WARSHADE! Familiar?

Yet again: If I tell you I'm gonna shoot you and you give me a gun, then don't go nuts when I do shoot you, that was my point and noone disagreed on that. You're insane if you give me a gun unless it's a water gun.

Again:
1. The devs could have fixed it faster.
2. The devs could have taken it down until the RCOs could be taken out
3. The devs could have purged every mission with RCO's just like they've basically done now
4. I don't mind the devs taking down farm missions and warning people, then slapping them if they do the same thing again
5. When faced with competition it's insane to upset EITHER side the farmers or the farm-haters. Sure they had to do something, but they chose to do nothing, then do this.
6. Obviously you like hugging devs and don't care about the games actual survival. I still love this game ergo I have to consider you a great threat to the game and hope the devs get to you. ...hmm, yeah... warshade!