Silverado

Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper

Tornado is a beast against targets that can't be KBed

Originally Posted by Luminara

And I need to correct you here as well. 500% isn't a conservative estimate, it's on the high side. Only four powersets (Rad, Thermal, Cold and Mental) can keep that 500% on the target without lapse, and even then they're subject to the standard 5% chance to miss and require significant amounts of +Recharge, so there's no guarantee that even if they can overlap their debuffs, they'll be able to maintain 500% throughout the duration of combat.

None of the 1000% -Regen powers can be made permanent. The duration to recharge ratios prohibit it. The closest you can get is with Traps' Poison Trap, which has a 10s debuff and 90s recharge, but even if you hit the recharge cap you'll still be 8s short of perma, plus the 2.17s animation, making it work out to less than 500% in the end.

Originally Posted by Luminara

Since you mention a damage saturated scrapper, here's the numbers I have for a damage saturated TA/Sonic.

Shriek/Scream/Shriek/Shout/repeat (-Res double-stacking begins on second run of chain, all attacks, resulting in 120% -Res)

Shriek base damage - 30.4
Shriek animation time - 1s

Scream base damage - 47.7
Scream animation time - 1.67s

Shout base damage - 76.6
Shout animation time - 2.67s

Total chain base damage - 154.7
Total chain animation time - 6.34s

Disruption - 20% -Res, 1.16s animation, double-stacked at 17.18s (third cycle of chain + Disruption animation time) for 40% sustained -Res.*

Acid with Achilles' Heel (averaged) - 24% -Res, 1.83s animation, add 1.83s every fourth cycle of chain to maintain.*

Chem nuke (5m duration) - 50% -Res, 2.03s animation.*

*Openers, no loss of DPS at outset of combat.

Chain damage at cap - 185.1 * 4 = 740.4

Chain damage at cap with 234% -Res - 740.4 * 3.34 = 2472.94

Chain animation time over course of 4 cycles (time at which animation becomes constant over course of combat) - Shriek * 8 + Scream * 4 + Shout * 4 + Disruption * 1 + Acid * 1 = 28.35s

Damage over course of 4 cycles - 9891.74

DPS - 9891.74/28.35 = 348.92

DPS after factoring 5% miss rate (excluding Disruption's animation time, since it is auto-hit) - 345.61

I believe that covers your requirements to cancel regeneration and still deal damage above and beyond that, does it not?

Originally Posted by Luminara

Again, Traps can't stack it. 10s duration on the -Regen, 90s recharge on the power, 500% maximum recharge. 90/5 = 18. 2.17s animation, total 20.17s between PTs. And since we are talking about solo play, I have to point out that it's highly unlikely that anyone can manage that solo for the duration of a GM fight (unless that fight lasted 1m or less, the duration of Geas of the Kind Ones/Force of Nature).

Originally Posted by Luminara

I, and the numbers, disagree. But the point of my responses to you wasn't to pick a fight or argue about who "needs" a Chem nuke or who has the better debuff, it was to make it clear that your comment about -Res only providing a minimal benefit was poorly thought out and unwarranted. You jumped the gun and said something that is patently and clearly untrue. This horse was disinterred, flogged and reburied a few months ago and the conclusion was the same then as it is now, one point of -Res is just as effective as 2-3 points of -Regen for the purposes of AV and GM fights, it's more widely applicable and useful throughout the entirety of the rest of the game (flooring a minion or lieutenant's regeneration is pointless. reducing the resistance of that foe, however, is not), and it's obtainable to far more players with far less reliance on extreme amounts of +Recharge to make it totally effective.

Originally Posted by Luminara

Do we have an understanding now?