Shubbie

The villian respec is extremely annoying.

and tedious, did I mention its tedious.

Orenbanga is not fun, never has been.

The fun for many is making costumes.

Suddenly having costumes added but not accessible other than through some arbitrary and callous system of rare drops does ruin the fun for many.

Then searching and searching but not finding just makes it frustrating.

Im surprised alot of people dont see that not everyone likes it.

But again those that find costumes,like it in general and those that dont, dont like it.

Thats your opinion.

Searching but not finding is NOT FUN for many.

They arent going to say anything.

Why, it makes people grind more = people play more = people pay more.

What makes you think this isnt working as intended.

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why?


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Probably because the devs took notice of how popular the PvP events were on test where you make a character and instantly leveled up to 40.

Obviously the devs wouldn't let us instantly make level 40s (at least not yet, perhaps they might one day), so this appears to be a compromise.

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Also they are hoping to bring people back to try out I7 for anyone who didnt, get people to resubscribe if they shut off after only 1 month of Coh after I7.

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Horror stories about Devs being torn limb from limb by their playerbase notwithstanding...

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Are there really horror stories of this?

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PM a couple rednames. Make a note of which ones don't accept pm's anymore.

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Alot of this is the backlash after ED.

Players were very unhappy and harsh with the devs after ED.

The term nerf is used in a negative sense because in most cases it is negative.

You might as well call a cat a cat.

A small adjustment downward is not a nerf, nor is adjusting something up and something down as long as its in parity.

But gutting a power or powerset is a nerf and there is no other way to put it. Fire got gutted in I5 and I6. The first burn nerf saw many improvements to Fire aura with the nerf. IN the later ones nothing was given back in fact in ED every power got nerfed with no real compensation

Call it nerf/mudwimping/blunting/gutting whatever you want its refered to negativly because it affects the players in a negative way.

This remeinds me of Posi's post in COV beta about ED, he never asked us to test or our opinions he just wanted to know how best to sell it to the players to reduce the amount of angry players and cancelled accounts. He didnt actually say that but it was his clear intention.

Nerf is a deragotory term for an action that usually affects players badly and I dont see anything wrong with speaking up and saying so.

It doesnt wash, not with all secondaries at least.

Some controllers make the pets MUCH better which gives them damage edge, or debuffs mob resistance which makes pets more effective. Or in the case of RAD both.

Controllers with the right secondaries start doign more damage post 32. Controllers with the right secondaries and the right epics completly blow away dominators.

The pets get about twice as effective when they are buffed and/or the mobs are debuffed. Rad and Kin give the most boost followed by Emp, TA, Storm. FF and sonic will make very sturdy pets but not always increase damage to some extant they can in that the pets dont die.

Oh yeah thats another thing, the pets are much more resistant to dying for controllers.

Pets are not a wash, controllers are made to support the pets, Dominators are supported by the pets.

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Some secondaries for controllers have holds.

Rad has an aoe hold, TA has a single target and aoe. All post 41 have access to powerboost instead of just 2 specifics.

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so a somthing/rad has choking cloud right? PBAoE toggle right? (we all know how wonderful most of the ppl here think PBAoE's are.) the trick arrow one isn't in the manual, so i dont know which they are. and the APP ones i'm clueless about (no 50 heros...hell, no lvl 30 heros!). cool, thx shubbie. i should have known that. so a somthing/rad or /ta before APP's can do it (what do they give up for choosing them i wonder?) is that the only build or can they all do it like Two Trick said for other reasons?

Your Insanity May Vary...i guess it's SOME controllers if built right, not controllers can...

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Trick arrow has ice arrow which is a single target hold. And emp arrow which is a ranged aoe hold.

Rad has chocking cloud which is a toggle pbaoe hold, and emp pulse which is a click pbaoe hold.

Also want to point out emp arrow nd emp pulse are VERY strong holds.

Some secondaries for controllers have holds.

Rad has an aoe hold, TA has a single target and aoe. All post 41 have access to powerboost instead of just 2 specifics.

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Well, I wouldn't say utter suicide. The Controller could very well have mez resistance too, and may be able to do all sorts of nasty tricks like healing, debuffing the hell out of you (I didn't see -recharge or slow on that list), throwing a pile of super-buffed pets at you, or simply out playing you.

Do not underestimate the bag of tricks that is a Buff/Debuff set. An Ice/Kinetics Controller can do HORRIBLE things to you without even achiving a basic immobilize effect.

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The thing to do would be to get the dom to fire off domination then run and let it time out useless. this is the problem with a jekyl and hyde approach.

Dominators are one trick ponies, get them to fire the domination then just wait it out.

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So where are the devs on this.

States in beta said he would be keeping a close eye on Dom's after all the Dom's are too weak calls.

Then they said in I7 they were still looking and here we are a month later and nothing said.

So where are the devs in all this, it seems like they really dont care much. Its like dom's dont have enough players to be worth spending time on.

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States plays a plant/psi Dom (I think), I don't know what level he is yet. Around the end of April, I started a Fire/Energy Dominator on Justice. I'm level 37 now.

Fun? You bet, and I've played all the AT's in both games at pretty much every level. Dominators are definitely my cup of tea.

States and I -still- keep a close eye on Dominators. Datamining supports SOME of the claims made on these boards, but refutes others. Personal experience with the AT also lends credibility to some of the complaints, while showing others are simply blown out of porportion.

I read a bunch of the posts in this thread, not all of them though (yet). A lot of users hit the nail on the head when stating that you can't think of Dominator as "CoV's Controller". We went through a lot of effort to make sure that the ATs played and felt different between the two games. Dominators give up a bit of control for some good direct damage attacks that Controllers would give their left mouse button for.

Then of course there is the Domination ability, which is the real Jekyl and Hyde of the AT. A mild-manner Dominator with a full Domination bar can, at his or her discretion, become an unstoppable machine of destruction and control. While it never lasts "long enough" (even I am disappointed at hearing the sound effect of it wearing off), I've had missions where I have gotten Domination off four times from mission-entry to having Mission Complete appear on the screen. Good times indeed.

We've got a nice tweak to the Domination ability coming down the pipe (it will crank up your Mez resistance while it is active), and are currently data-mining PvP to see what effect our last set of tweaks to the AT have had.

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I have to ask you this straight out.

Now I know its either not coming or not coming soon.

But do you honeslty believe most players would take a dominator over a controller if side switching were in the game? or would controllers completly deteam dominators.

Also I think you are missing the point, dominators are for alot of people already too dependant on domination. Dominators need more oompf out of domination. Not more dependance on it.

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And you wonder why I call you people pro dom's.

You completly discount anyone who doesnt agree with you.

I usually dont like to let my posts degrade to insults but this is going too far.

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A quote by KombatJesus:

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What do you get when you throw in some intelligent and vocal players who really know how to play the game With people who are earnestly trying to learn the AT With some lazy incompetent noobs who try at every turn to down toe AT and it's fanbase to get the AT molded in their own image and likeness?

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A quote by xxxxx:

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That's because there are several self proclaimed uber-doms who quickly drop into insult mode and tear down anyone who says anything about doms needing any kind of change. Not naming any names but some people really flip out when anyone suggests doms aren't perfect.

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All emphasis mine. Am I the only one that finds these posts eerily similar?

Nobody named names. Doesn't matter; in the blame game, everyone is equal!

We now return you to your regularly scheduled self-righteous pissing contest.

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I'm afraid I don't see the similarity. How is using the terms "pro dom" and "uber dom" in any way equivalent to calling people "lazy incompetent noobs"?

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B/c "self-proclaimed uber dom" has the implication of elitism and snobishness and it was in comparison to "lazy incompetent noobs" not "pro-doms". Both are rude and both counter productive.

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You do realize that Im using the term Pro-Dom as in supports doms as they are. As I put myself in the [Censored] as in doesnt support doms as they are and wants change.

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What do you get when you throw in some intelligent and vocal players who really know how to play the game With people who are earnestly trying to learn the AT With some lazy incompetent noobs who try at every turn to down toe AT and it's fanbase to get the AT molded in their own image and likeness?

You get. . .the Dominator forum aka the Jungle. Cavemen, Monsters, Gods roam the land. Rednames fear the dense jungle and only the bravest of men dare walk in these parts.

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And you wonder why I call you people pro dom's.

You completly discount anyone who doesnt agree with you.

I usually dont like to let my posts degrade to insults but this is going too far.

Didnt Cor's get boosted to 85/75 in late beta?

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I understand. All I can say is that they're not at my breakfast table then. Perhaps, if they're seeing pits when others are seeing bowls so often, they should question whether digging/eating is the right line of work for them.

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There are only a certain amount of things to do in the game.

1, solo for experiance
2, team for experiance
3, quest for badges
4, complete TF/SF/Trials
5, endgame content

1, doms and controllers are close on this, controllers start better Containment is powerful at low levels, then dominators get better, and post pets controllers are better again.
2, controllers clearly better
3, Depends on badge an situation, Ill call this tie
4, Controllers better, no contest
5, controllers better, no contest

seems like its more pits than bowls. If side swithing was allowed a dom would never see a team again.

The difference being corruptors are good before you even factor in scourge.

You know I did that fight similiar to that with my nin/tra and my friend en/en brute and we had no trouble with about 4 packs.

And here is the kicker.. My nin/tra is that good ALL THE TIME... not just for 90 second spurts.

Fury is much much much much better than domination.

A sliding domination scale like a slower to build, slower to depreciate fury was one of the suggestion I made early.

So where are the devs on this.

States in beta said he would be keeping a close eye on Dom's after all the Dom's are too weak calls.

Then they said in I7 they were still looking and here we are a month later and nothing said.

So where are the devs in all this, it seems like they really dont care much. Its like dom's dont have enough players to be worth spending time on.

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I for one would never trust another player to be that good. I assume they are going to mess it up. From talking to other players many of them feel the same way, its not worth taking a chance on inviting a dom to the team.

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You must not do a lot of PUGs then. I've been on teams with Brutes who take Stealth, Corruptors who won't heal or Debuff, MM who take 5+ minutes to set up all their pets and have to do it before every fight, and Stalkers who refuse to AS the Boss at the end of the mission. You never know what you get when you send that team invite out to someone you never played with before regardless of AT.

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Ive seen all of that.

anyone can be an idiot on a pug.

Not only does the dom have to not be an idiot, they have to be awesome.

An average MM or an Average brute does a pretty good job. Corruptors usually have to be a bit on their toes same with stalkers.

Dominators have to be downright great to be as good as the average MM.

Id rather take my chances with the MM's and brutes, since in all honestly the great majority of players are average.

But you have 2 stackable holds, which allows instahold on an boss, and soulstorm is the most incredible hold ive seen and one of the few shining patron powers.

So ice has 1 decent hold, 1 situational
Dark has 1 fairly good hold
Ghost widow has 1 very good hold.

Thats an amazing amount of control for a non controller, nondominator.

Now to Necro/TA
Has 1 decent hold
1 pretty good aoe hold(this hold is very good for MM's who can actually get away with the aftereffects)
1 great slow
1 aoe knockdown
1 pet with hold, immob, fear
Wow.... I mean wow..

Necro/dark is even better as fluffy joins liche in controller fun
1 decent hold
1 aoe fear
1 aoe slow
1 aoe disorient
2 controlling pets

I mean even more wow...

Now add into all of this some amazing damage.

Now Im not saying its dominator level, but its close enough to raise the question why put up with anemic dominator damage when you can have this PLUS lots of damage.

About the only thing they could do is give us double damage vs EB's and AV's.

Im not sure that would help anything and might make it worse, but it would be worth testing at least.

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I have a feeling Dominator is the hardest to balance of all.

Hold effect is the nastiest thing in this game. You cannot do ANYTHING when behing Held. That's as strong effect as you can get. How much balance do you need to allow Dominator to control in PvP? How fast do you allow Dom to build up their Domination?

PvP's problem has bigger issue due to Inspirations so I am not going to get into that.

But as for PvE, I only feel a bit inferior when fighting against Arc Villains but once I HOLD them, I feel so superb.. only if it's a few seconds of fame.


One thing they can probably do is to increase Domination gain when fighting against bosses. This way Doms can build up their Dom faster and thus dealing out more damage even though they fail to hold/control.

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Jib thats a really excellent point. Holds are the absolute ultimate debuff.

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Which is precisely why they are so easy to counter.

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And when we are countered, we feel so inferior. That's why Dominator is living on this LIFE or DEATH spectrum. When our Domination is on, we feel so invincible amd when it's not on, we feel so inferior.

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which is why Ive been saying since beta. Domination is the key to the problem and if it comes down to it. Domination has to go.

Come on who hasnt watched Voltron and said, why doesnt he just bring the big attack out and stop wasting time. Thats really what dom's feel like why are the devs wasting our time and theirs with this.

Im not saying we should be domination strong all the time, but Id rather be in a balanced state most of the time, not in a constant flux of underpowered/overpowered.

If you arent in a pefect state of awareness, have a great build, and balancing when to and not use your powers, you are going to SUCK as a dom. To the few people who can do this great.

I for one would never trust another player to be that good. I assume they are going to mess it up. From talking to other players many of them feel the same way, its not worth taking a chance on inviting a dom to the team.

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Ice/dark Necro/dark necro/ta Dark/dark and other controllery MM's and corruptors arent going anywhere. They give up damage for that control, but they still do more damage than dominators.

Heck any MM can outdamage any pre pet dominator by a large margin and even post pet dominators by a moderate.

Necro/dark and Necro/ta have some really good control. And much of it soft like tar patch and glue which werent nerfed to heck in the controller nerf.

Dominators are in a bad place compared to the controllerMM's and cor's.

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their control is very questionable. The recharge and activation times for ice/dark are horrible in comparison to dominators.

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They have 2 holds though. Which allows them to instahold a boss. 3 with patron powers.

Also they arent nearly as dependant on holds as dominators, also its more than enough control to take out a sapper.

Perfect control is a thing of the past, now its enough control to keep the PITA mobs off you long enough to kill the rest.