Rock_Powerfist
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Posts
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Quote:Squirreling away his salvage, which seemed to fail to expand his packs size in anyway, Ethan stood up and took in his surroundings , clearly this was a large settlement, and look so clean and un damaged, a really pretty little spot.Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano
The Crab promptly exploded, or it would have done if it hadn't had the magical net not contained the outward spraying of the explosion, however it did proceed to take a chunk of the street underneath it since the explosion was force downward.
All that was left was a smoldering crater and the burnt out wreckage of what remained of the Crab.
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Ethan finds: a lot of scrap metal, several fission batteries, a large number of plasma cells and the unique names plasma gun 'Crab buster'.
Ethan turned and grined, wella sorrys for that, I kinda just arrived, was there a bounty on that critter ?Quote:Originally Posted by Crazy_Dragon
The Outsider
"Well!" The Outsider declared, clapping her hands together as she spoke. "This turned out to be a pretty horrifying display of team tactics, or lack thereof, didn't it?"
now that is a good question, yous all gotta bar or saloon around heres ?Quote:Originally Posted by _Fea_
Ineloo
"That was easy! So, what kinda things do people around here do for fun?" She said, looking from one person to the next.
Ethan dusted himself down , and straightened his Talon Combat Armour . -
Oh fffff..lip dang auto correct not reading my mind again....
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Glancing across to the bow wielding stranger, Ethan Shouted to her ..
" first come first server, turn up or missout, this thing has cost me a prefectly good missle already .."
with half an eye watching the possiblely about to explode crab beasty, a second half on the surroundings, Ethan devote one whole eye to looking at how to take apart the claw and get at the useful stuff inside. -
Given the rare nature of an Omy post, i feel it is important to take the opportunity to agree with him,
and to agree with AP,
ok, yes I will even agree with Tech, but just this once and it in no way set a president, I retain the right to consider any future Tech posts on a post by post basis. -
My memories of GG is the Raids are normally treated IC, with poor Fea running around after the raid doing first aid. It can be a bit more OOC if other players not RPing are around and want a team, but these tend to run off the moment the raid is over.
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Quote:Apologies, it was not intened to be any sort of blow Fans, all i was trying to point out is huge amounts of RP goes on with out any of us knowing about it, we do not keep track of what other RP circles are up to, so one event by one group has no real effect on another.Originally Posted by Fanservice
Mr Bad wanting to get back at everyone breaks Rule 1. I thought you were agreeing on that one? If destroying GG is literally the only thing you can think of to get back at a group of people, you're just not thinking very hard.
Sure, but forcing people to take part in something they honestly don't want to take part in is not very good behaviour in any medium.
Pretty cheap blow. If you don't care what the people posting here think then don't post here. Also misrepresenting the argument as this is not about plots "Using named locations", which is fine, it's about plots "Destroying named locations"
Obviously if your plot doesn't involve the rest of the server, you can pretty much do what you like. Long as you're self aware enough to realise that just because you did it in private RP, doesn't mean everyone not involved will later accept what you did.
We have agreed with your Point one, it just the detail and scope of Point two, and how it is very limiting from some points of view.
However i think we hav emoved on a bit now with Shadowe's and FFM's post and the ADD concept. which as a basis rule of thumb does look workable. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Shadowe
and it adds verisimilitude.
Thoughts?
"Quick to the Bat-Dictionary ..."
"Dang that Shadowe not only wise but with a huge vocabulary as well ..."
Odd how a debate on how to blow things up comes around to a rule/guideline/idea of Adding
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Quote:Originally Posted by FloatingFatMan
^ That wouldn't be an issue for me. Add, not subtract, is usually reasonably safe in most things, depending on scale.
In fact, the "Must be ignorable" rule is, I think, being misunderstood or misrepresented a little. For me, at least, what this actually means that large plots are fine, as long as the plot owner provides a hook so that my chars can safely say "Ah, I see heroes X, Y and Z are on the case. I'll leave it in their capable hands then."
Presenting everyone with a fait acompli, such as a sudden explosion and a very large number of deaths, isn't ignorable in this sense. Every hero who hears it would almost certainly respond, at the very least to get down there and start helping with relief efforts (this is also one reason why we shouldn't incorporate RL disasters into the game world).
However, presenting everyone with a PLAN to cause a sudden explosion and lots of deaths? If it starts at the initial stages of procuring materials etc, then that's totally fine. It's simple to say that there are heroes out there with far more expertise that could better handle the situation, should people not want to be involved.
Yes i think this cover what A) is doable with in the game, and B) considers that fact that people want to be able to pick what and when they are involved in. -
Quote:Simple ... those are not the things Mr Bad wants to break, all of Shadowe's examples are fine, but limited to him, Mr Bad want to get back at everyone, and make a headline on the news to show up those pesky heroes, that is the sort of character he isOriginally Posted by Fanservice
I thought my two rules cover it fairly well. You said you were unhappy because your Villains couldn't "Break things". I provided a fair number of examples of things they could break. Why's it still an issue?
You might find the joker type villain boring, but others may not. We need to be able to agree to make space for each other to play the game they want to play.
Let us be honest here, what percent of the RP population are even reading this thread let alone posting. Hands up all those who RP in Pok D, or in the Corp, or CotBC, or Foundry et al. how many people are having an issue with plots that use named loactions ? and how many are just getting on with thier own plots and not tell the rest of the server -
Quote:Which i think brings us to the fundamental issue of different people enjoying different things and wanting different experiences, and it is near impossible to find some thing that keeps both sides happy, rather than both side grumpy. I do think we have to be brave and accept that we cannot all fit into a one size fits all Unionverse, and at least agree to area where we can work apart on what we prefer.Originally Posted by Fanservice
In no particular order some targets of vengence that players not only might be willing to offer up, but even have been hit before.
Shadowe: His Home. His Limo on the way to work. His buisness chains. His warehouses. His RnD staff when they're at home. Any number of people affaliated with his fairly massive buisness even.
Red: Russian Diplomats/Citizens. His home. His favourite newspaper stand (YOU MONSTERS)
Annette: Her old comic store, her home, her favourite nightclub or just plain Annette herself. Seriously Annette and Louise are the masters of getting shot/stabbed/blown up.
We don't really want bomb plots at GG and I roll my eyes when they turn up. It starts to get to the point where it's a little unbelievable that people dare to go there as it's meant to be a 'Safe' area where people can drop by and maybe kick off some plot, do some fun investigative brainstorm and planning or introduce a new character. Hard to do any of that when the ominous threat of death hangs over it and people are getting gorily murdered on it's steps every other week.
Yes there are Villains that try to break the world but they're generally quite boring villains. There's no substance to them. The Joker is no doubt the main culprit of think it's a good idea, but honestly he's interesting for reasons beyond mindless destruction. He's obsessed with Batman while also being his antithesis, he reinvents his character at a whim, he's got a whiplash mood and he scares other Villains because he's unpredictable and just plain creepy.
If anything it's his petty crimes that are the best, like trying to ruin Commissioner Gordon's sanity by shooting Barbara or murdering a dentist after he fixed his smile, to get back at Barbara for ruining it in the first place and making her doubt her choice to let him live. -
Quote:Ture , but it makes a far better plot if you have the heroes trying to save a Lab rather than the local branch of Boots.Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
The chilling thing is you don't need to rob a government lab to do stuff like that, as NCIS said in a frankly comforting and totally unlike a normal fox shows hysteria, terrorists can get the material from all over the place, like dentists for example :P
But yes I was thinking more of a gas rather than explosions. -
Quote:Which comes around to the problem of playing CoV, SuperVillains are dramatic, they do target land marks, they do go for the pointlessly flashy targets, the do try to wreck the Heroes backyard.Originally Posted by Fanservice
Right, now at least we're on the same page.
The problem with changing the world is it quickly stops becoming 'A few RP effects' and just gets rediculous, not to mention it won't be long before some bright spark then tries to ruin Galaxy Girl.
Do you really need to target Atlas Statue? You can't make something meaningful for the players to worry over that's off in a bit of the city we don't usually get to see? If you're targeting game landmarks for the 'shock' effect of doing it, then that's the problem right there.
There's nothing wrong with 'using' the game world, just stop trying to break it.
Look at it this way, Mr Bad has failed to defeat Shadowe, way to much fire power, Theo, way to much sark , Red, way to Russian, Ni, way to many swords. Mr Bad wants some pay back, Plot blow up GG statue when no one is there, the plot writes itself. What else would Mr Bad pick , the Up n Away so there is no hand coffee shop? YES he will fail, but he even if he did blow it up the heroes would have it rebuilt by tea time. Heck Shadowe could pay for a new one from the small change in he jacket pocket. Added to which you can then RP a good reason for GG being a safe hang out with all the new security measures in place.
Villains do try to break the world, thats what they are there for.
If you want a game setting where they dont try to break the world what threats do you imagine your heroes are dealing with, it would all be Page 11 below the small adds stuff.
If you want to go down that route you are almost saying you only want to play CoH and all the villains are NPC's, at which point we get back to the whole Single Unionverse RP lore situation. -
Quote:Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
How about this one, some one uses small dirty bombs in several locations across the city, they don't cause massive damage, but do result in several dozen perhaps a hundred people getting radiation poisoning. They do this to frame the super hero lover who dumped them, that hero being a member of the nuclear ninety and those locations being regular places they visit.
Obviously the media would cover it in the same hysterical fox news way that it'd be covered in the real world, so is that too large scale?
Personally I'd say that was an okay plot, a chance for the framed hero to prove their innocence while trying to avoid a manhunt. A few heroes helping him, a few hunting him and perhaps even a rogue or villain trying to manipulate the panic.
Personally i would start this plot with the Villain trying to steal the materials to make such bombs. This gives the Heroes a hook as they respond to the first break in to the goverment lab, pick up the clues and follow the trail. Then you have the fun of the heroes trying to keep the story out of the papers to avoid widescale panic. This then keeps the plot limited to the orginal heroes, plus any they call in to help. All other heroes either do not know or are helping by keeping the story secret and making everything appear normal by doing their normal stuff. -
Quote:Ok point 1, yes i think we all agree that unless you have global agreement to such a plot that it need to be moved to an area that it can be reasonable ingnored..say FranceOriginally Posted by Fanservice
I never said you can't have a 'plot' to blow it up, just that you can't physically blow it up. The outcome of that plot is that it is predestined to fail. If people are fine with that then by all means, go for it. However be aware that this is only one half of this discussion.
Basically, there's two 'problem' plots on show here.
1. Plots that would incite a city wide response. Mass Child Murder. Nuclear Bomb Threats. Giant Alien Spaceships with Planet Busters. These are plots a character can't really justify ignoring because they're simply too huge in their impact on the city.
2. Outcomes of plots that leave things in a state that the game world flatly contradicts. Bulldozing Perez Park. Toppling Atlas Statue. Turning Kings Row into Glass. Murdering Statesman. That sort of thing.
I'd elaborate on this, but it seems I need to be sure on what this discussion is about as people keep moving the goalposts. Do you have any problem with the above two rules?, or the plot has to have a well reasoned cop-out option. No one should be forced into a plot.
Point 2 is a bit more debateable, but only for the small scale events, clearly turning Kings Row to glass is a no no, as is killing Statesman. However on a smaller scale would it be to much to ask RPers to imagine the Atlas Statue surrounded by scafolding for a couple of weeks for repairs ??, after all we ask each other to imagione a lot of RP things. Now yes i do agree the perminate removal of Atlas is not viable, and any damage to it should only be considered the end result of the Heroes failing every mission in the plot arc, and yes the plot needs to be carefully constructed.
My point about the Atlas example is its fun thing to attack, targeting Generic Statue 23 just doesnt make a good plot hook. We are provided with the game setting , we should try to make the most of it. I dont think it too much to ask players to imagine a few simple RP event effects, which do not limit anyones personal RP. Glass Kings Row would limit such presonal RP, Atlas Statue under repair for a few days doesnt. -
" one of the claws fired off and skidded to a halt in the road "
Ethan pulled out his tool kit and moved arcoss the road to the discarded claw, his true calling as a salavger kicked in as he searched the claw for anything of use. Long hours of such worked had trained Ethan to keep one eye on the the rest of the world, those pink bullets looked as deadly as the normal sort, and some bright spark had already mentioned that robots tend to go Boom! when defeated. -
Quote:Sorry Fans, it was getting too late fro my poor brain to cope with even simple..Originally Posted by Fanservice
You missed the point.
It has nothing to do with where your character works.
Nooooone. You can make that out to be the problem, but it's not and never has been. So it's a bit pointless to do so. My character NOT being there doesn't make it any less of a bad idea, because it's not in any way related to the problem.
So ...if it is so simple can you put it down in one clear pargraph and expalin what is wrong with using the Atlas Statue as the target of a supervillains plot, NOTE i said target i did not say claiming to have blown it up, we can look at such issues later. -
Quote:It is simple and fine if it also works the other way, dont name drop where your character lives works et al and dont use it as a reason to block someones ploting . While i fully argree no one is going to blow up the Atlas Statue, it is just the target a baddy plot would pick, which hero is going to rush off to save the "oh that chap who had ice powers " statue. The threat of damaging Atlas gives the plotage flavour and is something that people know and can react to.Originally Posted by Fanservice
No! No. You don't understand. You are missing the point.
Don't blow up things which have a physical presence in game. Don't destroy Agincourt. Don't topple the Atlas Statue. Don't shrink and steal Freedom Corps.
That's it. That's all this is about. You're making it way, way more complicated than it needs to be. It's got nothing to do with people's characters 'claiming' an area. It's about not changing the game world in a way that should be physically represented but isn't. That's all this is about. Your example with Agincourt isn't "My character works and Agincourt so you can't blow it up" and is more "You can't blow Agincourt up, as it'll remain unexploded in game. So don't blow it up"
God you're killing me here. This is such a simple point, how can you miss it so badly? -
Sorry Omy, i think we have crossed wires, i did not mean referencing events from missions as IC things, what i meant was using the type of activities in everyday in game missions, by which i mean non TF, non end of arc fight the EB/AVtype missions, just the normal missions, as a measure of the level of activity for RP plots, those which are not world changers but are more than pulling a bank heist. I was just trying to point out the level of blowing things up the game content offers up on a regular basis, and trying to see what is considered non world changing. Sorry for the confusion.
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No Omy, i am no using the "Everything in game is -exactly- how it happens" , see my note about tin mage and apex, but if i can not referance game missions as a measure of plot activity please tell me what i can refer to.
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to be fair to Fans i will let him reply, if he wants to, Omy.
I think most of us are agreed on massive world changing plots, we all seemed to agree on the tin mage and apex TFs not having any in game results until the Devs revamp zones to reflect them.
But the "I blew up the Arachnos base in sharkshead and killed everyone in it" level plot is a pretty common mission and not even a arc final one, if a Villain cant threaten to blow up something note worthy it does kind of limit villain RP, please note i said threaten not do.
Otherwise are we all limited to street level villains, or ones that operate only in made up zones ? which if that is the case lets have some honesty and say that, and post some agreed boundaries, lets help each other. -
moved across to keep other thread clean.
My bit
People the wall you are banging your heads against is getting bored ..
we have this debate every so often , and it comes down to who can be bothered to post the most, that holds the day.
the problem everyone wants something different, this is where the whole unionverse, we all live in the same one, issue hits problems.
" You create a plot where you decide to blow up King's Row. One of my mains lives there and thinks of it as her territory. You have just made it impossible for my character to ignore your plot. "
is a fine fair sounding statement .. but it means one person now controls what can or can not happen plot wise in that zone.
would it sound fair to say to a group of heroes .. " no you cant go rescue the hostages from the base in Sharkshead , as my VEAT works there and i dont want to get involved , rewrite your plot please"
given the number of players this would block the use of all game zones in the CoXverse. As well as the list of RP locations now being posted in the RP thread, do we have to have a No plots here with out perosn X's ok list as well ?
Either we are helpfully and are willing to assist and adapt to each others wants, or we need to accept that we are not all in the same unionverse and be happy and stick to our own little RP circle. Some like big grand wide reaching events, and are willing to make the effort to let anyone who wants to get involved, if you say no you cant to them are you willing for them to say no to one of your small scale plots when you want to do something in any given zone or location ? Do we have to pre post any plot for vetting ?
Now i know for a fact that plots have occured at GG , in pok D, and in at least two SG that are at odds with each other in terms of events , lore , zone effects etc, but no one moaned or said "no you cant do that" because they all we done withing their own circle of characters who have almost zero chance of meeting in game, and because those circles of players never meet or talk to each other.
so can we not just be happy in our own circles of choice and get on with the point of the game, having fun....Please
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"would it sound fair to say to a group of heroes .. " no you cant go rescue the hostages from the base in Sharkshead , as my VEAT works there and i dont want to get involved , rewrite your plot please"
Fans bit
No of course not it'd be silly. But again no one, absolutely no one, is saying that except you.
Your example would be very bad for RP. But it's not what happens, it's not what is going to happen and it's never happened before that I can recall. Let's stop pretending it's endemic. We could get back to RP if people would just stop pretending that saying "No" to something in RP is the very thing that's killing RP and making out with its corpse.
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Yes Fans it is silly (( did you not get the fact it was meant to be ?)), but so is saying "I live in Steel Cayon , so no plots there" which does happen.
Futher i was not aware of anything killing off RP, tbh i see far more RP than ever, so much going on i cant keep up with it. What i was saying in please lets cooperate OR agree to accept that no one person or group owns the game and can dictate what can or cannot happen and get on with our own circles RP. Lets face facts even when the chalet was open and the GGer's and the Pok Ders ended up in the same room, there was not much mutual RP, no cross over of plots , no one saying " oh yes i live in Steel , i must be your next door neighbour ".
We all just get on with our own stuff. For example, the current Praetoria plot in Pok D should have it have an affects on the people at GG ? do the GGers have any idea its going on ? , does it matter what the answers to those two questions are ? .. -
Fans ..i will reply in the atl thread to help get this back on track with the OP.
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Ethan stepped back .... " what the mutants lizards teeth is that thing ? "
He looked at the other people engaging the crab beasty, " anyone ? half an idea ? heck any of you lot even speak english ? "
Keeping a good solid building to his back, Ethan once more started to dig deep into his packs . . . . -
People the wall you are banging your heads against is getting bored ..
we have this debate every so often , and it comes down to who can be bothered to post the most, that holds the day.
the problem everyone wants something different, this is where the whole unionverse, we all live in the same one, issue hits problems.
" You create a plot where you decide to blow up King's Row. One of my mains lives there and thinks of it as her territory. You have just made it impossible for my character to ignore your plot. "
is a fine fair sounding statement .. but it means one person now controls what can or can not happen plot wise in that zone.
would it sound fair to say to a group of heroes .. " no you cant go rescue the hostages from the base in Sharkshead , as my VEAT works there and i dont want to get involved , rewrite your plot please"
given the number of players this would block the use of all game zones in the CoXverse. As well as the list of RP locations now being posted in the RP thread, do we have to have a No plots here with out perosn X's ok list as well ?
Either we are helpfully and are willing to assist and adapt to each others wants, or we need to accept that we are not all in the same unionverse and be happy and stick to our own little RP circle. Some like big grand wide reaching events, and are willing to make the effort to let anyone who wants to get involved, if you say no you cant to them are you willing for them to say no to one of your small scale plots when you want to do something in any given zone or location ? Do we have to pre post any plot for vetting ?
Now i know for a fact that plots have occured at GG , in pok D, and in at least two SG that are at odds with each other in terms of events , lore , zone effects etc, but no one moaned or said "no you cant do that" because they all we done withing their own circle of characters who have almost zero chance of meeting in game, and because those circles of players never meet or talk to each other.
so can we not just be happy in our own circles of choice and get on with the point of the game, having fun....Please -
The Missile lack of effect gave Ethan a problem, what the heck to try next..
Checking fire on the Missile Launcher , he took a good look around to see what the other folk where up to, someone (( Ineloo )) was using a bow, that seemed very pointless, no one uses bows, not even crossbows.
The robot thing (( Quicksilver )) seemed to be using blunt force, always a go to plan, the female who he had nearly cooked with the Missile's backblast (( Outsider )) appeared unarmed.
" Ok folks, what the hecking heck is going on here , talk to me people..."
Even while chatting Ethan was searching his packs for a new weapon idea, the Missile Launcher disappeared , to be replaced by an oversized gaunlet, with the word Fisto scrached on to its side. a small whine can from the glove as the Power Fist became active....