Rangle M. Down

Originally Posted by ArwenDarkblade

At the end of this month, my VIP account expires and I do not plan to renew it. I think it is time for me to move on to other things and to say goodbye to all of you.

It has been a great ride, and I honestly didn't expect to still be here 8 years after I logged on for the first time. I have met a lot of fantastic people, made friends, and even fell in love. I've had fun leading raids, trials, TFs, my SG. But now it's time to go.

I truly value the time I have spent here. I couldn't have asked for a better bunch of people to fight/cause crime with.

Take care.

Originally Posted by Profit

Actually, reading this thread it sounds like we may have stumbled onto the path of fixing the melee ATs.

What I'm seeing here is that board members don't take confront on their scrappers. Brutes take taunt, and tanks take taunt. So in the hypothetical, since tanks are the lowest damaging AT, then brutes, then scrappers, why not this...

Remove confront from scrappers, add in a awesome attack (just meaning, nothing unappealing in visual or numbers) that has a chance to critical. This would move scrappers further away from brutes in the dmg department as it should be.

Remove taunt from brutes, give brutes confront, leave other aggro generating tools in place such as auras. If a brute wants to aggro manage make them learn how to use their auras, or pick up provoke. Otherwise this would move them away from tanks aggro management capabilities.

Leave tanks as is. Thats right, as is (not withstanding visual changes to make attacks "feel" more powerful and possibly upping threat generation or removing aggro caps)

The idea here is that it would help each melee class not step on the others toes.

Originally Posted by Bronze Knight

Oh I forgot one of my biggest pet peeves.

The Music.

Or rather the lack of the game music. Currently the game music will only play once and only when you cross a neighborhood boundary. I would like to see, as a temporary fix at least, the music loop repeatedly. In addition I would like to see some music added for missions!

In my opinion if you have the game music on it should never stop playing. Log in to log out. But that me and I tend to be a bit more extreme about these things.

Originally Posted by Zombie Man

I liked the ending.

Quick quiz time: In what movie does a character named Bruce tell the character played by Morgan Freeman, "Now you're just showing off."?

I'll give you two guesses. So you'll be right.

Originally Posted by ChaosExMachina

I think the fact he has been widely ridiculed while, really, being right the entire duration is an indictment of the community.

Johnny has been correct. It simply makes no sense that the largely redundant defensive abilities of a tank are paired with a very significant offensive penalty.

I see this as similar to the redundancy of defenders and corruptors. The ATs are simply a lot too similar to be defending AT diversity. Defenders were buffed and equal corruptors minus scourge solo or at least are close to it. The trick is a straight offensive buff is not interesting, and while I support a straight offensive buff instead of none, a thematic ability is preferred.

Considering theme, a tank is a not so quick hulking character in the majority of fiction. What if they had a variation of build up, say, 'focus,' that requires animation time but greatly empowers them, say Colussus preparing a massive move? In a sense scrappers are to stalkers as brutes would be to the proposed tankers. It would be a no endurance instant recharge inherent but take a while to animate.

Originally Posted by RevolverMike

Hopefully no one berates me over this but is it really so horrible if tanks got a higher damage cap? The tank still doesnt have fury and conceptually I dont see why they are in the lowest tier. If it was up to me I'd just give them the extra 100% potential. Not like they are always going to putting out that extra 100%. And if JB is still complaining even after that, well, we'll all just pretend he doesnt exist.

Originally Posted by Tenzhi

Super Strength is, again, just a convenient example. I'm not talking about its design structure at all. Hence: "I'd say the same of the Tier 1 attack in any of the attack sets for any AT that has one."

Originally Posted by Tenzhi

I've found most MMOs I've played to be torturously slow, in combat as well as advancement. This game is better than most in both regards, but a quick snail is still slow (the fastest being something like five thousandths of a mile per hour, as I recall).



I imagine that you and I have different ideas of what "mowing" is. Suffice to say, I'd call what my WP/SS Tanker does to minions of +0 or -1 level to him to be "methodically chipping away at", or possibly "deliberately hand sawing" with Rage. It takes around six Jabs for him to KO a -1 minion sans Rage.

In a perfect world, with only regular enhancements, no outside buffs, no inspirations, no Aura damage, and no Rage - basically just Jab and three damage SOs - it shouldn't take more than two punches to KO most even level minions. I'd say the same of the Tier 1 attack in any of the attack sets for any AT that has one.

Originally Posted by Tenzhi

I do not disagree. I was merely using Super Strength as a ready example. As mentioned, I have a widespread dissatisfaction with the powers/power level in this game.

Originally Posted by Rylas

WAI does not equate to being free of ever being changed.

Originally Posted by planet_J

I think you all are spending way too much time worried about 1% of the game.

How much of any toons entire lifetime is spent in itrials buffed to the gills? Seriously...the toon I ran trials heavily on to get all t4'ed out with lots of different powers, I bet I ran probably...20-30 hours worth of trials the entire time...that's a drop in the bucket compared to getting that toon to 50...running TFs and SSAs...getting accolades, collecting badges....I still play that toon all the time, and I only run trials on that toon now when the new ones come out for the badges. I am certain it was easily less than 3% of his entire lifetime to this point...all said and done, I feel extremely confident saying it's less than 1% of what his total time in game spent will be.

So, if 99% of the time, saturated buffs are not an issue...and really...in my mind they're not an issue period.

Then why do you spend so much time saying..."but when EVERYBODY hits the caps..."

That's such a nonexistent set of criteria, it's likely the reason it hasn't been addressed...and probably never will.

Now, back to your regularly scheduled tanker programming:

Tanks, are meatshields, it's clearly what they do best, I like the idea of extending taunt durations for tanks. Though, I also agree this can be somewhat counter productive for some ATs in a team with a Tank.

I feel the best way to fix tanks would be to adjust their damage modifier down to say...0.650 and give them fury and about 700% damage cap....

Now all whining stops I bet.

Any takers? They even get a "new" mechanic...(albeit recycled but still)

Originally Posted by Starsman

No offense, Johnny, but this is part of the problem about attempting to discuss this with you. If I make any conession that tankers may need more damage, you automatically jump the gun and say they must match one of the best damage dealers in the game.

But I will give you the benefit of the doubt, perhaps it's past experience here clouding my view of this answer.

For balance sake, I think 85% of brute's damage works, but it must be uncompromising 85% in average. What do I mean by "uncompromising"? Well. truth be told, Bruise can boost your damage to about 80% of a Brute damage (running at 60% fury) in theory. It requires, though, for you to start offense with lower damage (since first attack is not buffed) and it forces you to use your worst attack constantly in an attack chain, effectively lowering your damage output for a slight net boost, that is only single target in nature.

Now there are many ways to boost damage, many that have never been thought off, some that have but never been implemented, etc etc. It may be possible to come up with a damage boost for tankers that is not consistent, one that makes Tankers better damage dealers during certain portion of a fight, but les effective in other parts of the fight. Not too unlike brutes (that, unless they are primary tank, start fights with low fury and slowly build it up.)

Look at corruptors, a potentially bad example but one none the less (they need work with damage too, in my opinion.) They have conditionally high damage later in a fight, not at the start of a fight, due to the way Scourge works. Imagine a tank with Scourge? Or potentially with nega-Scourge, a scourge mechanic that only triggers on enemies that are over 50% HP? This is flawed (for a few reasons) but it's an example of a way to bring an average of 85% brute damage that also grants the tanker special conditions to shine as damage dealers.

This is a heavy numeric game, but can be achieved.



For this to ever happen tanker survivability would need to be gutted down to Brute levels, keeping only the current HP advantage as the sole aspect that differentiates both AT's survivability. That's not going to happen, so it will remain a number choice.

Originally Posted by Nethergoat

the huge number of excellent suggestions in this thread just PROVES how impossible it is to think up a good name that hasn't already been taken!







=P