Ramseys

The endurance drop is 100%. It was 100% on test and it is 100% on live. Statesman even said it was an endurance drain. It shouldn't really be a point of discussion.

It is possible to get an endurance regen tick before endurance check for your toggles which will keep them up. How this is happened to people frequently I'm not sure. However, I don't think that is important.

Statesman agreed that the penalty was too harsh. So it is now a moot point on how much it is really draining.

Yes it went live. That really sucks. However, I don't think it is permanent change. As several people have pointed out it was likely a change that was bundled into this patch.

As to why it didn't get taken out of this patch....? Who knows, what’s done is done and I believe it will be changed. Most likely it was an oversight or it was because that would hold up changes that effect far more people. Yes, this is upsetting but at this point there is nothing to do but complain and ask that they roll back the change.

I have turned off rage, I wont turn it on again until it is fixed. If it still sucks I will respec out of it. Now that I have "some" ranged defense I may actually live through the respec trial. I'm bummed that I already used my free respec but that is life.

I believe in a earlier post I was confused on how much damage rage was adding. This part always confuses me a tich. But anyway I was doing 100hp damage with Haymaker and now I do 139. So that makes it look like a 39-40% increase. Yet it is considered widely to be an 80% buff? Is there some enhancement math I am missing?

Thanks,
Ramseys.

Anything more than a -20 endurance is obscene! This power is in no way so overbalancing that it should require 50% or 75% loss. Give me a break. The closest power comparison as I said before is Hasten. What is Hasten’s downside? not much at all compared to full end drop and it effects every power in the game.

This should not be an invulnerability issue, every set now has equal opportunity to avoid the stun with their toggles. Previously that might not have been true with fire and healing flames but it is now.

Slowing people down is not an effective situation either. Ice has resistance to slow so they will negate that down side as well. Slow is already the bane of my tanker lets not add more.

I see numerous suggestions here that are nearly as bad as a full end drop. Suggestions that down sides last for 30-60 seconds. What? that is so over the top. Also making the power more painful then helpful to use. I would like to see these suggestion applied to hasten and see what the response is.

Clearly many of these suggestions are not by people who play SS tankers or maybe even tankers. I don't think it is necessary normally to have such experience to make suggestions. However, this time I am re-thinking that position because they are clearly not considering the implications of their ideas or how non enjoyable they would be. I am glad people are interested and voicing an opinions but please think through what it would be like to play with such a power. This is not a 9th level power, it does not kill hoards of people with one shot, it is less powerful than hasten.

Before my respec and issue three I frequently teamed with an axe tanker 4-6 levels below me sk'd up to me. He has always out damaged me and still continues to do so. Even before when I had more slots in my attack powers than he did. He also has Hasten and I don't but I was going to have rage which I thought would balance everything out. Now that is not likely because I wont be getting Rage with penalties like this.

If rage makes the entire set unbalanced, which I don’t agree with, then the whole set needs to be changed. People want to have fun and beat things up. I would rather see a re-defining of the set and a build up then this type of change.

Since you mentioned invulnerability let me just point out that with the last respec I just removed 6 slots from my attacks to balance out my defenses. I just turned level 28 yesterday and was excited to take Rage so that some of the time I would have the damage I would have had before. (so much for my increase in tanker damage) Now I'm just not going to level up since I doubt there will be another free respec coming leaving my main character in limbo yet again, until this issue is decided. Luckily I have several alts I enjoy playing.

Ramseys

I posted this in a different place but I will post it here as well.

Okay lets look at what rage does as compared to another power that does something similar.

Rage I believe gives you +100% damage and +33% accuracy (like build up but for a very long time) So this basically doubles your DPS.

Hasten reduces all attack speeds by about half which also basically doubles you DPS. It increases defense instead of accuracy. Actually it also doubles use of ALL powers not just DPS.

So perhaps they should have similar restrictions. This may require that Rage needs more slots to become perma.. that is acceptable. But if -20% end on hasten is balanced then it should also work for Rage.

These two powers of course do not 100% reflect each other. But they are quite similar in their ability to double DPS. There are a few differences one is a level 6 power pool power and one is a level 28 secondary power. Attacking twice as much uses more endurance. Hasten Effects EVERY power and Rage only effects damaging powers. I generally believe that Hasten out ranks Rage in power by a bit but that is my opinion.

So I think the differences are currently somewhat balanced. The complete drop in end, I have to hope it is an error(which statesman just said basically wasn't). -20% like hasten seems plausible and will actually be more hurtful then the disorient has been. Hitting the tanker or anyone in the endurance is often more of a problem then the disorient was and will be a problem for everyone. I frequently even with 6 slotted stamina run out of endurance or nearly so. If I had a -20% drop at that time. It would drop my toggles equaling death.

I do not believe the risk should be any greater than Hasten.

SS does not have multiple area effect damage powers or cones. Until the 9th power there is only single target damage and one pbaoe disorient/knockback which is completely useless except for fun and a few situations(the only tanker power that might be worse than this is frozen aura). KO blow has the longest recharge times in the tanker secondaries for a damage power. Almost all of the secondary power sets have one cone and one pbaoe damage, some have multiple, SS only has Footstomp which is great but you can't get it till level 38.

I also realize that as I post this you may say hmmm, Hasten is not balanced so this is a not a valid argument except in the reverse and now we need to adjust hasten to be equally sucktastic. I hope that isn't the case but it is what it is.

Statesman I can see where you are coming from but completely disagree with this change. This makes this Rage unusable. Don't punish the clever people because other people choose to be ignorant.

Lets face it they can avoid stun with Fireshield, rooted, Wet Ice and Granite Armor as well. So lets not continue targeting Invulnerability as the cause of all tanker imbalances. Though it is likely that there are more invulnerability tankers with SS than any other primary ability because it is more traditional comic bookish.

I think with this change you are loosing site of the big picture. This removes a power from play it does not balance. Rage was theoretically the boost for all the low damage powers and lack of cones etc. However, it did have a side effect. If you do this change then I would increase everything's damage and turn it into build up. We don't have extreme or superior pbaoe or cone attacks. We do have one moderate large pbaoe with foot stomp. W/o rage there is a damage imbalance to fire, stone, mace, Axe and Energy. Ice is a different bird but likely could use some help. Possibly mace to but mace looks pretty good to me on one of my alts at least at low level.

Ramseys

Notice how this post came after an emergency server maintenence message? eh? The 5th column are going into the hacking bussiness!

Actually though it may or may not be coincidental that there was a server shut down shortly before the message came out.

Over the last week I have noticed that assisting/targeting through tankers and/or scrappers has not been working correctly. Previously it seemed that when you did this the tanker/scrapper drew the aggro from the attack.

I noticed this constantly during the Positron task force and now currently in synapse. I am a tanker and when they snipe or target through me, the blasters get blasted back. My tanker is INV/SS. The Blasters were Fire/fire and Energy/electric, got aggro using snipes and single target powers.

I thought maybe it was a task force thing. So I got on a blaster and targeted through a friendly scrapper and my snipes and single target attacks drew the aggro to me not to the scrapper. I carefully avoided using area fx powers since that complicates matters. Scrapper was MA/INV and blaster was ENG/FIRE.

Has there been a change? Is it suppose to work this way and the aggro draw before was incorrect? Or has something else happened?

Could someone comment on this because it would dramatically change the tactics we are currently trying to use that are not working to well.