PrincessDarkstar
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:A 5% chance to proc is roughly once every 3 minutes, and thats rounding in favour of the proc, in a team an AV might only last 3 minutes so from that proc you might be getting 100 extra damage over that whole time. While 100 damage is nothing to be sniffed at I wouldn't say it is the best use of the slot, thats all I was saying.Originally Posted by Obsidian_Force2I would'nt say a 2.5% is worthless any more that I would say a 3% def global bonus is worthless and yet people will pay 20 million+ for that single IO.
Ignoring all that, there is still that not as infrequent as some people like to think damage spike this proc provides.
I seriously do not know what other people are doing with their squids. Do they not solo? to where the improved damage your not getting from mooching bonuses from 7 other people on the team might matter? Do they never fight EB/AV's where their best bet is to stay outta melee and damage is at a premium? I dont know about anyone else but I like when my 166 damage blast hits for 240'ish for a couple cycles of attacks.
Though comparing it to the 3% defence IO which would cut incoming damage by 6% and can add up to a 50% survivability increase if it is that last push to the softcap is wrong.
I think you overplay the hugeness of that really, I can see on a lucky night it will proc on an AoE attack most of the time and would add up to a fair amount, but on average it shouldn't make a great deal of difference and I maintain that 2.5% average damage isn't much, especially considering that it isn't 2.5% of the total, its 2.5% of the base, which will be about ~1% extra total damage for a well slotted build.Quote:Originally Posted by Obsidian_Force2I run herostats I have compaired with and without the proc. The difference over a night of play is huge and anyone who can't differentiate much larger numbers from much smaller numbers needs to rethink their advice.
Overall yes it is a useful IO, but I think there are better uses for slots. A damage proc in one of the Nova ST attacks would add much more to your overall damage output, not to mention a proc in the AoE attacks. -
I agree with Obsidian_Force2 on this, I don't really like making builds where you deliberately miss out a key power and much prefer helping you make your own build by giving good advice.
The first thing I would say is that when I hit 50 my first build was a world away from my current build and evolution really helps when playing a Warshade as you discover which powers you use and which you don't.
Right now you may want to play in human and nova, but after you reach 50 and get nova slotted really well you may think that the damage in human isn't up to the task and want to spend more time in Nova, or you may feel a bit squishy and want dwarf!
So I would recommend playing all the way to 50 first, and as you come across powers research them and ask whatever questions you may need to so that when you hit 50 you know which powers you want and how often you use them. You can use that information to provide a template from which we can all help improve your build.
Also in general people much prefer helping change builds rather than just providing them, so no matter how bad your attempt is it will get more replies than with no build to start from. -
The way I would weight my build if doing it this way is to make sure you get to the point where you have perma-eclispe, then add defence to any other powers.
Perma-eclipse is such a great thing to have which means with 3-5 mobs around you will only receive 15% incoming damage, any defence you get will reduce that even further (25% defence would half that 15% to 7.5%) but isn't going to be able to make up for not having eclipse made perma.
Having just seen those numbers I would probably be over the moon with 25% ranged Def as long as I still had perma-hasten. I would say your 30% is plenty.
On the other side of that, if you aren't going to go for perma-eclipse anything under 40% is probably not going to be enough to cover you through the down times. -
Quote:Oh I completely agree, sadly I think it is a side effect of the mez system (Just from what I have read on the forums, not sure if it is speculation or dev confirmed but it makes sense) which would mean a massive amount of work to fix and I don't hold out a great deal of hope for it, which leaves us to make the best of a bad situation.Originally Posted by WavicleWe shouldn't have to do that.
If we are meant to be able to switch to Dwarf when mezzed then getting mezzed ought not to have an effect on an attempt to switch to Dwarf.
It's a bug. It should be fixed. -
Sorry if this is a mini-rant.
The Warshade (Kheldian) forums are the only place where people argue that the numbers aren't important.
My Warshade has been my main character for over a year but I have recently been playing a scrapper and when you hit the scrapper boards there are loads of people willing to help out with attack chains and reaching defence caps etc in order to give people the best possible advice, while still understanding that fun and playstyle come into it.
Yet on these boards I see people talking more about fun, which although an incredibly valid point (Who wants a character they don't enjoy playing?) it doesn't make the numbers any less important and if someone asks 'how can I cause the most damage' they really shouldn't be given a wide range of opinions, they should be told facts like 'get 57.4% global recharge and 6 slot the nova attacks as follows for the best damage'.
I made that 57.4% global recharge figure up, but on my Warshade I have exactly perma-hasten and can easily string together a nova attack chain with just the 4 powers (Or just the two ST powers) and although in human form there is Gravity Well which causes a shed load of damage even at my level of recharge it isn't up enough to count as part of a useful attack chain, and the rest of the human attacks are frankly rubbish.
To say to anyone that Nova isn't the most efficient method of dealing large amounts of damage is wrong, especially when AoE is king in this game.
In a large team with enough mobs Dwarf is probably the 2nd most effective damage form, Black Dwarf Mire can be made to permanently double stack, which is a ~200 damage AoE every 5 seconds, add to that the attack chain can be made with just the two attacks, one of which is actually very good and I think they are at least a match for the ST damage of Nova.
Human can only match that damage for a few seconds at a time, even with perma-Sunless Mire.
Yes causing that damage in human might be quite good fun, but it just isn't as effective, even factoring in the ~5 seconds out of every 90 that you need to switch to human for Eclipse when blasting in Nova.
I think at some point I will try and run the numbers because I am getting better at that with help from the scrapper section, but I am 100% sure they will prove me right, even discounting that you can have ~25 seconds in Nova with mire every time you drop to eclipse up again.
Of course all this is with a build that has enough recharge to string together attack chains in Nova/Dwarf, I actually can't remember if they have full chains with normal IO slotting or not because it has been so long (But I would assume they do, or very close to). If they don't then human form 'might' be better, but only by virtue of having enough attacks to form a full chain.
The final disclaimer on this is that I know damage isn't necessarily the only priority on a Warshade, but it is always good to be able to answer with facts when people ask questions. This section of the forum is very heavy on opinion, and very low on hard facts.
The lack of facts is also one reason people still think Kheldians are weak, and as a community I wish we could pull out some hard facts to prove otherwise. -
I wouldn't want to lose the shapeshifting animation (Well I would, but thats overpowered I think) so I can't see what difference going from one to the other would make, macro's can be made to drop to human and go straight to the other form with the time spent in human barely noticable so I can't see a point making it a feature.
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The bind solution from _dEOS_ is the way I have set mine up, and probably the easiest (I use z = human, x = nova and c = dwarf).
While it is frustrating when multiple mezzes stop you switching forms (Especially when it gets you killed) this is the simplest way to work through it, just hammer the key until you change! -
Quote:I haven't looked at the builds above but I thought it worth mentioning just in case you didn't know; but Stamina doesn't work when you are in either Nova or Dward form, so if you are looking for more recovery when in either form Stamina isn't really the way to go.Originally Posted by Falcon8Instead of what?
Also Stygian Cirlce is imho one of the best endurance recovery powers in the game (And one of the best self heals), so it is perfectly possible to run even a human only build without stamina and not have to worry about endurance. -
Quote:The simple answer is no.Originally Posted by WillowpawWould slotting an endurance reducer in dark Nova instead of putting them in the 2 Dark Nova AOE attacks have the same effect?
I haven't got the exact figures to hand so may be slightly out but Nova costs about .26 end per second, and recovers the same amount, so basically it breaks even out of the box.
If you put and endrdx in the form it will cost you about 0.2, saving you a tiny 0.06 end per second.
If you put that same endrdx into one of the attacks it will save you 2-3 end every time you attack, which works out a lot more effective than slotting the form itself.
The same goes for endmod in the form, you can get the form to recover about 0.4 and cost about 0.15 with enough slots (4-6), but the total 0.25 end per second recovery is still nothing compared to one endrdx in each power.
Edit:
I personally wouldn't slot the tohit either, I think out of the box you are getting +15% to hit, and if you need any more than that to hit an enemy the likelyhood is they have massive defence (Stacked veng on Nemesis for example) and your slotting still wont make a difference.Quote:Originally Posted by WillowpawCurrently I have Dark Nova slotted with a Flight and a To Hit Buff (which nullifies the need to burn 4 slots to get an accuracy in each attack), and then I put an endurance reducer in the two big squid attacks. Would replacing those 2 endurance reducers with a single one in Dark Nova itself be a better idea? I wouldn't mind freeing up a slot that way if the net effect is the same.
However tohit does multiply the effect of accuracy so it is still a good idea to have an accuracy in each attack, but that depends on the level of mobs you go up against, if you run around on anything below 3rd difficulty you can still probably get away without. -
Cheers Umbral, thats pretty much what I was thinking.
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Sorry to forget your DM/Regen Umbral, I read the old US forum but not often enough to remember peoples toons (Though I do remember you for giving good advice
) so was going from what I could remember EU side.
Also I thought I had managed to get rid of this thread before anyone saw lol. Seems I failed.
However if has given me another question, which is how much +DEF should I be looking for if I did build a fire/regen (Considering aside from pvp IO's this is money no object)? Should I be aiming for 20ish% positional defence and making the recharge/regen do the rest of the work or is there a balance somewhere that I should be aiming for?
I guess I should also be asking about how much recharge I need and what the best attack chain is for fire melee, but I am sure I have read that someplace so will have a look myself rather than be considered too lazy. -
Ignore this thread
I would delete it if I coudl figure out how -
Quote:I have been wanting to reply to this post for a long time but couldn't from EU side so am very happy with the mergerOriginally Posted by DiscoKatA PB can control with knockback, act as a pseudo defender with glowing touch, scrap with melee attacks & blast with range. If you include the three forms then you add tanking & more blasting. Much more versatile than a WS. WS has some variety but lacks the all around punch of versatility that the PB can bring.
Still great for teams but just not as versatile. A WS can't fill as many roles as a PB on a team.
Anyway I disagree seriously with your take on PB's being more versatile than Warshades, not once have I been in a situation and thought "Yay a PB" (Actually the complete opposite mostly) but I have been grateful for Warshades many times.
Firstly knockback is the worst type of control possible, yes it is total control because things can't fight back but it completely destroys the average kill speed of a good team having to adjust position and targets to see where things have ended up. And as a PB you would be doing the team a much bigger favour just killing stuff. Oh also Gravatic Emination + Inky Aspect from a Warshade totally locks down whole spawns permanently, in a much more useful way than anything a PB can do.
Secondly counting Glowing Touch as a power which gives good utility is laughable. Yes you have a heal but you are never going to keep anyone alive if they were in serious danger, and even if you do it would probably be more use to use that time causing damage and just rez your team mate after the mob is cleared. Putting slots and time into a power which is of so minimal use means there is going to be a more useful power being underslotted.
Scrapping with melee attacks is a valid point as something you can do, but regardless of where you are the; damage form for Kheldians is Nova, so if you want to count damage as a skill you should be slotting Nova not scrapping (And I do not understand why no PB's get this).
The only thing I would be tempted to grant you is that White Dwarf is a better tank than Black Dwarf, but with the new Black Dwarf Mire I would even contest that.
Anyway that wasn't a dig at you DiscoKat, I just don't like to see people being mislead. -
This looks as good a thread as any to dive into for my first post in the Warshade section, I have been on the EU forums for a while but haven't done too many posts. Anyway I am a Warshade player at heart and have a few thousand hours racked up on my Tri-former.
So hello
On topic: From memory I think Obsidian_Force is correct that it works out as a 2.5% damage bonus, but you have to remember that a lot of that damage potential is wasted because it will go off out of combat and won't proc at all when you aren't in Nova, so overall isn't quite as good as a full 2.5% damage bonus.
I would also say that a 2.5% damage bonus is next to worthless, you may as well pop one small red every 10 minutes to get a similar average damage bonus, and reds drop much more frequently than that.
I would also say never 6 slot the form (Unless going for DEF builds) because no matter what you put into it you will never get as good a return from your slotting investment as putting those slots to use in some of the powers. The biggest complaint about Kheldians is slot-starvation, slotting anything that wont kill the enemy of save your life isn't of great value imho. I would only ever use the first slot in Nova, and would go for either a fly speed IO or a fly/end Hami-O if you have the money.
The only other time I would advise more slots in Nova is if you have endurance issues, but you really shouldn't. -
Hi All,
[Flattery] I have been looking forward to being able to post on here for quite some time because you seem to give just about the best advice on any section of the forums.[/Flattery]
Anyway my current main scrapper is a Dual Blades/Willpower and I am trying to get the best build possible. Initially I went for an attack chain of Blinding Feint > Attack Vitals Combo > repeat and dropped the other attacks, and that did let me get some good defence, but in the last few days I decided that I can't get my head around life without the Sweep combo, so thought I would come here for advice.
The new plan is:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Sliceo - Again: Level 50 Natural Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Dual Blades
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Power Slice -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(5)
Level 1: High Pain Tolerance -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(5), Numna-Heal/Rchg:50(11), Mrcl-Rcvry+:40(19), Mrcl-Heal:40(19)
Level 2: Ablating Strike -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), Hectmb-Dam%:50(11), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(33), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(40), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(40), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg:50(50)
Level 4: Fast Healing -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(23), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+:50(27), RgnTis-Regen+:30(27), Heal-I:50(33)
Level 6: Mind Over Body -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(7), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(7), RctvArm-ResDam:40(9), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(9)
Level 8: Blinding Feint -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(13), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(15), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(34), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg:50(40), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg:50(50)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- Ksmt-ToHit+:30(A)
Level 12: Combat Jumping -- Zephyr-Travel:50(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx:50(13)
Level 14: Super Jump -- Zephyr-Travel:50(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx:50(15)
Level 16: Rise to the Challenge -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(17), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:50(17)
Level 18: Vengeful Slice -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(34), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(37), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(43), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg:50(48)
Level 20: Quick Recovery -- Efficacy-EndMod:50(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg:50(21), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc:50(21), Efficacy-EndMod/EndRdx:50(23)
Level 22: Swift -- Run-I:50(A)
Level 24: Health -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(25), Numna-Heal/Rchg:50(25)
Level 26: Sweeping Strike -- Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg:50(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(33), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg:50(34), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx:50(37), Armgdn-Dam%:50(43)
Level 28: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod:50(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg:50(29), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc:50(29), P'Shift-End%:50(31)
Level 30: Heightened Senses -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(A), LkGmblr-Def:50(31), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:50(31)
Level 32: One Thousand Cuts -- Oblit-Dmg:50(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg:50(36), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg:50(36), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(46), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(46), Oblit-%Dam:50(50)
Level 35: Typhoon's Edge -- Erad-Dmg:30(A), Erad-Acc/Rchg:30(36), Erad-Dmg/Rchg:30(37), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:30(43), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:30(45), Erad-%Dam:30(46)
Level 38: Boxing -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(39), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(39), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(39)
Level 41: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(42), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(42), RctvArm-ResDam:40(42)
Level 44: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(A), LkGmblr-Def:50(45), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:50(45)
Level 47: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(A), LkGmblr-Def:50(48), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:50(48)
Level 49: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I:50(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Ideally I want the build to be able to keep the BF>AV attack chain for single targets (I want to be able to take out AV's, though I know it will be slow with lethal damage, so took conserve power to allow me to keep that up, but have never actually needed it yet so am considering swapping it for SoW) as well as having the Sweep combination for Task Forces etc.
Is there anything any of you can see to improve this? Either on the DPS or survivability side.
Thanks in advance
Edit: Completely a PvE only build
Edit 2: This is a pretty much no budget build but the crazy stuff like the PvP +3 Def is out of the question, I am just too tight to fork out 500mil+ on one IO -
I am Princess Darkstar and a Warshade player by heart but my latest character is a scrapper (DB/WP) and from reading these forums I am slowly converting and plan a scrapper for my next character as well (Elec/Shield).
I was an avid reader of the US scrapper section when I was on the EU boards and look forward to picking the collective brains of what are the most helpful section of players I have seen in any game
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Hello US!
I have been looking forward to this merge for a long time and owe you all a big thank you for helping me with my scrapper (DB/WP) even though you didn't know it! -
Did you build up you own defence on that build or just rely on the -tohit? I would have thought an AV would resist it quite a lot.
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I noticed the power of fluffy last night on my scrapper going through the high level carnie arc, even surrounded by ring mistresses and illusionists the summoned fluffies because my first targets.
I took TP as a travel power on my build (Just to be different) so that has the nice side effect of being able to put him where I want him. -
Thanks for the speedy replies
That is roughly what I thought, the build I have at the moment is full of procs including all the pet def/res ones so they should be pretty safe and then I have just tried to get the best numbers out of whatever is left.
Since I am not planning on the tankerminding route I think I will stick with what I have.
And as a plus it looks like it should be a fairly cheap build, as long as I can break my habit of adding an extra 0 onto my bids! -
Thanks for the speedy replies
That is roughly what I thought, the build I have at the moment is full of procs including all the pet def/res ones so they should be pretty safe and then I have just tried to get the best numbers out of whatever is left.
Since I am not planning on the tankerminding route I think I will stick with what I have.
And as a plus it looks like it should be a fairly cheap build, as long as I can break my habit of adding an extra 0 onto my bids! -
I have looked both here and in the US forums, and unless my search-fu is failing me there seems to be very little in the way of information about this particular combo.
I have read all the dark guides for defenders etc so more or less understand the secondary, but what I can't seem to figure out is what I should aim for set bonus wise when I hit 50, and just how powerful a build it can be.
Should I just try and slot it so that each power is as good as it can be, or is there some kind of bonus worth aiming for?
Also my bots/ff can easily (And slowly. Very slowly) solo AV's and full spawns so will zombies/dark eventually bring similar power? -
Nice work, this kinda thing is what inspires me.
Keep it up
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Well considering the test server hasn't worked for me since I made that post I understand where you are coming from Shannon.
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I can't seem to get any of my characters transferred over now, tried last night and again today and haven't had anyone move.