Premonitions

Red Robin was pretty boss.

It's also kind of important to note that what that would be is a complete overhaul of the current "Tights" options which, is a bit much to ask for by any standard. Better to take what is unique about each style and isn't currently in this game and fold it into one focused set(slipping a few muti-purpose "Detailed" tights options) filled with New things, and Accept that Golden age or Silver age loses out this time, than to attempt to get both with one generic and nebulously defined stone of "better tights".

Post-Apoc fans asked for Road Warror and Mad Max and Got Mad Max And Road Warrior. Golden Age Fans should ask for Old Flash and Green Lantern(and possibly Captain America or Classic Batman) in order to get exactly that.

You seem to be gearing yourself up to get into a fight that isn't there.
You're taking my argument that These (Golden and Silver Age) are different styles, and putting them together in the same suggestion confuses the message as some kind of attack. Whereas it's just a statement I've been making(repeatedly) to help in clarifying the message for the benefit of the cause.
My point is the request for "Gold/Silver age" is not as coherent as those asking for other things because it's actually two, and maybe three, different requests pushed together.
They are neither a minority nor a majority. Which is the point. That is not an attack. Saying that your desires are completely equal to every one else's desire isn't an insult.

That's fine, that's not the most important part of the discussion, here.

Individuals have definitely been making consistent requests for what they individually want, certainly. But One guy asking for a plain patterned baggy-tights, High collared, domino mask and funny hat style is not consistent with another guy asking for a tight tights, Dynamically patterend, capeless half or full masked, under-arm webbing or wings style.

That's two different guys asking for two different things. Both of them showing up in the same thread and claiming (and agreeing) to ask for the same thing makes the message inconsistent and disorganized. Silver Age fans should define what Silver Age is, particularly what makes it unique, and push for those things. Golden Age fans should do the same for their own. In different directions, as different groups.


The "point" of this thread was to ask why such costume pieces weren't added or put on the schedule and express displeasure at such. Zwill explained the why. I think ultimately it's more constructive to discuss how to better direct the message to create the most effect on the dev team. This is not a semantics argument, this is a "These two things look different, stop saying they are the same" argument.

Now who's misrepresenting the other side of the argument?

Wah.. really?
Not more than what you mentioned up there. Or anything else.

This really exemplifies my point about "Gold/Silver age" doing more harm than good. And "A Golden Age" and "A Silver Age" being the ideal. Stop lumping yourselves and the ideas you love in together in places they ultimately don't belong, in order to be an "us" against a fictionalized "them" You've spent all this time justifying yourself in an argument over a topic you admit you're not necessarily as invested in as something else in the hopes that it might tangentially benefit your individual wants.

Zwill If I where to make a Thread similar to a "costume pack sneak peak" thread, With a list of images and descriptions of the various parts(in terms of attachment and what have you) Would you do a similar breakdown to the dev team? if possible I'd like to put a Poll in it as well.

And wildly divergent from one poster to the next,(myself included) With several different camps within the same thread asking for opposing things that both sides claimed was within the same genre, and many many claims for "general super hero stuff" a Functionally useless request when attempting to ask for "not x, but y" I.E. something specific If you take out the numerous back and forth off-topic discussions(of which I was certainly a part) several multi and double posts by the same players(something I did, again) Trolls, Golden Girl, and Dev posts, the numbers were most likely about the same as the pummit, or, if greater, not by very much.

It's very often the same group of people making the Golden/Silver age(urgghhhh!) requests. Over and over again. It's not that less people want one over the other. It's that one group wants their thing more, and extremely dislikes when the other get's theirs. It's not that Golden or Silver Age are pushed for more it's that they are pushed for harder

Bolded bit here, This is EXTREMELY debatable, because, again, Golden and Silver age are different things, and many people lump Pulp in with Golden age which further muddies the issue. This can be seen in the previous thread getting so noisy that NS made a second thread just to focus on the one thing they might have had in common. With Post-Apoc People asked for Mad Max and Fallout and got Mad Max and Fallout. With Retro Sci-fi they asked for Buck Rogers and got Buck Rogers.

With Golden/Silver Age People Asked for: The Shadow, The Green Hornet The Rocketeer Old AND New Flash, The Original X-men The Clairmont X-men And The movie X-men As well as Spider-man Batman And Superman
That is NOT a cohesive message. That's fifty years of about ten different artistic approaches at a most charitable minimum.
I've already gone over this above, I'm just quoting it so nobody will say I ignored it. I do agree that there was an unintentional misinterpretation of the NS thread versus the very clear "We will make this set and put it in game" nature of the Pummit.

This I disagree with. for pretty much the reasons I went into above Tldr the problem is:

• The false impression that "My side" who want this represent a majority of any kind
• The idea that the "other side" represents a minority
• The idea that the "other Side" has less clear or distinct ideas

• The idea that "My side" Is not ill defined or muddled

Ultimately, people asking for this particular thing are just one group amongst the diverse player base. And do not represent a majority. If they want to be heard like everyone else they need to present like anyone else. That includes a cohesive statement. One key problem is they are very often several groups asking for different things under the same banner(perhaps in unity against "da eeebil emo RP glampire robot animu catbois" threatening us true fans") You're not more you're just one more.
People are going to have to bite the bullet and present one thing with the knowledge that they aren't going to get another(at that point in time) Ask for Golden Age, get Golden Age, wait for another opportunity for Silver age to have it's turn. Accept loss gracefully if it doesn't get that turn and try again later.

It's not just baggyness. Golden age costumes tend to lean more towards the simple in terms of pattern, if there's any "pattern" at all. It's all about texture and shape there.

Silver age tends to have more dynamic and unique patterning to them.

Compare the Original Batman and Superman

With Spider-man

There's exceptions as with anything but those tend to be more unique, and even then there's a marked difference if those characters get a "Reboot"
Golden Age Wonder Woman

While not a red/blue side thing this issue only ever seems to crop up one of two ways.

*Pack get's released*
"Ugh this is horrible this kind of thing(and by extension the types of characters it is based on and/or their players) Don't belong in this game. it's Supposed to be about superheroes Who would ever want to be such a horrible thing? "
After which the poster will proceed to

1: Pigeonhole many potential ideas and goes on at length to use terms like "weaboo" "generic geek stuff" and anything of that nature to insult the people who might like this sort of thing and these sort of characters.
2: Talk about "taking our game away from us the true fans" or anything else to make one sound like a grumpy old person talking about "the True Americans" e.t.c.
3: Do either of these while also playing the victim
or

"I'mma just go ahead and be unhelpful and sarcastic about this any time it comes up."

*proceeds to do any of the above.*

I am very sympathetic and would love pretty much anything a Golden Age, Silver Age, or Pulp pack would bring. It's just very hard not to treat the people attempting to give it it's deserved attention any kind of respect when they refuse to come with any.

I Cried a little bit when he dismissed Power Rangers in that thread.
These characters are more pulp and are pretty much Coat-hat-Mask.

This is probably a better example of Golden Age
Captain Marvel is Pretty Golden Age and we could use a lot of what he has.

What exactly do you think Casey Jones is?

That's kind of off.

See, Casey Jones is, a guy, in a mask, who goes out at night.. and, you know, fights criminals In New York. Like, you know, pretty much the entire Non X-men and Avengers Marvel Universe.
He doesn't have any powers. He's just a tough Fighter.

I can see the (bad) logic behind "Oh this Post Apocalyptic theme doesn't fit the game" but you're shooting yourself in the foot by constantly making Casey Jones comparisons.

Hell, if this was explicitly a Casey Jones-esque Pack It'd be the ONLY pack based on contemporary Costumed Crimefighters they've made.

Zwill are you unfamiliar with what cornrows are?
What's in the cybertech pack are Dreadlocks, Maybe braids if you squint, in a dreadlock headband.
That really doesn't have anything to do with what you quoted....

Is the reason we keep getting odd hair choices is because the dev team don't know what certain hairstyles are?

I was under the impression it was an AI thing brought on by the DoT+Slow in the AoE.

In any case Presence always felt like either the "Ventriloquism" power or the "I AM THE NIGHT!" power so two fears, a placate and a taunt make sense. An aura that has some kind of control effect does too and I like the idea of just sending them running in fear as you approach. A taunt aura could work too but I'd hope those self-buffs wouldn't be removed if so.

You're right!