PennyPA

Des!

I replied first to the thread and said:
I blame Voodoo.

And another is to just blame Voodoo.

Aaaaaaaaahhhh, the explanation why you treat MG the way you do....

I thought I was a happy box...wait...that didn't come out right!

Stalkers, blasters, and dominators were changed because the devs felt they were not up to their expectations as an AT.
You have data to prove that defenders are not performing as an AT per the devs expectations?
If you don't, then why would they give a free buff out that is not needed since defenders can't be shown to be underperforming? "Just because"?

And your point?

Of course, my D3 defender would run circles around my ice/ice tank or grav/ff controller.


It is simple to keep as is. There are defenders that solo well and other not as much. Maybe I should start a thread that corruptors need more because my dark/therm corr was hard to solo. My ice/cold, son/kin, and fire/rad corr's would love the buffs for their soloing.

I am saying "balance" in that a buff would be balanced by a nerf, especially a free one like the OP suggested.

The devs are always looking at balance. Did ET get changed to be balanced by its damage? Did the dom sets get changed so whole sets bring more instead of one power? Did the animation times for blaster powers all get balanced out? Yeah, no evidence there.

My D3 def and kin def and my current planned build for my cold/ice def have plenty of attacks. Only my emp/psi doesn't.


Defenders do enough damage as is. Do we all need speed runs now to have more damage to kill faster?

Typo, in OP, it was said that defenders fall out of those steamrolling teams.


We already bring a lot to any team. Please point out to me where in 5+ years defenders never brought anything to a team. What does a scrapper bring to a team? I see teams that prefer blasters instead. What does a second, third, or fourth+ tank bring to a team? I see teams that want more damage/buff&debuff. What does a kheld bring to a team? Outside of all AT TFs, I have never seen "need more khelds" advertised.

Again, I have to ask, unless data to the contrary showing how poor the defender AT is performing and their lack of ability to team (aka blaster and stalker data/changes), will a free buff be given to defenders without any negative consequences? If so, the devs can't take away from our damage, so that leaves our buffs/debuffs. And this is my objection to the OP.

And I want to keep defenders as great as they are and not be weakened so we can blast a couple of meaningless mobs. Maybe you team with poor defenders/buff bots. I see defenders blasting all the time.

Unless the devs are datamining this AT, I haven't seen defenders as underperforming or not working as intended. So, for me at least, I am concerned the devs would not give buff without some kind of negative balance attached.

Honestly, are you saying defenders don't bring enough for teams? And one of my defenders is emp/psi - do I really bring a whole lot more with my paultry few psi blast to help wipe out mobs? I still disagree that a free buff to defenders would be given as described. It may make defenders more soloable, but bring less to teams.

And after reading again, I just don't see how the OP will expand a defender's perceived team role.

You disregarded my examples as irrelevant. I wonder how just a bunch of buff bots beat a number of TFs if they were just standing around like your version of a defender. Even, that short MSTF run. You mention in the OP about fast paced battles - did you read that 3 of the 8 members were defenders? They were never fell out of it.

They are fun now. Why ruin it by taking away what we bring to teams?

I still disagree with you on this point What can be shown to be wrong with defenders? Yes, some solo better than others. But this buff would not be given freely (aka nerf to something else). The devs have a history of balancing what they do for the whole game. Buffing defenders would require either some kind of reduction or balance to other ATs, especially corruptors. Defenders are an AT that make others shine more greatly, as you know and the other posters point out. They would have to diminish our ability to enhance others if we are to become more soloable, and that is what I am against.

To me it is relevant because if defenders or teams of defenders can handle the hardest content of the game, then what is a radio mission or a story arc with a single AV at the end? I should point out I have done other all AT (scrapper, blaster, controller, MM, VEAT) S/TFs, and in my experience, only the all MM SFs come close to the ease and power of all defender TFs.

Thanks!

I would say "No thank you, I don't want my defender nerfed in other areas."
Because I believe that since defenders can't be shown to be underperforming or not "working as intended", then any buff would have to be balanced by a decrease elsewhere. It can't be our damage (aka secondaries), so it has to come from our buffs/debuffs (aka primaries).

From my reading on the forums, three ATs that were not performing as expected, blaster, stalkers, and dominators, all received changes because they were not meeting the devs expectations as an AT. The blaster can now damage under status effects, the stalker has greater team benefit, and dominators with the damage boost and changing of the powers in general.

The devs have also shown balance in changes to powers, such if one like damage is increase, then something else (like recharge time or end cost) is increased.

I have been on all defender TFs and we shread the mobs. You seriously think we need more damage or HP with our force multiplication?

I have done an STF with 6 dark and 2 storm defenders. In the last part we IGNORED LR to take the towers down, just defuffed and hit the towers - and didn't use any temps either. Could an all tanker, scrapper, kheld, or blaster STF do that? (Controllers may be able too.)

The fastest MSTF I have done is 43 min, which I know is not a record. The make up of the team was tank, scrapper (me), 2 blasters, controller, and 3 (THREE) defenders. Who was the liability and almost blew the run and was saved by the one shot code? Me on my DM/Regen scrapper - the one with more HP and damage than a defender.

I am somewhat surprised to hear all these issues with defenders after 5 years of playing them.

That confuses me. How is teammates dying the defenders fault? If a blaster wants to absorb the alpha, and a scrapper splits off and takes on a group solo and dies, then a defender should get kicked?

In my experience, if the team doesn't work with the defender, then the issue is with them. On my emp, many times a player has ran off around a corner and I lose LOS so I can't heal/buff them if needed so that they end up dying. If players want to scatter away from my target or me when I play my kin or dark defs and miss the heals, then they get no heals. I won't bother to chase the player down if it means the rest of the team suffers. In other words, I let them die.
Other times, the team is way in over its head. My defenders can mitigate damage, but not 1000's of point of damage coming in. No one player can do that. I do my best to slow down the deaths, but in the end the teams dies because there is no way to mitigate that much damage. I don't see an issue here that a defender should be kicked because they let them die or they are being slackers in any sense.
The only message vigilance sends me is that I can get a little boost if the team is having a hard time and I can get a battle rez in or toss in a few more buffs/heals to prevent a wipe, which is perfect in my opinion.

WOW NANCY! Where did you find the room put this portrait?

And are some of the pics suspiciously close-up?

"Another"??? He hasn't even sent me one yet...

Ditto!

And...
As the others have said repeatedly, they are balanced as is. After 5 years, you are not the first to play a defender. A lot of people have and recognized how great they are (I have 3 currently at 50 and starting my 4th).

They are balance for what they can do for teams, especially when teamed together. The devs did place, though, a few sets that have the tools to solo much better than some of the other sets (like my D3 def soloing better than my emp def could solo, but they could both solo). My biggest concern with your quote is that the devs may need to balance any buff they give. It has yet to be shown to me at least that defenders are underperforming as an AT. They buffed stalkers and blasters because they had data to show they weren't performing as expected. I could have missed the post, but did Castle or Posi say they were concerned about defenders and how they are not performing as expected? Otherwise, all you have is your perception of the AT and a number of others, including myself, have a vastly different perception of the AT.

And after reading Luminara's posts, it is making me greatly wonder just what are you playing and slotting. Only suggestion here is to use the multiple build feature and make one team friendly and one that is solo friendly by skipping team buffs and such.