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Posts
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I can say what I hate most about Regen.
I would like to see the MoG cast time lowered. The air punch is too slow even for my disabled mum with arthritis. I would like to see it eliminated when running in and then I would like to see MoG last 30s.
The MoG animation. Punching the air. I could run in, see something suddenly and think "Oh boy I better" and MoG, to stop running and stand still for a lengthy enough amount of time whilst a team mate(s) who is unaware of what I saw runs by and straight in to defeat. But never mind I just spent 3 secs of standing still for 15s of awesomeness. Yep that will help me get through that remainder of a 20s average fight duration except half the team is missing, so that won't will help me get through the 40s fight duration
When I go awesome, not only do I like to feel different, I like to look different, the molecules in my body have been altered by the extremophiles in my system that work faster to restore my body. I like to change costume only the costume can't change back when MoG crashes. I know a faster costume change would lag servers because everyone can costume change often but not everyone can MoG and to be able to MoG from one costume change to another is better.
I don't think given the rest of the set which might be over-rated a tad, I mean for a start a clicky secondary lowers the dps of a primary that I am asking for too much. -
You mean to tell me that you go into hibernate and lose aggro? Clearly its not a good idea to need hibernate running into a mob on a patientless team but other than certain cases where taunt is resisted post 32 you can pretty much hibernate quick and come out with no loss of aggro. Certainly sometimes better than with Firetanks RoTP, they can die and lose aggro much more easily even after consolidation.
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Can say that the turrets on BaF are a prob but not an insurmountable one. They can't target everywhere. Plus these trials have plenty of people on them who should be buffing and job sharing anyway.
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I think it would be too OP to have lower no phase period in PvP.
Can't say I need a lower no phase period in PvE because I literally don't.
Icicles was put there to help Icetankers before defense scaleability, not removed after defense scaleability but a no phase period was put in. I am going on memory as I don't keep notes at all but all appears fine to me.
Ice is more or less about right as is. -
I got into micro-biology, learning about extremophile bacteria, giving me a concept that worked well with both regen and the MoG. Happy with this concept, I made a Regen, MoG and the rest of the Regen set were completely compatible. Then what do they do? Frigging change MoG, but it was alright I could work with that but it just needed to last the length between cossie changes.
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My suggestion using the build you have with the slots that are there already:
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Code:| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1506;667;1334;HEX;| |78DA85944B73D25018864F489042C182502E6D814229B75A84D1BDE3D8D671065A2| |ABAEC74A21329CA040C74BCECFC0B5E77B6BA74E16FF0EE8FD156F7BDA41FF9DE22| |63166680E7F09EF3E67C9793D41E2D793F5C7B7A5948DEAB6DB5D7DBBCA9EAF7356| |3ACB6DD57FBAD8E2EE8921BDBAA8B18E3B9CD25EDAEA6F7B4D24A4B331E6F5ED936| |D428666A5A5B3BD5AD71E0BABEA5199ADE2F9D0EBCF54EA75DAA6A6AB7A5377DD69| |F955673ABFF9F7FC1E56EEB4E6959D78C26DD5AEDF5698B28C554A0EF2737FD4883| |484D5924689053842309A6984A9A19F0085CA622AA8434CDD5986756C135E6D886B| |03C9FE9FE12DF5F916A34A8D0DC2AD3B3065699DE3A33420593791F214FCB9616A4| |BD9DAC399D070E21E2B4FE9079F6083C66FA4D87E5392FD8FB956270594198B2EB1| |9CFF99F33CFBD005F32C3B4B79BE315EE498EE71BF9C751A371D428841A8550A330| |6A1425BF0F7E5F4A58FE8FE49F60CD39B1CF31867F32A3BFC03DE6D443F64C3D617| |E276F0079070E38C69943F088993806917702793B289620EA1834E912322993C864| |1299CC22935964328B4C145A1BC1DA889F2B910A80211015FA4151C6782729B6C09| |1CF8111EADC34329846E7E6D0B939742E83CE65FEE95C88BC7178E35D9ECB18CC6C| |8759D4E179C05CECA193E44D22A62462C982519A4BE324A77192B338C9399CE41C4| |E72EE1E7B62E4998767BECE738575F006D86016E1D9A134F288218FBD8BE07B9F10| |0B38290BAF39E65D5A5FC21EA537AC5DD80177C1B7CCCA3BE617AA7D19F7290F1A4| |6759C51864F2A7D069DBF64538A36A562532EDA94B24DA9DA94BA82570A2992A5EC| |79469445CE7F7F54CBB3F6FBAFE690D6F96C2DDE021BCC3FA36BF03457F034575E3| |10BCAF0AD66BAFDC3B78959F70C3AC16375647C7B64BC31323E017A7EF059| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
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When you play one, you have a tohit bonus. You could find yourself content that reduces your basic tohit of 75% down to -75% within taking an alpha. That's a huge drop in accuracy. This could happen at level 30. You haven't fully slotted, Foc Acc is too many levels away. Do you think the Power Siphon alone is going to counteract that? It's not exactly build up is it? So anyway, your death shroud is missing yet costing you end, cloak of fear is missing costing you end, Oppressive Gloom is missing but the end cost is hardly worth caring about, your attacks are missing costing you end but the real pain it the butt is watching Dark Regen miss, costing you end before you die.
Now that doesn't have to happen but watch the tohit debuffs. -
Quote:For the sake of testing I run without inspirations otherwise I am bsing myself on balance testing. Insp trays give random insps anyway, over the course of time you can be all out. Team make up, why should I care what other people play? I shouldn't be kicking someone to get someone else to fill my holes - that came out wrongBesides, haven't you learned to use inspirations yet? One or two Lucks makes a huge difference in survivability. This wouldn't be the first defensive set that would need a little inspirational help in the leveling process. My Dark Armor Brute ate blues faster than a 5 year old kid eats candy on Halloween, even after IO's until I got Cariac Alpha slotted. I don't see how Regen would be any worse off needing to carry purples and oranges.
I think this discussion might need to address the fact that Brutes already have Regen. This means that they way it was proliferated to Brutes has already undergone balance testing and they have decided its fine. So now all they really need to do is balance the scale up to Tanks in the same amount as the other sets that are shared with Brutes. How much better is SR on a Tank than a Brute? If I recall correctly, it is the only power set to be proliferated in this direction. SR is easier to soft cap, the scaling resists are slightly better, and it has more hit points, but is not drastically changed or drastically better
on a Tank.
Brutes have different expectations, I know as a Brute where I just can't do what a Tanker would, more so leveling up and pre IO set, scenarios where a Regen Brute would do just as badly if not worse.
Back to insps, Lucks are the greatest thing until you don't need them, then may come everything else and this is because lucks can actually help you over their duration better. Sturdies by extra time but don't cause misses. Greens put back health but the next hit could wipe that greens worth away. Anything other than lucks is second rate, even BFs, if ya didnt get hit in the first place ya wouldnt be held. A regen with neither res/def is simply going to have more holds stacked against them, screw it more kinds of debuffs, the wait for your rechging powers just takes forever. You lack your dullpain permaing, everything takes longer to rechg, you've lacked defense, you've got everything and no resistance to buy even a defender time. You can bring insps if ya like but in many places in game you'll run out soon enough.
My argument is that although under many terms and conditions regen can apply it's still not balanced enough. -
Your having the equivalent of 2 slots wasted due to enhancement diversification. I pretty much think that you can get decent bonuses and more bang for buck putting the slots elsewhere. To go from 167% down to less than 100% for the sake of a bonus, I wouldn't do it, 9/10 there is an alternative way to slot the build and achieve roughly the same result.
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Quote:When Electric Armor was first in beta I rolled up a level bumped 50 Elec/SS tanker and ran some experiments with radio missions set to +2x8 against a variety of foes. I tested that Elec tanker on SO enhancements, a version of my Inv/Stone on SO enhancements and my Broadsword/Shield scrapper with a soft capped IO build. I found in nearly every instance that the Elec was actually the least durable (remember this was SO enhanced) with the Invuln (also on SO's) second while the BS/Shield was able to cruise through all the missions without a lot of trouble thanks to the far greater kill speed... and the great durability the Shield scrapper has at peak IO performance.
A basic SO'd SR scrapper with Aid self has greater damage sustainability overall (consider all attack types) than a basic SO'd Invuln Tanker. Power choices will come into things.
If you take any Scrapper and IO set it well you might well increase its average damage sustainability above that of its basic Tanker counterpart and other types too.
Perfectly normal.
Edit: Not forgetting one thing, the AT meant to take on the AV and lead in raw DPS, in the beginning : Scrapper. -
It's a first to see someone go against the flow. Most things have been done when it comes to AVs by SR Scrappers. So tanking should be okay with the know how, then itrials bigger kettle of fish, a little bit more of a different story but doable, ya might think that other tankers have it alot easier but when it comes to them trials the difference between a good or a bad trial is down to team effort.
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I think Poison is the most complicated set to create and get everyone behind. Storm is a set that wasn't fully respected for a good while and then not fully understood for a good while longer. Certainly the -range in hurricane was underestimated, ignored and so under utilised when a lot of late game issues was easily sorted with it and other powers complimentary to it. Every attribute has to be taken into account or set that doesn't help in certain situations at first look won't ever help.
I've got 3 of these Poisons so my perspective is not too one sided but to fully understand the set is going to take time. From that I think if you buff it after the new changes, it has to be carefully done. Like with Sonic Resonance you can't quite give Defenders or Corrupters exactly what might be needed because you overpower Controllers. Before considering changes all ATs have to be taken into account.
With each AT there is a design concept. This set is built around a design intent. We either play to it or we don't. Play completely wrong and yes it needs the most buffs, find the right playstyle and build to help perform in it, still there might be issues in places, take into account PvP and maybe needs a slight buff thats complicated to nail. I was troubled by the set initially, the trouble I had with it is what's being fixed. Now for me the sense of urgency when it comes to fixes is elsewhere.
What might be an idea is try to replicate accurately a problem from ingame into peoples minds. People can come together to solve them or duplicate the situation ingame to see how shocking it is. By solving we might see the play intent, by being shocked we might see where a problem lies and maybe come up with multiple ways to fix it.
Teams steam rolling content might make any set feel useless, except those buffing away with shields perhaps but even with one debuff thrown in you're part of the equation. I've had it with TA, but I knew the team was faster as result of what little I did. With only so much fight duration everyone has to fit their cast times in that small timespan, so we as a team were all doing equally as little. Ofc any excessive cast times would have to be fixed but what is excessive compared to everyother set and would it in a pvp environment be OP if lowered? -
Quote:Again another fully IO setted toon.Here's about what I'd do. 32.5% S/L defense, 3000+ hp with really close to perma dull pain, MOG up more than every minute and a half, IH about every 3 minutes, 30% S/L resists, and 13% to every thing else. Change this from Brute to Tank scales and I'd be a really happy camper.
Pointless arguing, people have their opinions and around and around in circles we will all go.
Dark Armour is Borderline. Super Reflexes is Borderline. The game content, especially all the old npcs and where you can find them in their level ranges were never put there with Dark Armour tankers or Super Reflex Tankers in mind. Regen in my opinion is even more borderline.
Yes we could all IO at 50, yes we could all tank some enemy group or another leveling up and actually think we've accomplished something which makes everything possible but overall on the whole the old game content is still there to level through without the new proliferated sets in mind when they were created.
I know that some people could end up with a lvl 50 Regen Tanker tanking, well whatever but the leveling up experience wouldn't be as comfortable as it is whilst fulfilling normal expectations without some avoidance or without beyond normal expectations in terms of support. Too much reaction need apply, too much self conservation clicking as opposed to the job at hand need apply. -
Look at Invulns weaknesses, SR should either be somewhere as weak to some way stronger. SR is stronger in the fact it responds so well to positional attacks and its position is of less importance. Attack chains that can be done in melee will always be stronger than attack chains that can be done at ranged. I'd choose based on the secondary if I could go either way with the primary. If you're doing something like KM then the time to go SR maybe now.
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I look at the slotting and things stand out, compare the slotting on group invis and combat jump to your ally shields, its like putting toilet paper in the laundry basket and clothes down the toilet.
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Quote:I could be wrong, but when I looked at aoes hitting multiple targets over time I saw what might be a great loss of aoe damage potential over time or a potentially great loss in rewards over time.The difference isn't huge and probably mostly due to the loss of Assault. If it's important to maintain that level of DPS, he could always drop Grant cover for Assault.
Shield charge could hit 10 targets for X damage every 20s giving 10x/20s or it could do it every 30s giving 10x/30s, the latters smaller. -
It occured to me that ya might farm a bit, enter the second account, get it near ya main, see it die then venge! Increasing your damage and farm away but in placing in taunt I think rechg was buffed so aoe over time damage over time is increased plus flexibility.
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I'm about to come out with something I am a bit vague with because I looked into it in 2005.
Consider a complete build with no end slots in it. As your attack chaining away your toggles are running and the cost of the entire build and this could be the same for any AT is about 5 eps. Your toggles add up to about 1.5 eps, so your attacks are about 3.5 eps.
Now consider your attacks, if you have no damage slots in your attacks then you hit them once and do x damage, you then hit them again and do the same x damage, each costing y endurance, rather than hit them twice we double the damage we deal so that we do 2x damage for y endurance, this saves us y endurance.
Now going back to the second paragraph you can see that the attack chains take up the most eps and the third paragraph is about doing more damage per end through more damage slotting. If you only added more end slotting you increase the dam per end still but still you'll have to use the attack again, so thats two cast times and a longer fight duration.
All in all, economise your attacks before toggles, then see to the toggles.
Use brawl, use aggro from multiple targets to keep up fury then use aoes, aoes which you should now be thinking of putting damage slots in. Cone attacks on more than 2 targets will save endurance, aoe attacks on more than 4 targets will save endurance.
So now when I look at your build I'd be thinking too much end in toggles, not enough damage and end slots spread throughout all attacks. -
The thing with what you've done Finduilas has knocked his DPS down. I don't know how important things are but when I look at someones build I kind of try to guess. He could take the gladiator out of his build or the one I changed for him and still be softcapped.
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I measured the level of tohit debuffs mobs can do to a dark/dark who might not even have soul drain yet or slotted it well.
Fighting +2 CoTx0 lvl 5-54, Tohit bonus down to 5% In a 8 man team my tohit bonus could be so far in the minus figures its time to pack up and go home, -75%ish.
Fighting +2 Tsoox0 lvls 15-40 Tohit bonus down to 26.5% with Hurricane, Chill of the Night and Hurricane dont run together, Hurricane is worse than Chill, good thing is that Tsoo sorcerors stupidly TP about making the -tohit too momentary to care about. So not a problem.
Fighting +2 full team size Banished Pantheon lvl20-29, Storm Shaman, Hurricane again 26.5%, Death Shaman, whilst ranged fluctated down between 56 and 65, the Deaths might need to be melee'd if possible really to prevent constant debuffs. Stacking Storm Shaman with a Death Shaman is gonna be harsh, in a 8 man team am likely to get a Death, Storm and Avalanche giving mixed debuffs and my tohit bonus could be like 6% when I need to heal up.
Fighting Cabal, +2 full team size lvls 25-34 Tohit bonus down to 26.5% with Hurricane, can complete miss with Soul Drain and Dark Regen when its like this, then XD.
These might be alot easier exemping down than leveling up. Team support will alleviate obviously but for the 15-30s I do not know what other faction presents such a degree of a problem for other types of tankers. I have limited make ups. -
Quote:Arcanaville all these things by the time you get to them you can have the tools and/slots to overcome the problem yourself. As an Invuln versus Sappers I initiated the shoot in and KoB while everyone was inviting SRs for that particular problem, it's how I think.SR can have the entire set negated by a single tohit buff at any level. By the thirties, there's a very common tohit buff - the DE quartz eminator - that offers enough tohit buff to negate Elude. And then there's Nemesis vengeance. +30% tohit per application: one takes away most of an SR tankers defense, two takes it all away and then some. Also, the Rularuu have tohit buffs. Also, all turrets including Malta engineer turrets have +25% tohit, as well as all pet class critters. That's half the defense a high level tanker will likely have, and a lot more than half the survivability taken away.
And then there's non-positional psi, which ignores all SR defenses, and SR has no scaling resistance to, no heal to mitigate, and no +health to buffer. You see that in the 20s with the Tsoo. You see it even earlier with the Lost. You keep seeing it in the Rikti and Carnival of Shadows.
And then you reach the 40s and have to tank the KoA. Scrapping the KoA is one thing. Tanking the KoA is another thing. Because another thing that negates the entire SR set is autohitting damage, such as that from caltrops. Which, if you have a ton of them spammed on you while tanking for a full team, actually amounts to sizeable autohitting damage. It can kill you all by itself even if nothing else in the mission touches you (rough estimate: 5 dps per caltrop: twelve of them from a single full spawn non-stacked is 60 dps of autohitting damage. Compared to an SR tanker with just 40% defense, that is like seeing 50 minions suddenly appear and start attacking simultaneously).
So: tohit buffs that can negate SR defense, non-positional attacks that avoid SR defense, and autohitting damage that ignores SR defense. Everyone has problems.
There is tohit debuffs with CoT, with Tsoo as well in the low levels that can effect half of a Dark Armours primary, at a time of finding slots to overcome knockback is bad enough. I think with Banished Pantheon where I can sometimes find myself with 3 shamans tohit debuffing there might be a little special case. With CoT or Tsoo you don't normally get more than one debuffing you, you can say that about BP but in my tanker comparison test on this faction, that's exactly what I look for so all tankers are compared exactly.
The problem may lie with the secondaries because not every secondary offers +tohit by level 25. The problem maybe that this group really belongs in the 30+ category. Where they might present a problem but not matter what you do have the tools. The problem maybe me and the way I compare tankers but I like to put things like Ice/Ice together, Dark/Dark together, find a challenging group to stick to and do that group with theme builds without insps and same slotting philosophy.
The pre buffed Firetank struggled less but one of its saving graces was build up with Fire melee. If you put the concept of Dark/Dark together Soul Drain comes in at 26. Still if the Banished Pantheon were moved to 30+ Soul Drain would be that new thing that also relies on tohit but there would be more slots.
Maybe Foc Acc with its 60% res to tohit debuffs and its +tohit is there to attract Dark Armours mainly, another toggle for the pain, eventually I might have a Black cloud running toggles mainly, dark regening, soul draining, shadow mauling and dark consuming, another thing relying on tohit.
There is quite alot on Dark/Dark that relies on accuracy, perhaps I will sit back, sort it out but I am used to having to hit things to sort it out.
Defense and Tohit debuffs negate much of Dark/Dark. -
Oh come on, I used to get to level 10 set to +2, make the teams, power away, get a bit higher decide that I am the team at 22ish set to me x6 or x8 and power away solo.
I can tell ya now, right at 20+ to 25 that I only found the Banished Pantheon to be the pigs. All else was pretty a okay. Recently, I have been doing them with a Dark Armour and got to say drenched in so much -tohit it suffers, a Regen might heal where it wouldn't but the -rechg is probably gonna help take that down. -
Quite literally if I made changes to Regen it would look alot like like Willpower..
I'll have a pop though later for something more recogniseable to a fan of Regen. -
Ooh level 33, I realize what the figures are but quite rightly that's not good enough to have that by level 33. Plenty of people expect to tank by 22 x amount of y amount factions at +x amount of levels at the latest. Pool powers are meant to be desireable not necessary. It will be last place.
It'll benefit from alphaing mobs, pulling mobs, +def powers particularly on last mob in each spawn before next, there is stuff to help it, it'll be close as Arcanaville mentions, but still in all likelihood last place. -
Yeah ya pretty close to it as is, the first build I did took 4 mins at 5:40 am this morning, the second build is what it should of been with a slot moved and a couple of enhancements corrected so that two aoes are frankensteined alike.
I've been told Nem pets do most damage and would prolly go Musculature with that.