Moderator 08

Dead thread is dead. And locked now.

This topic comes up from time to time, and is never conducive to productive discussion. I contemplating finding an old lock comment and re-posting it, but decided that would be counterproductive (and the humor would probably be a bit lost on everyone).

Instead let me say this, next time this topic comes up please avoid the discussion. Just don't post, it's not like if you avoid this subject somehow Doom will come to Sarnath... I mean Paragon City.

On this subject we use a lot more internal research to inform our decision making because we can see exactly how many people logged on, how many people teamed, how long people stayed on, etc. We have the actual details, so we can make decisions from a far more informed PoV. We are aware of how players from both perspectives feel about this issue, hashing it out repeatedly in the forums doesn't help.

The base forum actually does get attention, but attention and posting are two entirely separate matters. Just because we read doesn't mean we'll post.

To throw a complete sidetrack in the thread, while Ill/Rad and Fire/Rad are both amazingly good, Plant/Rad is also a strong contender that doesn't get as much play. Plant is a strong set with it's own bevy of tricks, and rad complements it nicely with additional control options and of course the phenomenal de-buffs. Plant/Rad's nicest bonus however is it's speed of maturity. Plant/Rad is good to go at something like level 8, and only gets better. Ill/Rad and Fire/Rad both take a while to hit their stride.

Making a bad controller with ill, fire, or plant as the primary, or rad or storm as the secondary is pretty hard though.

My thoughts on the Ill vs. Fire debate.

Well built illusion/radiation is arguably the strongest contender in the game vs. hard targets in that it will almost always win over time. I have yet to run into an AV on my Ill/Rad that has been a significant challenge (as long as I remember to keep clicking, some of them drag on for a while) and generally the only time I die on the character is when I get too aggressive.

Fire/Rad is the meaner, faster, not quite as safe sister to Ill/Rad. But for normal play, Fire/Rad doesn't disappoint in that it does everything well. Also everyone loves having a Fire/Rad on the team, something that Illusion occasionally (rightly or not) gets some knocks for. For those of a more horticultural mindset, Fire/Rad is a much better choice (of the two).

Hope that helps, after reading this discussion I'm all excited to play my fire/rad again. I might have to return to that project after I finish up the characters that I am working on.

Enjoyed reading this, sad that it is ending. I've experienced some market related malaise lately, and discussions like this always serve to further energize me in my participation in this portion of the game. Too bad I did not exert undue influence to get in on this, however the true return is the enjoyment related to observing how this has gone.

So I used to play a lot of Warhammer 40k. It's a miniatures battle game for those that aren't familiar with it. This was a long time ago, and the rules had "interesting" elements. We wanted to play more competitively in certain ways, and so crafted a number of house rules to further our collective competitive play. Now days I look back and see the game differently. It was what it was, and I would now rather play it for what it was than play it for what we wanted to be.

Does that make me 15 years ago wrong? Does that make me right now? Hindsight isn't 20/20, it's looking at something completely different. That was the game I wanted to play then (and had valid reasons for wanting to do so) and the other is the game I want to play now. That's really all there is to it, and all that should be said.

Each style of the game has different challenges and different appeals, people talking about one or the other style would have widely differing viewpoints about the quality of various choices in the game and they would disagree on a number of assessments. There is no right or wrong, there is only what we are looking to get out of it. Arena rules or zone rules or fightclub rules or anything else are personal choices on which game you want to play.

Yelling at each other about anything arising from this difference of opinion is probably a waste of time, as it will most likely just result in more work for me.

I can sympathize with joshz's plight, since one of my favorite characters is my Bot/FF MM. I took a different route though, I don't buff any of my pets aside from the t3. I also tend not to buff all my teammates since it is an unusual team where everyone constantly needs all the protection I can provide. Were I to try and buff everything and everyone, I think I'd just log off too.

That being said, this discussion isn't going anywhere nice, so I'll head it off at the pass.

Ares,

I want to thank you for putting the time and effort into writing this guide. As part of my job I am trying to gain a greater understanding of PvP, and as such I'm trying to gain some knowledge before I enter. While I've mostly done my research already, I love that you are trying to empower people to gain greater perspective on this aspect of the game. Who knows, PvP'ers on some (un)lucky server may soon get to pwn a mod even if they don't know it.

On a more general note, PvP is a controversial subject. The PvP forums are not a ghetto to force PvP'ers into but an area where that is the sole topic of discussion. That does not mean that it is the only area where PvP can be discussed.

People on both sides of this debate, both pro and anti pvp, have acted improperly in this thread. Most of that is gone now. But if anyone feels that something is in the wrong forum, the best course of action is to notify a moderator. If that doesn't work, it probably means that the decision didn't go your way however if you have questions feel free to PM me.

Going into a thread and writing the equivalent of "get back in your box" is probably a bad idea. At best explain why you think it belongs in a specific spot and ask the author respectfully why they placed it where they did. I can see several arguments about why this could belong in about 6 different forums, but I can understand why the OP wanted to place it here. This topic is acceptable in this forum.

Also, when people have negative reactions, please use the ignore command. There are those who love to push buttons, don't give them the satisfaction. That goes for both PvP and the forums.

This link has now been forwarded around the Paragon Office. I love my job.

There is no real end to the argument in this thread, so since it has been allowed to go along for a while and everyone has gotten a chance to get their say in, I'll go ahead and lock it.

A side discussion has been removed from this thread. Please don't restart it, it hurts my soul.

Further discussions along this line are unproductive, so I'll be locking this. Also please try to refrain from commenting on other user's feedback in official feedback threads, as this does little to help collect the specific information we need.

Compare and contrast threads are specifically not allowed. Please do not post threads like these.

English's lack of a true gender neutral pronoun is a deficiency in the language. Unfortunately it's unlikely to be rectified in any authoritative way since there is no authoritative body that is universally recognized. So if you folks (on both sides of the argument) want to set up a standards committee for the English language and try and get it accepted by the majority of the world's English speaking populace, more power to you.

The common usage (although one disliked by certain posters) is to use the masculine pronoun in cases of non specific singular when non specific plural pronouns would scan improperly. This is objected to by those who subscribe to linguistic determinism amongst other theoretical takes on the subject.

A couple of commonly suggested alternatives is the inclusion of a gender non-specific pronoun or the removal of gender specific pronouns altogether (not as terrible an idea as it initially sounds to some, although the phrase "neutering our language" springs rather humorously to mind).

That's pretty much the end of constructive discussion on this subject. Because no one has the power to actually make these changes people just have viewpoints and throw them at each other, much like monkeys and certain other substances. So any further discussion along this topic is pretty much non constructive, and would be a violation of Rule #5 of the Message Forum Rules and Guidelines.

If you want to talk to someone about it, PM me directly. It's about the only way not to violate the rules on the subject and I can reply as I get time, not as it occurs.

Now if we want to start in on real deficiencies in the English Language, lets start talking about our numerical vocabulary and how it impedes the learning of math in young children. That drives me nuts (I'm trying to teach a 1st grader the concept of a 1's value and a 10's value at the present).

In a perfect world, everyone would be polite. That being said this is a place in which discourse is not limited only to the polite (there is no rule against rudeness in the Message Forum Rules and Guidelines), unfortunately some will choose to stretch the boundaries of acceptable discourse.

Not much else can be said on this subject.

I feel for you in having difficulty with Customer Support. I've had several experiences lately with CS while playing the game, and while every encounter I've had was resolved satisfactorily (in most cases very quickly) it was still frustrating. A portion of my frustration may be because my play time is so limited that spending time waiting for Customer Support is like nails on a chalkboard, but that is a personal issue.

There are a few things I try to remember however, every time that I am dealing with customer support that makes the whole experience much more easy to deal with.

1) CS is incredibly busy, especially if you play during peak hours. I can take a break and check my market bids every so often throughout the day as long as I'm not super busy, they can't.

2) The standard list of questions is there because it works. While it may not be necessary for many interactions, it's been tried and true to significantly address a large portion of issues that arise. I have to answer the same questions when I interact with CS as you folks do, and most of the time (although not all) I know exactly whats going on.

3) Communication in written format is difficult, especially when there is a heavy use of jargon and slang. The language used is changing and heavily relies on somewhat obscure acronyms. Make sure to explain things as clearly and concisely as possible, and always try to explain things as if you were doing so to someone who has never played the game before. While our GM's are familiar with our game, MoSTF is not necessarily how we refer to it internally.

4) Lower tiers of support do not have the same latitude in addressing issues that higher tiers of support have. That means that getting issues addressed that are more complicated or difficult to resolve takes longer. Always ask yourself if the fix of the situation is worth your time.

5) When you have to contact support, and then wait for a while, you are probably not happy. The GM you have contacted may be finishing an 8 hour shift after dealing with dozens of people who have been a little peeved. And by a little peeved, I'm slightly understating things, similar to calling the invasion of Normandy a minor fracas.

6) If you do have a negative interaction, it is important for our feedback process for us to understand why (and correct the issue if appropriate and possible). Escalating the matter to a higher level of support or contacting support through email for a more full examination of the interaction is appropriate. Identifying trouble areas is key to any improvement in process.

Hope this advice helps a bit,
-Mod08-

I think /dark would be a very strong set for controllers (I'm on record thinking dark is one of the best buff/debuff sets), the one that worries me however is giving ill/ to dominators. Perma PA doms *shudders but kinda in a good way* That being said, I won't say no to whatever the team decides. I like making new characters.

Please confine birthday wishes within a month of the birthday occurring.

Thanks,

Petitions aren't allowed, so I'll go ahead and lock this thread.

Please don't post about RMT, all RMT related posts get removed.

Thanks,

The new difficulty settings do not correspond exactly to the old difficulty settings. The old difficulty settings worked in a very different manner, and exact replication of the old settings is not possible. This is sad, but unfortunately part of what needed to be done to give players more options in difficulty.

-Mod08-

One question to consider is do you want to create a stacked team where everyone is the same or similar AT/powersets or do you want to create a diverse team where everyone is different? How diverse your team wants to be will change the answers you get.

Buffing and debuffing sets will be popular in these types of recommendations, so for Hero side expect lots of controller/defender suggestions and for Villain side corrupter/mastermind. Stacking sets which have obvious internal synergies (like rad, and also dark) will produce good results, an alternate choice could be diversifying sets to spread your capabilities.

Given your criteria, here is my suggestion for Hero Side for a team that has diverse power sets while staying disgustingly effective:

Fire/Kin Controller
Ill/Rad Controller
Dark/Sonic Defender

And for a final choice either a Fire/Mental Manipulation Blaster (lets increase the speed of the team by throwing out some serious damage potential) or a Cold/Ice Defender to increase survivability (excessive, but fun).