Local_Man
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OK, I looked. Very Expensive build with five purple sets and six Ribos. I would have made a few different choices, but mostly it would be a matter of preference rather than any kind of error. I have a Grav/Storm and several Kinetics characters, but I don't have a Grav/Kin. I consider Grav to be a ranged set, so I probably wouldn't pair it with Kinetics, but both sets are so good that the character, even without some types of synergy, is still a good character.
You have tons of Recharge -- enough to have virtually perma-Hasten even before Siphon Speed. Wormhole comes up again much faster than the stun runs out.
In GDF, that Debilitative Action proc is a waste -- it is arguably the dumbest proc in the game. 2% chance to stun??? If you are blowing your infl, the last IO in the Grav Anchor set is a much better choice just to reduce the endurance cost. Or add a Trap of the Hunter damage proc or use that slot somewhere else.
Speaking of procs, I'm not impressed with the Force Feedback in Wormhole or Psi Tornado. You already have so much recharge that those are not needed and won't provide much benefit.
If you are taking Hasten anyway, I would prefer Super Speed over IR. Free Stealth and one less slot needed (I put an EndRdx in the default slot). Or use that second slot for a Celerity Stealth IO for full invis, which is handy for a Kinetics character who wants to get up close.
Why take Swift at 6? Why not Propel there? I suppose it really makes no difference, but Swift at 6 is a waste. And I would go with Hurdle over Swift for either IR or Super Speed. (I only take Swift with Fliers and some Teleporters.) And why not Wormhole at 26?
I prefer the full Efficacy Adaptor set in Transferance. Good bonuses.
Put that Performance Shifter proc from Speed Boost in Stamina, so it will have a chance to hit all the time.
I would rather have some damage in GD. GD-Crush-Propel is my attack chain, and the more damage in there, the better. I would also try to slot up Singy more. Cap his damage, and then add some Hold if you can.
Personally, I'm not a big fan of the Fighting Pool on Controllers, but I can see how Tough adds a good amount of Smashing/Lethal Resistance with Mind Over Body. -
Posting the Data Chunk alone generally means that I'm gonna skip looking at it. You would have better luck by posting the build, too.
Most folks are lazy. Add the fact that Gravity is not a popular control primary, and you are not gonna have many folks look or comment when you just post the Data Chunk. -
Quote:In addition to what Mental Maden said (we tend to agree on most things), A good controller's effective use of his/her controls does a lot more to prevent deaths. For example, I have Mutation and Fallout on my Earth/Rad . . . and I rarely use them. The AoE control of Earth with the debuffing of Rad means that my team tends to wipe out the foes quite quickly with little damage. I don't even use the AoE heal much unless it is one of those PuGs where the silly scrappers and Blasters like to run ahead of their protection and get their foolish selves killed. If the team stays together, they kill stuff fast and safely.Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
Well I'd rather not take the shield, as I have enough endurance issues as it is, without having that sucking it away. I didnt want fireball because I dont plan to use my attacks much. Fireball would draw too much aggro for my taste. And I wont take hasten/speed idea because I can NOT stand super speed. I'll considor dropping a power for hasten, but I've played this game for years, and I've never chosen hasten without respeccing out. I really dont like it much at all, I think its overrated, but I will considor it, having little experience with trollers. And what you people all seem to be missing is that in my experience, to use a wakie during combat effectively, you need a break and a blue, probobly a respite or two if there's no healer. The rez and self rez are much more covienient, and if I'm in a zone with no hospital, the load times going to the hospital, then zoning at least once, and loading the mish again are crippling (Im a disturbingly slow loader). We all have our own styles of play, and mine includes taking a rez, self or otherwise, whenever possible. Done it for years, no regrets. You get it? I'm not dropping either rez
And for the record, I'm passing stone mastery because it has the melee. If I chose it, I would end up at dangerous range (I dont like melee fighting with squisheys, I just end up doing it out of habit). If I have fire mastery's ranged offense, I'll be less tempted to get in close. And as I mentioned, both APP sets sound great, but fire suits her better
On Super Speed -- It took me a while to get used to it. Like many things, SS gets better with practice. But Local Man is a Dark Miasma/Elec Defender, and I knew that Shadowfall+Super Speed = full invisibility long before IOs were available. Super Speed is like two powers in one -- I didn't want to have to use the Stealth pool, so I got used to Super Speed.
Now I hate to be without it -- SS lets me zip around the battlefield, going wherever I need to be to place my controls or to lead my pet into the fight without being seen. I can zip through caves and hallways much faster than my teammates who are limited by Fly, SJ or Teleport, and I have learned to how to speed through the maps pretty well. And Stealthing missions is easy on a Speedster. You know those "Find X" missions on large maps? Fly and Super Speed are the best for those. I have a lot of */Storm controllers, and all but one use SS with Steamy Mist for full invis. (The last one uses Fly, but has a Stealth IO+Steamy for invis.)
If I have a tight build where I need Hasten, I'm happy to take Super Speed. On my Illusion/Trick Arrow, I needed an extra power slot to fit in all the powers I wanted, but Hasten is essential to help Phantom Army recharge faster. Even though he didn't need the Stealth since he had Superior Invis, I took Super Speed for travel. -
Quote:Local?Originally Posted by LISAR
Soon we'll me emailing text as well.
Then what? No need for local that's what.
This is madness!
No need for Local? Huh? -
Quote:I agree with this advice. If you want to fit in Hasten without giving up anything, consider using Hasten/Super Speed for travel. The benefits of Combat Jumping are fairly minor compared to Hasten. Add in a Stealth IO to Super Speed or a sprint power (you can use the jump ones in a sprint power), and you get full invisibility without having to use a power pick. With all the options for vertical travel now (Ninja Run, Raptor Pack, Zero-G Pack, GvE Jump Jet), Super Speed has far fewer problems than it used to have. Make sure you take Hurdle over Swift -- it really helps.Originally Posted by MentalMaden
Consume will not be the power you hope it will, rise of the phoenix is way too situational and something that 3 insp can do without a power pick. If it were me I'd take blast, ball and shield. Also you may want to think of dropping another power for hasten, I try in most of my troller builds to have hasten. Given you don't use IOs you have no other non enhancment method of increasing recharge it's a thought. If you're set in stone (no pun intended) on taking the rez then I'd drop the single target fireblast since you'll have plenty of aoe containment for fireball.
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My Perma-PA build!
Well, I recently tried an experiment, and finally finished. I took the second build on one of my Illusion/Radiation controllers and decided to follow my own advice to make a fairly inexpensive perma-PA build. I am not an "ebil marketeer," so I don't have tons of influence. However, I had a very lucky break about a month ago and got a drop of a one of the PvP recipes during the only time I have been in the Arena in a couple of years. The 550 million I got from that and another 55 mil already on the character gave me the opportunity.
So, I started out with about 605 million. I have finished with 405 Million. But I'm not suggesting that you can build a Perma-PA like this one for 200 Mil -- I used a LOT of Merits, had some IOs saved up and some friends gave me some IOs I needed to fill out sets. (Thanks, Mr. E and Ribic!!) The Enzyme Hami-O's are expensive and kind of rare, but I got one as a drop in an Statesman TF and traded for the other -- I think they cost 65 Mil or more. Still, it ended up being a lot less expensive than I expected. I placed moderate bids and waited a week to see of the bids would be filled. I used Merits to get the three Luck of the Gambler ("LotG") Recharge IOs needed. I used Merits on the Miracle proc and the Numina's Heal recipe. 65 Mil of the Influence went for a Numina's Regen/Recovery proc that I could have gotten with merits. To build the many recipes, I used Salvage I had on hand or cheap stuff I could get at the market, but for the expensive Rares, I generally used AE Tickets. So, if you want to eventually build a Perma-PA build, but aren't someone who likes to farm or marketeer, then do a LOT of story arcs and task forces.
So, here's the build I currently have. I would like to get one more Enzyme, or maybe an Achilles Heal Chance for Resistance Debuff -- haven't decided yet -- in RI. Other than that, it is done.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.621
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Perma PA build with Fire APP: Level 50 Mutation Controller
Primary Power Set: Illusion Control
Secondary Power Set: Radiation Emission
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Fire Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Blind -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(3), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(11), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(17), HO:Nucle(27), Dmg-I(31)
Level 1: Radiant Aura -- Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(A), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(9), Dct'dW-Heal(34), Dct'dW-Rchg(34), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 2: Spectral Wounds -- Decim-Acc/Dmg(A), Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(5), Decim-Build%(5), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31)
Level 4: Deceive -- CoPers-Conf/Rchg(A), CoPers-Acc/Conf/Rchg(7), CoPers-Acc/Rchg(7), CoPers-Conf/EndRdx(31), CoPers-Conf%(37)
Level 6: Accelerate Metabolism -- Efficacy-EndMod(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg(11), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(15), Efficacy-Acc/Rchg(34), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc(40), Efficacy-EndMod/EndRdx(46)
Level 8: Superior Invisibility -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(9), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(17), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37), RedFtn-Def(40), RedFtn-EndRdx(46)
Level 10: Radiation Infection -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(13), ToHitDeb-I(15)
Level 12: Hover -- Krma-ResKB(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(13)
Level 14: Fly -- Flight-I(A)
Level 16: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 18: Phantom Army -- S'bndAl-Build%(A), ExRmnt-Acc/Rchg(19), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(19), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(21), S'bndAl-Dmg/Rchg(23)
Level 20: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Rcvry+(29), Numna-Heal(43)
Level 22: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(23), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(25), P'Shift-End%(27)
Level 24: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(25), RechRdx-I(50)
Level 26: Spectral Terror -- U'spkT-Acc/Rchg(A), U'spkT-EndRdx/Fear(48), U'spkT-Fear/Rng(48), U'spkT-Acc/Fear/Rchg(48), U'spkT-Stun%(50)
Level 28: Enervating Field -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(29)
Level 30: Lingering Radiation -- Acc-I(A)
Level 32: Phantasm -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(A), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(33), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(33), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg(37)
Level 35: Flash -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(36), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(36), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(36), G'Wdw-Acc/Hold/Rchg(40)
Level 38: EM Pulse -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(39), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(39), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(39)
Level 41: Fire Blast -- Decim-Acc/Dmg(A), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(42), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(42), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(43), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43)
Level 44: Fire Ball -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(45), Posi-Dmg/Rng(45), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(45), Posi-Dam%(46)
Level 47: Fire Shield -- ResDam-I(A)
Level 49: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Containment
Level 0: Ninja Run
The important facts and notes on the build:
- Total Recharge while Hasten (on auto) and AM are running is 206.25%, well over the target of 203.5%. Phantom Army recharges in 59.8 Seconds. This gives me a small amount of cushion on the recharge.
- The only purples are 5 from the Confuse set and two from the Pets. Those are some of the least expensive purples available. If not for the purple Confuse set, I would have slotted the Malaise set. However, the Coercive Persuasion set makes a big difference as it not only adds 10% Recharge and other nice bonuses, but it frees up another slot under the "Rule of 5" for a 6.25% set. There are a lot of sets that give 6.25% Recharge, and I used 5 of them. The purple set in Confuse is an expense I considered to be necessary.
- I chose Hover/Fly for travel. I could just as easily chosen CJ/SJ, but I like having Hover/Fly on a controller who can stay at range. I also could have gone with Hasten/Super Speed. (Oddly enough, my original build for Area Man has him as a teleporter. Sadly, I had to give up Recall Friend for this build. While I might have been able to fit it in at 47, I had already used up my 4 power pools. If I really wanted Recall Friend, I could have replaced CJ with GI.) The key, of course, is to have enough powers that can take a LotG Recharge. I used SI, Hover and CJ, all of which have some value. I avoided having to take a useless power to use as a LotG mule. Granted, I probably would not have taken CJ but for the need to place a LotG, but this power has some value in providing Immob protection, a small amount of defense and some good jumping mobility for almost no Endurance.
- Because one-slotted Fly is a bit on the slow side, I wanted to make good use of Ninja Run. So, I set up an easy bind to let me turn on Ninja Run, then switch back to Combat Jumping when Ninja Run is not needed. I have the "I" key linked to a button on my mouse, so I used:
/bind i powexecname Combat Jumping$$powexecname Ninja Run
I just hit the "I" button on the mouse to switch between them.
- I put three Recharge IOs in Hasten, but didn't really need to. Hasten has a duration of 120 seconds. With two, it recharges in 118 seconds, and three recharge enhancements cuts that to 111 seconds. Since I put Hasten on Auto, I could have easily gotten by with 118 Seconds. However, AM also recharges in 111 seconds, so with three Recharge in Hasten, then Hasten and AM have the same Recharge. I might sometime move that slot to Fly for a second Flightspeed. Or maybe RI for a proc, or to Fire Shield for more Resistance . . .
- I got 5% Recharge out of the Red Fortune set in SI and the Unspeakable Terror set in Spectral Terror. I could have saved some slots and a lot of Influence (if I had bought them) by replacing the Enzymes in Radiation Infection with 4 Dark Watchers and giving up enhancement of Defense Debuff. Each Enzyme costs about 65 mil. (I didn't spend that, as I had one drop during a Statesman Task Force, and traded for the second one.)
- I chose to put the Chance for Build Up proc from Decimation in Spectral Wounds, because my usual attack chain has me using that power twice; Blind-SW-Fire Blast-SW. I figured that would give it a lot of chances to proc. I put the extra slot for Acc/Dam in Fire Blast, because Fire Blast does more damage and I would get more benefit from that enhancement there.
- I chose to put the Chance for Build Up proc from Soulbound Allegiance in Phantom Army. With Perma-PA, I'll have three pets firing off attacks, giving it more chance to proc.
- I chose the Fire APP for the reasons discussed in the guide. It does more damage, has a fast single-target blast and has a different, rarely resisted damage type than the Psi damage in Phantom Army, SW and Blind. Fireball is nice AoE damage.
- The one power choice I was uncertain about was Fire Shield. Over 30% Resistance is a good thing, but I also carefully considered Rise of the Phoenix and Mutation. Group Invis was also an option if I wanted to use it for a LotG Recharge, save endurance and/or have a spot available for a different power pool choice like Recall Friend. I picked Fire Shield in part to be able to solo better. Another option for a more team-oriented build, I might have gone with the Ice APP for Ice Blast, Frost Breath and Ice Shield, then put a LotG Recharge in Ice Shield so that I could take Recall Friend in place of Combat Jumping. That would have given me a Smashing/Lethal Defense shield.
On my mouse, I have it set up to have easy access to cast AM, PA, Radiant Aura and EF. If you don't have a funky mouse, you could set up PA to cast using a variation of the Teleport Bind:
/Bind lshift+lbutton powexecname Phantom Army
This will allow you to hold the Shift Key and then click to where you want PA to show up. -
Quote:That's why I said, "Pretty much," since there are always exceptions. Most of the time, the debuffs will have minimal net effect. If you really wanted to be picky, you could go into the small differences between Resistance Debuff and Damage Debuff in EF, but the difference will have such a small effect, it isn't worth mentioning. The bottom line is that Seeds is an AoE control that most importantly will control minions and lieutenants in good sized groups. The fact that they do some damage to each other which, as long as you also do some damage, will speed up your XP over time is not all that significant as long as you get the control.Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
I have a minor addendum. The Radiation toggles are neutral if the enemy lacks defense debuff resistance, but will slow enemy kill speed if the enemy resists -defense. It would speed up enemy kill speed if they resist -tohit, but I'm not sure that kind of resistance exists.
Also, since -defense and -tohit are capped, I think you'd see a shift if you passed the caps on one debuff but not the other. That's unlikely with Plant/Rad but I can see an Earth/Rad hitting the floor on defense, which might result in slower kill speed when you applied more -ToHit. Not that it matters because this is a discussion about confusing mobs, which Earth can't do, but it might be a factor in teams.
One way or another though, I'm in the camp whose happy with Seeds just keeping things from attacking me and never really cared about how it affects enemies hitting each other.
EDIT: I should add that I'm assuming all of the enemies in a group are the same type. This is actually pretty rare in practice. It would be likely that enemies with -defense resistance would appear in a group with other enemies who don't resist it. Also, if there is an AV in the mix, the toggles will have very little effect on the AV but a large one on the enemies around it. Since we can assume the AV won't be getting confused, what this means is the toggles effectively make any enemies in the AVs group less likely to hurt the AV if they take a swing at it (since their -ToHit is lowered significantly but the AVs Defense is not). If we could somehow manage to confuse the AV, the AV would do massive damage to his or her own allies.
Since Plant control only has the one-shot AoE confuse, there is no chance to stack confuse on AVs without a bunch of Plant Controllers. However, just a few Illusion and/or Mind controllers can stack the single target Confuse on an AV to cause him to wipe out his minions -- I've done it a few times. -
Quote:Pretty much, the Rad debuffs are neutral on confused foes for a Plant/Rad. When the resistance and damage are both debuffed, there isn't overall much effect. However, the Resistance Debuff lets your Roots do a lot more damage.Originally Posted by Amy_Amp
RI from /rad actually hurts the effectiveness of Seeds since the mobs are hitting less. EF doesn't really do anything for Seeds, the -res and -damage counter each other. Fulcrum and Siphon Power from /kin also are counter productive towards Seeds with their -dmg. /ta and /storm would be the top two picks for me. They both will get the best -res outside of /sonic on teams and add damage.
For a dom, Plant/fire would be good.
One of the best parts of a Plant/Rad is the ability to use Roots+RI as a fill-in control power while Seeds is recharging. Roots keeps the foes from going anywhere, while RI keeps them from hitting you much -- almost like a pseudo-hold. In low levels, that combo really helps, and it keeps being useful in high levels, too.
So far, I've taken Plant/Rad to 50, and I have a Plant/Kin in the low 30's, and a Plant/Storm in the 20's. All of them are fun. I can see Plant/TA also being pretty good. -
Stalagmites is a mag 3 stun, able to catch Minions and Lieutenants. Thunderclap is only Mag 2, so it can only catch Minions on its own. However, fire off Stalagmites, then run in and use Thunderclap -- and you have stacked the two for a Mag 5 stun, able to get bosses.
I have it on my Earth/Storm and my Grav/Storm, which are both builds that can take advantage of stacking stuns. It is mostly not worth taking on controllers who don't have another Stun to stack. -
Someone mentioned Ninja Run . . . you have to purchase the Martial Arts Pack for $10 bucks real money, but I find it easily worth it. This is a new travel power that becomes available at level 4, and with Hurdle is actually faster than base fly. Think of Ninja Run as Sprint+Combat Jumping on steroids. A lot of folks are skipping an actual travel power and just using Ninja Run + Hurdle, plus the Raptor Pack to get over anything you can't jump over. The animation includes a nice-looking flip in mid-air as you jump, and you get a lot of control over your jumps.
By the way, the level restrictions have been removed for the Hazzard zones. Now your level 1 character can go to the Rikti War Zone and the Shadow Shard. In the Shard, you can buy a Raptor Pack for 10,000 Infl if you don't want to earn it or the original one runs out. -
This forum is for Guides, not questions. I suggest you post this question in the forums for the specific ATs. That's where you are most likely to get good feedback.
As for Ill/Rad, take a look at my guide, linked in my sig. -
Quote:I suggest you take a look at my Earth/Rad guide for a lot of advice on the Earth Control (not Stone) powerset. It includes a fair amount of strategy suggestions, too.Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
So, I made a new Troller on Pinnacle name Molten Moira. She is Stone Control/Thermal Radiation, and a real lowbie (only 10 at the time Im writing this). I've played Scrappers, Blasters, and Defenders for years, but Im relatively new to playing controllers, and was wondering if anyone had any specific advice for a troller with this power set (any advice on powers, general gameplay, etc). So far my plan is to get all Stone powers besides Quicksand and Stone Prison (I chose Salt Crystals. I know AoE sleep isnt great, but I wanted it for some crowd control at a low lvl, and I'm respeccing out when I have stalagmites and earthquake), and get all thermal powers except melt armor, as stone control does decent defence Debuff unless I'm mistaken, and heat exhaustion. I'm unfamiliar with controller epic pools, so if someone could list all the stone and fire mastery powers for trollers, I'd apprectiate that as well. If you see any flaws in that plan, or have any advice whatsoever, please reply. Thanks!
Personally, I feel that Quicksand in one of the lesser understood great powers in the Earth Control powerset. It is a location-targetted AoE slow with a HUGE defense debuff of 25%. It has many strategic uses -- lay it on the ground at a corner, then have a teammate pull; as the foes come running, they bunch up at the edge of Quicksand, are grouped nicely as sitting ducks with that large defense debuff, ready to be slaughtered by AoE damage from your teammates. And if the foes are strung out a bit, it stays there still working as each new foe shows up.
I use Quicksand constantly -- for each of the three AoE controls in the Earth set (Stalagmites+Stone Cages, Earthquake, Volcanic Gasses), I throw Quicksand underneath each one, both to debuff defense and catch any foes who might escape the AoE. I would say that Quicksand has far, far more great uses than Salt Crystals.
Salt Crystals looks great, but it is PB AoE when every other control in Earth Control is ranged. It is a one-shot, so any foes not in range or missed will not be affected. Compare this to Quicksand, Earthquake and Volcanic Gasses, which keep working for a while. Salt Crystals is a sleep, where all your teammates will waste your efforts by waking up the foes. Compare that to Quicksand, where the foes will still be caught in the Slow and Debuff after they have been attacked.
Stone Prison is skippable unless you plan to solo your Earth Controller, which is generally not a great idea. I would suggest planning to skip Stone Prison and Salt Crystals from Earth, and the rez from Thermal.
As for the APP sets, Earth is really melee oriented -- if you plan to play from range, Earth may not be the best choice. Fissure is very short ranged, and Seismic Smash is a great melee attack. Fire is good ranged damage, and has the only self-rez available to Controllers. Ice, Psi and Primal all have their good points, too. -
Quote:Merits replaced the random roll. In fact, Merits are far, far better. You have to spend 20 Merits to get the same single Pool C random roll you got at the end of a TF before, and many of the TFs give far more than 20 Merits. Plus, you have the option of using Merits to purchase the specific recipe you want or need, so there is more choice, more value.Originally Posted by Tokyo
Why do we no longer have the option of a recipe at the end of tfs and sfs? Will we be getting this option back in the future as well as the option of merits?
Another advantage of the Merit system -- longer TFs give more merits. It used to be that a "quick Katie" TF gave the same Pool C single random roll as a Positron or a Dr. Quarterfield. Now Posi gives 66 merits and Dr. Q gives, what, 120 merits? (It was 110 last time I did it, but that number has gone up.)
I did a Positron TF the other night, and got 66 Merits. That gave me three Pool C random rolls with six merits left over - while the old system would have only given me one Pool C random roll. Why would you want to go back? (Of course, all three were crappy recipes, but oh, well.) -
Quote:Sorry, you were victim of a "thread-jack." We were responding to other issues than your original question.Originally Posted by LSK
I never said anything about soloing it, i just wanted to know if i should work on range damage or s/l damage or res in those.
A lot depends on your playstyle and build. Are you going to be mostly melee using Arctic Air? Mostly ranged using Shiver? With the APP armor sets, it will be easier to get Smashing/Lethal Defense than Ranged defense since the Earth and Ice Armors have decent Smashing/Lethal defense. Also, if you build your character for more melee play with Arctic Air, you might need both Ranged and Melee if you were building for positional defense, so building for Smashing/Lethal may be more effective since the APP armors give typed defense rather than positional.
Personally, I prefer Ice Controllers to play melee and take advantage of Arctic Air, so I would build for Smash/Lethal using the Earth APP set. Not only do you get good defense, but your attacks, Seismic Smash and Fissure, are good melee and short ranged attacks. The armor is ugly, however. Ice fits more visually and thematicly. -
For Mind Controllers, your best weapon is Levitate, which is smashing damage. Robots are generally weak to smashing damage.
Illusion Controllers also do only Psi damage until Phantasm, who does smashing/Energy damage. The high resistance to Psi damage is one reason I recommend Ice, Fire or Primal for the APP set for Illusion controllers. A different damage type is needed for these guys. -
I'm sure this has been discussed in various threads at the time that Ninja Run came out, but I believe Ninja Run + Hurdle is faster than Fly, plus the extra vertical allows you to go over obstacles.
I almost always take Hurdle. The main exceptions are some of my fliers and my Stone Tanks, who need Swift. -
Quote:I have learned to use Propel on teams . . . by using it only on Bosses that I can hit early in the fight. Crush to try to set Containment and then Propel right away with the hope that the foe will last long enough to get the damage. If it is able to get containment, Propel hits HARD, especially with a resistance debuff to help it out.Originally Posted by Energizing_Ion
Oh I have Propel on my Grav/Thermal Controller. I do use it while solo...but on a team, I really don't even bother with it because, like you say, before the animation finishes the mob is dead 90% of the time. Really on a good team (especially on a really good team), the only thing I do is buff with shields, heal if needed and maybe toss out Melt Armor...and maybe my AoE hold; beyond that, nothing much :/ Which is both good and bad.
As far as Lift goes, I did have it but then decided against it seeing that the ST immob power does more damage (granted over time but still)...so I took more damage than a knockup power which I don't really need.
Now if Dimension Shift was replaced with an AoE Lift power...I'd get that
One legitimate concern is that Propel takes so long to animate that it keeps you from doing other things. But still, it is so much fun to smack foes with stuff that I wouldn't skip it. -
Quote:I agree with you for the most part. The two sets do substantially different things. Ice, especially paired with Rad, is a strong control set well made to team with melee characters. It will have to rely on teammates for most of its damage, but it provides a huge amount of mitigation to the front lines.Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
I see your point. I think that if we take the direction that damage > control, though, we end up concluding that Fire Control is overall better than Ice Control as a powerset, which I'm not sure I agree with. I don't think most Ice Control players are in for it for the damage. What's great about Choking Cloud is it boosts Fire and Ice each in their best strengths, respectively, turning Fire into a cloud of death and Ice into a cloud of lockdown.
Fire/Rad, on the other hand, is a little more flexible. It can both support the front line, and actually BE the front line. It doesn't provide as much control to protect those front line characters, but it helps take down the foes faster. It can solo at a decent speed, which Ice can't do. -
Quote:As Oedipus_Tex said, try it.Originally Posted by Fire_Minded
So, at a setting set for 8 on mobs, and a -1 or a +0 WITHOUT BOSSES, it wouldnt work?Hmmmm, im not so sure about that one.
MAYBE IF I WRITE IN BOLD PRINT PEOPLE WILL READ IT?
Maybe not.Either way, 1 AoE, is more then enough at that solo setting, because of Containment, and as for being shot?As it stands right now, I dont see how much is going to attack you with there recharge floored, and if it does, you could be smart and say, I dunno, GET THE MEDICINE POOL?!DUH!
Plenty of time to heal when they rarely attack in the first place.
By the way, read Sleet.It states at level 50, it does 25 base damage, which isnt much, but certainly not not 0.Hows that for nit-picking?
I took my Ice/Storm up to 50 with a build that was specifically made to try to maximize damage for when I was solo, using Chilblain slotted for damage and Air Superiority . . . and it was still too slow. And */Storm gets Freezing Rain (same as Sleet) at level 16 and has decent damage powers in the upper levels with Tornado and Lightning Storm. The AoE damage is so pitiful that you will take a lot of damage before you can kill off the group. Before the mid and late 30's, solo was very, very slow and painful (since I didn't have a self-heal). Cold has even less mitigation than Storm, so I would not want to try to solo that character. -
Quote:I like Glue Arrow on my Illusion/TA, also, because Illusion has no other slow powers and a severe lack of Aoe in low levels. Also, he has Superior Invis so Flash Arrow has minimal benefit.Originally Posted by UnicyclePeon
I think Flash Arrow is underwhelming, at best, unless stacked with Smoke (from Fire Control) in which case its pretty decent if you slot both for hit debuff. But, whatever floats your boat. I personally love Glue Arrow.
Lewis
However, Gravity has an AoE Immob that recharges quickly and puts a slow on any foes missed by the immob, and no Invisibility or Stealth (like Steamy Mist) power. I can see where Flash Arrow would be needed more than Glue Arrow depending upon playstyle. While the ToHit Debuff is small, I think that the stealth would be the real benefit. Grav controllers take a while to kill off foes, and are stuck in long animations or have to rely upon slow DoT powers for damage. Not being seen while you slowly damage a nearby foe could be a big help. However, Carnifex makes some good points, too. I wasn't advocating Flash Arrow so much as presenting it as an alternative to consider. Some folks seem to love it. I like it OK on my TA/Arrow Defender, but I'm not nuts about it either. Frankly, Flash Arrow needs more -ToHit, and Glue Arrow needs more -Recharge.
Oh, and good call on the Fire APP -- I forgot about the need to light Oil Slick. I actually have Fire Blast and Fireball on my Illusion/TA. The blast and Torrent from Primal will light the Slick, too, but there is something particularly satisfying about Fireball toasting a group of foes, followed by a continuing Bar-B-Que from the Oil Slick. -
Quote:Ice is, arguably, the lowest damage controller primary, just slightly less than Earth Control. It takes a lot of effort to make an Ice controller able to solo, and then it isn't very fast. The AoE damage from Frostbite is not enough to be worth mentioning. Chilblain slotted for damage and Air Superiority gives some single target damage, combined with Containment from Block of Ice can allow you to take down single targets over time, but it takes a while. The Cold secondary provides some decent -Resistance from Sleet, but no additional damage.Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
I am going to dissent. I don't think most people should plan on taking a pre-pet Ice Controller into a x8 mission and expect to survive or kill things at an acceptable rate. I'm sure someone has pulled it off, but I can't imagine it was very fun.
Ice Control has one native AoE damage power (not two), and it cancels one of your best tools for staying alive. Arctic Air adds some indirect damage, but in a x8 mission staying far enough back to avoid hits is difficult, not to mention a single mezz will detoggle you. The -Recharge in the powers will help some, but you will still be getting shot.
I would certainly say that an Ice/Cold controller is great team character, but will be a very, very slow solo'er. The APP sets can help a bunch, but that is very late in the career of the character. Ice and Fire can provide pretty good damage. -
OK, I'll add my own little pet peeve . . .
Too many people say that two things have the "same difference." They mean "same thing" or "no difference." You can only have the "same difference" if you are comparing two groups of items or two subtraction problems.
For example, a red car and a green car might have the same difference as a red truck and a green truck. Two items, however, cannot have the "same difference." -
OK, here are my comments:
Choking Cloud -- I'm not a fan of this power on an Ill/Rad. Ill/Rad just doesn't have the tools to make it effective. I love it on a Fire/Rad and it's great on an Ice/Rad, but I actually tried it on an Ill/Rad and hated it. To use it effectively, you need to fully slot it for max Hold Duration, and it uses so much endurance that it needs max EndRdx -- so it needs 5-6 slots frankenslotted. You need those slots in other places. I suggest you drop it and take an easy mule for a LotG Recharge to make up for the lost Recharge. Something like Combat Jumping.
Blind -- this could use two slots for damage, or if you want more of a support character, more Acc/Hold/Rech.
Superior Invis -- if you can get one more slot here, it is a good place for a LotG Rech. Yes, those things are expensive. That's why I try to get them with Merits instead of buying them at the market. A perma-PA build really needs three of them minimum.
Phantom Army - Instead of the Call to Arms Dam/EndRdx, why not the other triple? You need the Recharge. Even better; replace both Call to Arms with the Soulbound Alligiance Dam/Rech and Chance for Build Up. Yes, they are purples, but they are usually not too expensive.
Stamina - You are giving up some Recovery using Efficiency Adapter here. 3 Common EndMod are better. 4 Performance Shifters are even better - the proc, EndMod, EndMod/Rech and EndMod/Acc.
Hover - with one more slot, another place for a LotG Recharge. With Hover, SI and CJ taking those LotG Recharges, you can skip GI and take Fire Shield, Mutation, Rise of the Phoenix or something else, but only one slot.
Enervating Field uses a ton of endurance - it needs two EndRdx.
Ling Rad - a Perma PA build has enough recharge where you can get by with a single Accuracy in the default slot. That frees up a bunch of slots.
Phantasm - Instead of the two Brilliant Leadership, consider using a single Acc/Dam from Blood Mandate or another pet set. You still get good Accuracy and capped damage, and you save a slot. Recharge and EndRdx are mostly worthless in this power.
Flash and EM Pulse: The Basilisk Gaze quad is very expensive. Trade that out for the Acc/Hold. EM Pulse's numbers are OK with that, but try to fit one more slot into Flash for Acc/Hold/Rech from Ghost Widow or another set.
Hopefully that will help. -
Quote:I would say that Ice/Rad is the second best powerset to use Choking Cloud, and those two are probably the only controller builds I would use CC on. CC needs a second PB AoE toggle power to make it work effectively, and Arctic Air combines with it very, very well. However, I have to consider the damage in Hot Feet to be superior to the confuse in AA. Ice/Rad is great at controlling the foes, but isn't all that fast at taking them down.Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
As usual I agree with everything you said Local Man, but I have a minor quibble. IMO Ice/Rad is in about equal position or better position to leverage Choking Cloud. It's definitely a great power on both though.
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One important question: Is this a team build or a solo build? I recommend Propel over Lift for solo or small team builds. The damage on Lift is pitiful -- less than GD or Crush, while the damage from Propel is big even if it is slow to animate. On larger teams, everything is dead before you can get Propel to animate, but solo or small team, that damage makes a difference. Additionally, Propel is one of the three Grav powers that I consider to be the most interesting, making Grav a worthwhile set. It is just fun to smack bad guys with stuff. (The other two are Wormhole and Singularity . . . the rest of the Grav set is kind of blah.)
How much do you use Glue Arrow? With Crushing Field, there isn't nearly the need for Glue Arrow as on, for instance, my Illusion/TA. Mid's doesn't mention it, but CF has a 62% slow for 15 sec. even if the foe was not immobilized. Glue Arrow is a nice power, but it might be that Flash Arrow would be more use to you . . . it just depends on your playstyle.
Personally, I like to take every AoE Hold I can get . . . especially on a set like Gravity which is weak on AoE control. By taking GDF at 30 you will then have two ranged AoE controls, substantially improving your AoE control ability.
So, I would drop Lift and take Propel and GDF, and consider dropping Glue Arrow for Flash Arrow, depending on style.
And as for the APP set -- Ice is a great choice for you. Hibernate provides both a heal and End Recovery in an emergency. Plus it has two AoE damage powers and a Defense-based shield.