Kruunch

Thanks Speed_Force ... actually you get well beyond the softcap on my build (Debuffs in Dark Melee), but very nice alternative.

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... really, a RO network member is asking how you kill +4's without a tank?! If the 54's are eating your SO invuln, just get a defense buff to get you to 45%.

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My SD Tanker is above the soft cap and with adding in the debuffs from DM, I still get hit constantly by L52s (L54s that much moreso). I'm still not getting how you stay alive (not to mention killing fast enough to make it worthwhile).

Do they just not hit you (and are you all hovering at max range or something)?

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Well with a fully slotted CP, Hasten and fairly pedestrian global recharge, you can get CP down to 150s recharge. Add in a second CP with the same stats (what would happen here if nothing changes in ElA (that's for Kioshi ) and that would make CP effectively perma, no?

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It would Kruunch, which is why I doubt they are going to allow it. Perma-CP is very powerful when you think about it. Also with some of the high recharge builds out there plus a lil team support and you enter the realm of double-stacking. THAT is scary in and of itself.

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It would be rather asinine to make such a build, that requires 2 powers, locks you into a specific epic, is not available while exempted, if the same recharge and investment would make Power Sink available every 15 seconds. You should NEVER need more endurance than what Power Sink because anything you can do to make Conserve Power better will make Power Sink that much better.

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As asanine as WP Tankers taking Stamina and Quick Recovery?

/boggle

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elec doesnt have any defense at all so basically it would all be from bonus's and weave and cj if you would soft cap it right?


and i would never skip fitness even with perma cp..just cause of all the uniques like the ps + end ,numina regen/recov, miracle + recov/pancea +hp ( all these slots come from not slotting scorch . i guess its more important to me then a minor damage power..to each is own i guess)

not to mention why i have such issues with people taking weave and cj for lotg+ recharges on fire tanks let alone elec tanks

too many great things to place in toons to skip fitness imo,unless your just gonna make it to sit or have a pocket emp around then sure..


question though...grounded has what 6 kb protection right?

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If you had perma CP (not to mention PS) why on earth would you want expensive uniques that give +recovery?

The regen you could get elsewhere.

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The i16 info actually vindicates me.

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What a surprise. Let's review:

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Allow me to clarify.

Knowing that:

-You've implied in the past the animation and power systems effects were held together by Elmer's glue and thumbtacks, and that changing animations was cumbersome.

-Cast times for animations are not standard, greatly cutting down what animations could be swapped around without impacting power balance. Unless a system was created to auto re-time them and assuming they still looked OK...or unless you created dozens of versions of the KO Blow animation to fit every conceivable cast time, I wouldn't see the work involved being worth it just for something as minor as every attack having one alternate animation.

-You're already swamped with work doing just the particle effects tinting aspect of power customization, which as far as we know is the extent of the customization i16 will offer(the already existing weapon customization system not withstanding).

-Melee sets without weapons are the minority. There's more bang/buck ratio for putting work in to custom weapons and tinting particle effects.

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So you assert that:

1. The code that connects powers to animations is fragile enough to make changing it unlikely.
2. Cast times would be a problem or restriction for alternate animations
3. There's too much work with color tinting to allow for the creation of custom animations
4. Melee sets without weapons are a minority not worth working on.


I16 proves you correct that we'd have to be astronomically lucky for I16 to "allow alternate animations for our powers" because in I16:

1. They added relatively simple code to allow for powers to call alternate animation and FX sequences
2. They did so in a manner that always preserves cast time
3. They decided to make time specifically to create custom animations in some cases...
4. ...specifically for a couple of the unarmed melee sets because their color/tinting options are lower, and to introduce the fact that I16 now allows for alternate animations for your powers


Of course, when you look at it that way, its obvious how you could come to the mistaken conclusion that I16 vindicates your position. For at least this definition of vindicates:

Vindicates:
To get revenge for; to avenge

It does look like I16 is specifically designed to take revenge on your posts, but that's entirely a coincidence.

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From the person that suggested ED, you need to understand that you are trying to argue against a person's empathic response which is worthless.

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Actually that was just Arc stretching her retorting legs.

I think she actually saves these up for stress relievers

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Anyhow if Elec Armor for Tankers/Scrappers get something actually useful instead of CP there will be hordes of Brutes and Stalkers screaming...

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It strikes me that the ability to pick up Conserve Power at level 18 on a tanker would be one of the main attractions of the set. This is when you'd get it if it were ported over without changes. With auxiliary powers, you could have it twice, and any Electric Armor tanker I probably would make likely would have it twice.

Not sure why I am seeing the hate for what looks to me to be the most fun and useful power in the set.

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The power has a duration of 90 seconds and a recharge of 600 seconds, thats an uptime of 15% without enhancements and 29% if fully slotted. Thats not going to help anyone skip Stamina.

Making Power Sink tier 7, though, would.

Power Sink has a 60 second cool-down and it can literally refill your full endurance bar with enough foes around. That's every 31ish seconds with 3 recharge SOs. Conserve Power is entirely redundant in the set, not to mention horribly weak compared to the alternative.

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Well with a fully slotted CP, Hasten and fairly pedestrian global recharge, you can get CP down to 150s recharge. Add in a second CP with the same stats (what would happen here if nothing changes in ElA (that's for Kioshi ) and that would make CP effectively perma, no?

I don't doubt the effectiveness of -res ... in fact, as an SD/DM Tanker that runs just a few percent below damage cap, I'm a -res crack addict.

I just don't get how your whole team isn't wiped constantly (assuming a full group and full spawns). What are the average pack sizes? Are you pulling in 2-3 at a time or the whole pack?

(I'm not doubting you btw .... I'm genuinely interested)

Yeah I was having a really hard time getting my +recharge to where I wanted it without using purps (and it's still 10-15% shy of where I can get my Inv/SS Tanker to).

The only thing I don't like about the Dark Consumption slotting is losing the damage (with AAO and Soul Drain, DC actually does worthwhile aoe damage). I may reverse myself on that slotting. Also gotta see how I like how MG performs with that slotting since it was a gimmicky way of getting more recharge into the build.

How do you do an L54 (or even L52) boss farm with no Tankers and do it quickly? I run with an L50 (heavily IO'd) Dark/Dark Defender quite often and he pulls mobs fine but doesn't provide near the protection needed for a fast run.

*scratches head*

P.S. - While L54s will gain you more experience over the same map ... I can usually do 2 L52 maps in the time it would take the same team to do an L54. The difference is that big.

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Has a powerset ever changed (as in powers swapped out) when it was ported to another AT?

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Yes: Fire Melee.

Combustion (aoe) [Tank] -> Cremate (st) [Brute, Scrapper]
Taunt (aoe taunt) [Brute, Tank] -> Confront (st taunt) [Scrapper]
GFS (2.44 scale dmg) [Brute, Tank] -> GFS (2.28 scale dmg) [Scrapper]

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Well maybe we will see a CP swap then.

Heraclea: You don't make a bad point about doubling up CP (basically making it perma between the 2 versions with the right build) and that would effectively kill the need for Stamina as someone else points out (between that and PS).

Using Aid Self with EA would seem a bit problematic to me, being an all resist set ... would 30% positional be enough to use it reliably?

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dont you find the xp to slow down doing just bosses?...i tried a boss farm and honestly it took forever and really wasnt that great for xp.

course everyone is auto 50 on it and the team did kinda blow..but it seems with just my fire tank and p.ling everyone and letting them doorsit i have the faster flow of xp

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L54 Boss farms I find a bit on the slow side. L52 Boss farms can net a toon in their 40s about 2 levels under an hour (basically one full map using mine as a base). I have yet to see a door farm that equals that. Soloing, LTs would be much faster yes.

Having said that, you need to put together your team with a little care (not a ton but some). You want a really strong Tanker (or 2 capable ones preferably), 2 Troller/Defenders and the rest DPS (hopefully without knockback).

The thing I really like about this farm is everyone participates and it's a fairly tough run with a full spawn (unlike the Hami bubble farms), so you actually learn something about the AT you're playing. Additionally you get tons of influence (11mil per map at 50 with a full group) and cap tickets per map, so L50s have a reason for hopping on as well.

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Capped positional defenses with over capped melee for debuff coverage.

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MIDs bug - Phalanx Fighting always assumes you have 1 ally in range fueling PF, so it's giving higher than normal numbers. Two workarounds: 1) For a Tank, shut it off and manually add 5% to your defense. 2) Edit the power database to allow selecting 0 targets.

Short version: You have 53.8% melee, 41.3% ranged, 42.9% aoe, not quite softcapped.

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You can chain spam Siphon Life if/when needed (less then 1 sec gap with Hasten Up).

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Powers don't start recharging until they're done animating, so you'd still have to wait 3s between SLs.

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Thanks ... edited to reflect.

Die in a fire.

My point was going to be you probably won't see a change to Elec Armor since the same change would have to be across all the other ATs that utilize it.

I hope I'm pleasantly surprised and they sub in Healing Flames *just_for_tankers* which would make it a really REALLY attractive set, but somehow I doubt it.

UPDATE:

Many maps have been pulled and republished under different IDs due to destructible/defendable objects being taken off the available list.

My Arc's new #: 265438 (L52 Bosses)

Has a powerset ever changed (as in powers swapped out) when it was ported to another AT?

Got beat up and cried in the corner for a week eh?

You want three slots in AD for the Hamio trick.

New (more advanced) build that I'm working toward (doesn't include purples).

Major highlights:

Well over capped positional defenses with DM's debuffs.

Near capped Defense Debuff Resist without Grant Cover.

Siphon Life on a 3s recharge (full damage and 70% heal).

Hasten 18-20 secs off perma.

Damage capped with 10 foes in range.

Recovery at 3.29/s making Dark Consumption entirely skippable (still working out what I want to do with that).

Ability to heavy tank most every TF in the game, solo AVs and aoe farm on the same build.

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/

[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]

Ghost of Kruunch: Level 50 Magic Tanker
Primary Power Set: Shield Defense
Secondary Power Set: Dark Melee
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fighting

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Deflection -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), ImpArm-ResDam(7), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(7), LkGmblr-Rchg+(11), LkGmblr-Def(15), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(15)
Level 1: Shadow Punch -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(43), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(46), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(46), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 2: Smite -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(3), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(3), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(34), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34)
Level 4: Shadow Maul -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(5), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(5), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(13), Oblit-%Dam(40)
Level 6: Battle Agility -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(9), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(9), LkGmblr-EndRdx/Rchg(11)
Level 8: Active Defense -- HO:Membr(A), HO:Membr(25), HO:Membr(25)
Level 10: Hover -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Swift -- Flight-I(A)
Level 14: Fly -- Winter-ResSlow(A)
Level 16: Siphon Life -- C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(A), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(17), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(19), Nictus-Heal/HP/Regen/Rchg(19), Nictus-Heal(34)
Level 18: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Rcvry+(50)
Level 20: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(21), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(21), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(37)
Level 22: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(23), RechRdx-I(23)
Level 24: Against All Odds -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 26: Shield Charge -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(27), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(27), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), Oblit-%Dam(31)
Level 28: Soul Drain -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(29), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(29), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(33), Oblit-%Dam(33)
Level 30: Phalanx Fighting -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 32: Boxing -- T'Death-Dam%(A)
Level 35: Dark Consumption -- Mocking-Taunt(A), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg(36), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg/Rng(36), Mocking-Acc/Rchg(36), Mocking-Taunt/Rng(37), Mocking-Rchg(37)
Level 38: Midnight Grasp -- Cloud-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(A), Cloud-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Cloud-Acc/Rchg(39), Cloud-Acc/ToHitDeb(39), Dmg-I(40), Dmg-I(40)
Level 41: True Grit -- Mrcl-Heal(A), Mrcl-Heal/EndRdx(42), Mrcl-Heal/Rchg(42), ImpArm-ResDam(42), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(43), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(43)
Level 44: Tough -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(45), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45), ImpArm-EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 47: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(48), LkGmblr-Def(48), LkGmblr-EndRdx/Rchg(48)
Level 49: One with the Shield -- ImpArm-ResDam(A), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(50), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(50)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet
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[u]Set Bonus Totals:[u]<ul type="square">[*]9% DamageBuff(Smashing)[*]9% DamageBuff(Lethal)[*]9% DamageBuff(Fire)[*]9% DamageBuff(Cold)[*]9% DamageBuff(Energy)[*]9% DamageBuff(Negative)[*]9% DamageBuff(Toxic)[*]9% DamageBuff(Psionic)[*]11.1% Defense(Smashing)[*]11.1% Defense(Lethal)[*]6.13% Defense(Fire)[*]6.13% Defense(Cold)[*]3% Defense(Energy)[*]3% Defense(Negative)[*]8.62% Defense(Psionic)[*]15.5% Defense(Melee)[*]3% Defense(Ranged)[*]4.56% Defense(AoE)[*]6.3% Max End[*]66% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*]68.8% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*]5% FlySpeed[*]210.8 HP (11.3%) HitPoints[*]5% JumpHeight[*]5% JumpSpeed[*]MezResist(Confused) 2.5%[*]MezResist(Held) 5.25%[*]MezResist(Immobilize) 9.1%[*]MezResist(Sleep) 2.5%[*]MezResist(Stun) 9.1%[*]MezResist(Terrorized) 2.5%[*]12.5% (0.21 End/sec) Recovery[*]30% (2.35 HP/sec) Regeneration[*]20% ResEffect(FlySpeed)[*]20% ResEffect(RechargeTime)[*]20% ResEffect(RunSpeed)[*]5% RunSpeed[/list]------------
[u]Set Bonuses:[u]
[u]Steadfast Protection[u]
(Deflection)<ul type="square">[*] 3% Defense(All)[/list][u]Impervium Armor[u]
(Deflection)<ul type="square">[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery[/list][u]Luck of the Gambler[u]
(Deflection)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints[*] 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Crushing Impact[u]
(Shadow Punch)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Immobilize) 2.2%[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints[*] 7% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Crushing Impact[u]
(Smite)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Immobilize) 2.2%[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints[*] 7% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Obliteration[u]
(Shadow Maul)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Stun) 2.2%[*] 3% DamageBuff(All)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*] 3.75% Defense(Melee), 1.88% Defense(Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Smashing)[/list][u]Luck of the Gambler[u]
(Battle Agility)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Winter's Gift[u]
(Fly)<ul type="square">[*] 20% ResEffect(RunSpeed), 20% ResEffect(RechargeTime), 20% ResEffect(FlySpeed)[/list][u]Crushing Impact[u]
(Siphon Life)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Immobilize) 2.2%[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints[*] 7% Enhancement(Accuracy)[/list][u]Touch of the Nictus[u]
(Siphon Life)<ul type="square">[*] 35.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints[/list][u]Performance Shifter[u]
(Stamina)<ul type="square">[*] 5% JumpSpeed, 5% JumpHeight, 5% FlySpeed, 5% RunSpeed[*] 35.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery[/list][u]Obliteration[u]
(Shield Charge)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Stun) 2.2%[*] 3% DamageBuff(All)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*] 3.75% Defense(Melee), 1.88% Defense(Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Smashing)[/list][u]Obliteration[u]
(Soul Drain)<ul type="square">[*] MezResist(Stun) 2.2%[*] 3% DamageBuff(All)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*] 3.75% Defense(Melee), 1.88% Defense(Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Smashing)[/list][u]Luck of the Gambler[u]
(Phalanx Fighting)<ul type="square">[*] 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Mocking Beratement[u]
(Dark Consumption)<ul type="square">[*] 1.8% Max End[*] MezResist(Held) 2.75%[*] 2.5% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.25% Defense(Melee)[*] 3.13% Defense(Fire,Cold), 1.56% Defense(AoE)[*] 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Cloud Senses[u]
(Midnight Grasp)<ul type="square">[*] Status Resistance 2.5%[*] 2.25% Max End[*] 6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Miracle[u]
(True Grit)<ul type="square">[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery[*] 35.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints[/list][u]Impervium Armor[u]
(True Grit)<ul type="square">[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery[*] 1.88% Defense(Psionic)[/list][u]Impervium Armor[u]
(Tough)<ul type="square">[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery[*] 1.88% Defense(Psionic)[*] 2.25% Max End[/list][u]Luck of the Gambler[u]
(Weave)<ul type="square">[*] 10% (0.78 HP/sec) Regeneration[*] 21.1 HP (1.13%) HitPoints (Exceeded 5 Bonus Cap)[*] 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*] 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[/list][u]Impervium Armor[u]
(One with the Shield)<ul type="square">[*] 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery (Exceeded 5 Bonus Cap)[*] 1.88% Defense(Psionic)[/list]


*EDIT* Changed some inaccuracies Sarrate pointed out.

I went this route (fit my build the best and is cheap):

Level 16: Siphon Life -- C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(A), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(17), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(19), Nictus-Heal/HP/Regen/Rchg(19), Nictus-Heal(34)

Gives:

Dam: 88.07
Rech: 91.78
Heal: 68.80
Acc: 42.40
End: 42.40

Bonuses:

Health: 56.2 (x2 Health bonuses)
Global Acc: 7%
Mez Resist (Immob): 2.2%

This is good for a build that is still growing. Once your global recharge hits 25% you can start dropping recharge little by little out of the slotting (and since this is cheap slotting, it won't hurt to do so). At 45% global recharge (and running Hasten) you can get away with as little as 25% recharge in Siphon Life to spam it constantly if/when needed.

Note: The HP bonus totals were for a Tanker ... be a little lower on a Scrapper.

*cough* Cheby *cough*

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wait,wait,wait... Is that Werner on the tanker forum?

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Wait, who am I? Where am I? Who all are you people?

Yeah, I'm not sure what happened. I must have gotten drunk and blacked out.

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He finally saw the light and realized Tankers have better DPS since Scrappers have 0 DPS when splatted

On this board ya never know.

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My current main is a 50 SD/BA tanker. Per advise I read on the forums when I respecced at 50 I picked up Build-up so that I could slot it with Gaussian's Synchronized Fire Control for all positions defense granted at 6 pieces. I threw those in and never looked back. Build-up works so great as a minion killer on 8 player teams when dropped right before shield charge it is a no-brainer now for my future shieldies to also take the skill.

But as for the subject at hand: Today I was working on my Scrapper(BS/SD) and creating a similar build to my tanker when I ended up with a free slot. I had never given any ancillaries much thought save for Conserve Power(part theme issue, part personal choice) when I noticed Focused Accuracy on the Body pool. Putting the merrits of the skill aside(I like what the skill has to offer without a set IO in it) I noticed it would also take a Gaussian's set. The unique buildup proc in my current build is wasted as it is in the skill buildup already.

I have read up on IO procs and how they work with different sorts of powers but I wanted to ask here because the result in mids and what I read suggest are a bit strange. If you put the guassians build-up IO proc in focused accuracy(a toggle skill) do you receive buildup for as long as it is toggled on? Or does the buildup have the advertised 5% chance to go off each 10 seconds(duration) that focused accuracy is toggled on? Only when the power is first activated? Not at all?

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It has a chance to proc every 10 seconds while FA is on.

It's not worth picking up FA for it (or getting FA at all for that matter ... end cost/return stinks).

I suggest slotting this for Invuln Tankers who are going to be running Invince anyways, but going out of your way to try to make this work is just a waste of slots and powers (went this route with my WP/SM Tanker and dropped it afterwards).

When's the last time you tried to TP someone in RV?