Judgement_Dave

Not read the rest of the thread yet...
[ QUOTE ]

The idea for the arch nemesis came from non other than our own Positron.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Yes arch foes have been with us since year dot. But I'm pretty sure you knew I was referring to a super hero MMO context.

And I am unaware of any MMO anywhere that incoroporates that type of system.
And Ide be surprised if the AI to achieve any sophisticated "archfoe" gameplay was available until fairly recently.

Please tell me I didnt have to say.. "the first person in the MMO superhero arena to suggest and want an arch enemy system was our very own Positron."

[/ QUOTE ]
No - you didn't need to be that specific, the point I was trying to make would still stand.

The idea of an arch-enemy/nemesis system is a fairly obvious extension for anyone making a hero game (MMO or not).

You stated that Posi had come up with the idea as if he'd had a real brainwave (i.e. of a non-obvious variety) that was now being copied/stolen/borrowed by the competition. They aren't doing this as, even if they were unaware.

Now there are ideas that wouldn't be obvious and are worth holding close to the devs chest until launched on the public (well - at beta time anyway). For example, if no game had ever had an auction house/consignment house/market then that might be seen as a less obvious development for a game and would be worth keeping quiet about until ready.

I say it'd be less obvious as when developing a game in a certain genre it could be fairly easy to get locked into the genres literary and gaming history - I can't think of many heroes (in any prior heroic works) trading at markets, even though in everyday life it may not seem odd in these days of ebay and co. So I think that creating markets/auctions within a game was possibly a darn good idea that wasn't obvious. Of course, this may not be the best example, but it's the first one that came to mind that I thought would work...

We've not been told that much about I14 yet. And we know virtually nothing about I15+... so maybe, just maybe, the devs have had some non-obvious ideas for extension and their waiting to announce them when:
a - they know the idea can be coded so it works
b - the opposition have shown their initial hand and don't have enough time left to develop their own similar system to launch near CoX's

Oh and btw:
We don't know that the MA enemies/archenemies/nemeses will use sophisticated AI - I'd guess that it may still be pretty dumb but instead of a fixed set of behaviours for dev created big bads it'll use templates of behaviours for powersets. I'd guess that both MA and CO wil use something along these lines - it won't be a new AI engine that analyses available powers, relative positions and known/estimated resistance/defensive factors/buffs/debuffs. i.e. it'll still be relatively dumb compared to a human.

QR

MA wrote:
[ QUOTE ]
Player created missions and an archenemy which appears randomly to confront you... yes, I see the similarity


[/ QUOTE ]
Does the CO nemesis appear randomly? I thought it was a little more 'structured' than that - thought it appeared more like it's own mini-arc than randomly whenever you least expect.

LB wrote:
[ QUOTE ]

The idea for the arch nemesis came from non other than our own Positron.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm pretty sure that the idea of an archenemy has been knocking around for many centuries. It's even existed in comics before computers were used to play games... It's a pretty quantum leap to put it into games about heroes/villains.


note - quantum as in a small, indivisible unit of leaping - i.e. archenemies are a pretty obvious idea to anyone thinking about designing a hero game!

It is much appreciated that you've given us some info on this - especially considering it's the weekend and I dare say you've much better things to be doing.

It's been the complete silence that's been most disconcerting - so even though the details have yet to be worked out (and no doubt there'll be moe change in the future) it's good to be told as much as you have.

A little worried about Avatea - she's met some posters and had dealings with others for other NC games, so she must be certifiable to agree to deal with us in her future role!

BTW - does it look like we've got you around a little longer, or is it time to start goodbyes? If the latter then all the best, wherever life takes you.

[ QUOTE ]
Oh, BTW, the swine have something else, not related to the archetect, but possibly related to Godwin, and someone not seen since before the game started.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ooooh - about time too, if I'm recalling right, since it's probably about 5 or 6 issues back that we started wondering when.

but but but couldn't that take the edge off the doom about I14 being nothing at all but MA?

[ QUOTE ]
Right start placing bets on when we're going to hear any news.

I'm placing my bet on Wednesday the 18th of February.

[/ QUOTE ]
Meaningless without specifying a year!

[ QUOTE ]
Even GR, who's been posting a little today mostly in defense of his soon to be former employer, is making absolutely no comment regarding what's going on. Almost certainly because he's been TOLD to make no comment. This silence is causing NC irreparable harm by the minute.

[/ QUOTE ]
GR is probably metaphorically biting his lip.

He realises that saying anything other than just plain factual corrections may not help him find future employment. Would you hire someone in GRs line of work who'd potentially embarassed their last employer on public forums?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
stating that the EU boards are closing and that the EU players are being moved to the US servers would have no undue impact on any talks with Brighton staff

[/ QUOTE ]

That would affect the status of a post actually existing or not. It probably would have no influence on negotiations, but the lawyers would have advised them to say nothing anyway, as lawyers always err on the side of non-disclosure of information.

[/ QUOTE ]
Why I said no undue impact. I'd guess that moving the players to the US would possibly help NC...

It can be hard to justify making staff redundant when expanding or keeping operations the same (other than staff loss). I'd have thought it a lot easier to do when making big changes to your operations - such as moving all customers from one subsection of the company to another.

It also lets the company look superficially good by offering alternate employment that you know most people won't take - yes you can move from Brighton to Texas... there's a similar role there, with only slightly lower pay/benefits and far worse working hours... but have it if you don't mind uprooting your family... we'll even help you with 10% of your relocation fees.

Still - them thar lawyers will have advised silence. Silence and, being lawyers, another $10000 for that advice.

[ QUOTE ]
To be perfectly honest setting aside the loss of jobs (which is truly sucky) and the loss of the EU community (also sucky) the best thing they NCWest could do is to lump the EU and US together I've never seen the point of creating these borders for online games all it serves to do is dilute your users.

[/ QUOTE ]
But, as I understand it, part of it's always been down to tying the forum membership to the game account and the restrictions on data sharing between EU and US companies.

i.e. they've not been able to have both EU and US on the same forum if they're using personal account data (may be the address and financial info) to determine membership.

Pretty sure that without these external restrictions no company would ever really consider hosting seperate boards.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
they cant make announcements that suggest the situation is a feta compli

[/ QUOTE ]
It's really cheesy to say that... course I may not have understood you properly - after all, it's all greek to me.

But more seriously, I've already stated that NC must have an idea what they're going to do with us EU players and EU boards/servers. It shouldn't be reliant upon individuals employment or a roles geographical location - so consultation periods should have nothing to do with the current silence to us.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's the HR laws of the UK. You can't just say I'm making someone redundant. You have to go through a process. If you don't the employee has a very good chance of getting substantial rewards for a) constructive dismissal b) sueing because the company isn't being compliant with the law.

NC cant make a formal announcement until the process is complete becaus they would be prejudicing themselves.

[/ QUOTE ]
You misunderstand me. I understand UK employment law regarding this - having seen my fair share of redundancies at companies I've been at.

What I don't understand is that the company will have decided what to do with the EU customers/boards/servers and should be able to give us some pointers rather than let doom run riot. e.g. stating that the EU boards are closing and that the EU players are being moved to the US servers would have no undue impact on any talks with Brighton staff as to whether or not their positions are redundant or whether they can be found an alternate role within the company.

Are you really suggesting that NC wait until the end of a 90 day consultation period to let the players know whether we're being shafted to the US servers or not? How many players will they have left at the end of such a period of non-communication?



Oh - and the first part was due to your using the phrase feta compli rather than fait accompli, given that feta is a greek cheese.

[ QUOTE ]
they cant make announcements that suggest the situation is a feta compli

[/ QUOTE ]
It's really cheesy to say that... course I may not have understood you properly - after all, it's all greek to me.

But more seriously, I've already stated that NC must have an idea what they're going to do with us EU players and EU boards/servers. It shouldn't be reliant upon individuals employment or a roles geographical location - so consultation periods should have nothing to do with the current silence to us.

QR

I just looked at the page about NC Soft values and so I'm now certain that they'll talk to us as soon as possible.

BTW - I thought it's been mentioned that there were some US positions affected - did anyone find a linky about staff losses over there?

[ QUOTE ]
This thread is the most hysterical block of doom-mongering ever to appear on these boards. Please don't forget to tar yourself with that brush, with extra lashings for FFM for spreading it over to the US boards too.

[/ QUOTE ]
Quite true.

But it's had about 48 hours during the middle of the working week to develop as such. 48hrs following an event planned by NC. And it could possibly be stopped just by a single post actually talking to us.

Do you not feel NC's at least a little lacking in customer relations?

In a blackout of course a feeling of doom will grow.

[ QUOTE ]
Tell me something, do you think this is being handled well?

[/ QUOTE ]
Is this one of those questions asked to determine baseline response for polygraph tests?

i.e. We know the answer and it's impossible to lie without being caught on it.

I'd have thought about the most positive anyone could answer (whilst avoiding answering) is that it's not the worst way that it could have been handled.

I just hope that the lack of communication with the customers/players is because all the NC guys are tied up trying to look after the staff they're affecting - if they are communicating with the staff as badly as with us then it really is shameful.

[ QUOTE ]
Now you are back tracking... you said the media caused the credit crunch, not made it happen sooner/worse.

[/ QUOTE ]
Much as this recession sidetrack i sinteresting in itself, I'm not so sure it's good to divert from the what's going on and why won't NC talk to us nature of most of the thread.

But I'd love to point out, as my quote seems to keep being repeated at the top of that quote pyramid, that I always took the view that the media took the banks subprime debt-shuffling cockups and made things far worse. And indeed, had spending/lending patterns remained as was before their spin it is possible that we may not have seen a recession and it's pretty much certain that if we still did it wouldn't be as bad.
[ QUOTE ]
Surely if the media doomsaying caused some people to alter their spending habits it could have lead to or exacerbated the recession.


[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Locking this thread until we get a redname response on the situation

[/ QUOTE ]
An optimistic mockmod aren't you? Surely the boards get closed before a redname responds.

[ QUOTE ]

If they do say that then they'll lose more players than if they put time/effort into doing some sort of transfer imo.

[/ QUOTE ]
As has been noted many times, this wasn't the result of a plan scribbled on the back of a [censored] packet after one-too-many tequillas on Monday night. If they are going to put time/effort into a plan then they should have done it already.

Whilst they may still (superficially at least) be looking at their staff I'd be surprised if the positions/locations that are in flux will have any great impact on what they have planned for the players. i.e. if they've decided that they're going to transfer us then they'll transfer us whether some staff from Brighton relocate to the US or not.

Given that they've planned this reorganisation in advance, they must have also planned for what they are going to do with us. It doesn't matter where it falls on the scale from no change to we just don't care - go away ex-customers - they'll have planned it. As such, they should have been able to give (at least preliminery) information to us PDQ.

Given that they've been silent and letting the bad-feelings/thoughts prosper it seems pretty clear that NC doesn't really give a hoot about us - which doen't bode well.

BTW - do you think that they'd hold off telling us relatively good news?




EDIT: Damn board censorship filter - can't it understand that a [censored] packet is what cigarettes come in!!!

[ QUOTE ]
I think perhaps you're confusing the "credit crunch" which was media hype, with an actual recession. A recession = two consecutive quarters of reduced economic productivity/activity. That is what we are currently in; if you're in any doubt, a quick internet search (hell, a quick Google search) will explain all.


[/ QUOTE ]
Surely if the media doomsaying caused some people to alter their spending habits it could have lead to or exacerbated the recession.

And btw pretty sure that the UK media started serious talk of recession as being a recession and not a credit crunch way before the 2nd quarter of shrink was announced.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
oooo ooooo ooooo i call dibs on being temp mod for next few days!!!

*gets ban stick out*

[/ QUOTE ]


That's [u]not[u] what mods use as a ban stick! Put it away and do your flies up!

[/ QUOTE ]
Can we notify Damz to ban himself for making the banstick all sticky?

[ QUOTE ]
If NCSoft is going down the tubes they aint going to be worried about server populations.

[/ QUOTE ]
True - but I would have thought that they would be if they weren't going down the tubes.

Seriously: Are you reading the signs and portents as pointing to NCSoft going down the tubes?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Merits aside, if you've got the time why shouldn't there be a chance to team for hours on one venture?

[/ QUOTE ]
I take it you haven't seen the people complaining that TF's enforce teaming and wish you could solo them?


[/ QUOTE ]
I take it you haven't seen my replies in some of the threads by people complaining that TF's enforce teaming and wish you could solo them?

Point is that there should be:
* things you can solo that are quick
* things you can solo that take a long time
* things that need a team which are quick
* things that need a team which take a long time

Horses for courses - pick which you as an individual want to play on any one day/week/session.

[ QUOTE ]
The sad thing about all this is that a lot of EU players have lost faith now due to lack of information and arent logging in at the moment. Just logged into union about half hour ago to see if any of mates were online/tell supergroup stuff and the numbers were a lot less that usually are for this time of day. Might be a coincidence i dont know!!!


[/ QUOTE ]
I know that I've not felt like playing my characters anything like as much since the rumours/news broke. And a few comments on the forums seem to imply that I'm not the only one (though I'm not saying it's widespread).

Now not feeling like playing and not playing aren't quite the same thing. And we know that only a fraction of players read/post on the forums...

But I'd be surprised if word of this hasn't got to some of the non-forum-readers ingame.

This is why I'm pretty surprised by the total lackof redname comment. Even unfounded rumours of possible server merge or being TR'd to new US accounts could cause damage to the game population. The simple uncertainty and lack of communication doesn't help anyone feel that the future's bright for players on the EU servers.

If we've absolutely nothing to worry about, why doesn't someone from NC come out and allay our fears?

If they don't know yet, why not at least come out and say 'we can't give you full details yet, but we can tell you next Tuesday.'.

I'd have thought that silence is never a good strategy for a company. And certainly isn't for a company with a reasonable number of customers who may be getting the wrong end of the stick and losing faith in the company.

[ QUOTE ]
Are petitions being ignored if so, or passed automatically to the US GM's already?


[/ QUOTE ]
If they were being ignored would we notice the difference? The auto-mail response will still be in place.

I thought about adding the following, then forgot to - adding as a seperate post as my original has been replied to already.

Whilst liking the shorter arcs/TFs in CoV, I do think it could do with a couple of big TFs (a similar size to Posi or SSTF1). It's fine having shorter TFs that people can do without having to commit to (potentially several hours of play but at the same time it could do with a couple of long ones for those teams who do have the time.

Merits aside, if you've got the time why shouldn't there be a chance to team for hours on one venture?

[ QUOTE ]
Also ... We'd better bloody well get the Passport badge if we do have to move!!!

[/ QUOTE ]
I14 contains the new shafted badge.

When Posi (may have been another dev) said that they'll be able to use various badges for things other thanjust branching dialog he was referring to the way that any character with the shafted badge will just get laughed at by contacts, enemies and civillians alike.

/em point_and_laugh_at_euro_fool may also enter the game.

[ QUOTE ]
There is 49 double digit merit rewards for Heroes ( counting the triple one ), and a grand total of 11 for Villains.

If you do all the 11 double digit Villain tasks, you will be one point short of a LotG 7.5 with 199 Merits. I'm not even going to try adding up the Hero numbers. It's... daunting.

---

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm by no way trying to claim that the sides are equal, nor that there is any meaningful disparity, but if you did as you suggest how much longer would it take to do all of that CoH content than it would to do all the CoV content?

I trust that you don't just play redside, and have done all of the blueside content you're on about? If you don't know what you're letting yourself in for, some of it is akin to a masochistic endurance test.

I play both sides - and, in general, I much prefer the CoV content. More interesting and also generally shorter - which helps keep the interest whilst doing them (at least the first few times). I'd guess that it's also easier to get teams to do a task which takes a couple of hours for 40 merits than it is to do a task that can sometimes take 5-8 hrs - a lot of people may not have the time to spare no matter how many merits are on offer.

[ QUOTE ]
Added to the people who have had to stop playing due to the recession. Some people seem to see saving the world as a luxury.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ironic that the current financial crisis gave Gordon Brown the chance to announce to the UK parliament that he had saved the world.

As PRAF says above, I'd be inclined to think that the reccession may drive some people to MMOs as it's a cheap form of entertainment.

Most people won't cut their net access and a whole month of play in a MMO costs substantially less than going to a sports/music event, probably less than the cheapest you could manage to go and see a single film at the cinema. Heck - a month costs less than some paperback books do these days - and definitely less than a hardback.


Hmmmm - boards seemed to go down for several minutes then.. was that just for me?