Jade_Dragon
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Posts
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Quote:I've actually done this too, my Tanker I mentioned has both Flight and Super Speed. However, he doesn't really need Super Jump, as Combat Jumping gives him enough height to suggest he can jump high, and anything higher he can fly. I mean, what is flying but jumping and missing the ground, right?Originally Posted by SwellGuy
I did something like that 6 years ago but it was because I didn't have a clue and was curious about the travel powers.
Again, maybe I gimped him, but it's only ONE power. I was going to take Hasten anyway, and I took Air Superiority in place of Punch. So no loss there. If I can't find room for one concept power in my build, there's a problem, and the advantage of having both full three dimensional freedom AND the fastest travel power outside of Teleport outweights any such consideration to me. -
Well, most of my characters are created as concept first, and then the powers are chosen to fit that concept. On the other hand, I make it a point to make those powers work as well as possible given those limitations. The best example is probably my main, Jade Dragon. As I didn't want him firing beams of energy from his eyes, only his hands, I skipped X-Ray Beam. That didn't cripple me, though, because I was able to use Neutrino Bolt, Photon Volley, and the other attacks to compensate. One power sacrificed out of the whole set was not so important that it gimped me.
Likewise, I chose Force Fields over Radiation Emission because I felt the character simply should not be able to heal. I toyed with picking up Aid Other for a while, simply so I would have the power to fall back on, but eventually decided I didn't need it. In retrospect, though, Radiation Emission might have fit the character better, because it would better represent the ability to contain and block foes' attacks by surrounding them, instead of directly shielding allies. I could have skipped Radiant Aura, and it likely would have been a workable build.
One issue I do have with taking power definitions too seriously, though, is with my Inv/SS Tanker, who put off taking Dull Pain. The concept I had for the character was that he couldn't heal himself, although he had almost limitless energy in his body, he couldn't force his cells to heal any faster than the fastest rate they could naturally grow. Instead, he deflected incoming attacks by channelling kinetic energy into his skin, opposing any impact that struck him.
After a while, though, I realized that with the ability to store energy, while there was the limitation I had given him on healing, he could easily stave off fatigue or exhaustion simply by channelling energy back into his exhausted cells. Likewise, his regeneration rate would still be phenomenal, simply because he could channel as much energy as needed instantly. Besides, the power was called "Dull Pain", and its ability to boost HP, as well as heal it, matched his ability to create a shell of energy to boost his skin's toughness. So in the end I had avoided a power which would in fact help give him that "second wind" playing style I had been looking for.
A similar power is Hoarfrost/Frostwork, in Ice Armor and Cold Domination. It is not a healing power, it puts a shell of ice over the player effected. But it works in concept exactly like Dull Pain.
Other examples, like Joe Everyman, my skill-based, non-super-powered Illusion Controller, although I limit him to powers I can explain as sleight of hand or psychology, in practice he's a "MAN" build, so it's more for the challenge of creating a character mostly from Pool Powers. The idea, I think, is to come up with conceptual challenges and see if I can come up with a good build based on that. But being so bound to concept you aren't even willing to accept the gameplay aspects of it, I think that's going too far. -
Quote:I stand corrected then. I do think it's true that when you zone, you lose all buffs and debuffs that are on you. They have to be reapplied automatically by the zoning code to restore them. I just assumed that since you had access to the powers on your own character, but not others, they would not be restored.Originally Posted by Psylenz
Bubbles do INDEED survive zoning.
Of course, even that may have changed. I'm never 100% sure about anything.
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Quote:Yeah, I think that's my thought. It's needed where it is needed. While it may still be helpful to the tricked out Defender that has lots of -Res debuffs, the way it's designed to be only available when solo helps keep that from being too much. And the bonus is very helpful to those who have no bonus at all.Originally Posted by Biospark
One other thing to consider with this buff though, is that it may be a relatively small increase for a level 50 "tricked-out" defender, its a much larger boost to the PRE-SO defender. And this is something that I think was very much needed for the AT.
There's still an issue with the team portion of Vigilance being too reactive in nature, but I wouldn't want to throw out this change in order to address that. And honestly, we can LIVE with the "Negligence" nature of the End discount, just as Blasters could live with the original Defiance. If Blasters had just been given the mez loophole but Defiance had kept working the way it did, that would be compariable to this.
Likewise, I would like to see FF's offense addressed before it gets ported to Corruptors, but this does help FF, as well as Empathy, in a similar fashion to the damage buffs that were added to Pain Domination. I've said that a universal, Inherent buff was NOT the solution to Power Set imbalances, but this addresses that issue specifically as it applies to soloing, which would be more of an Inherent attribute.
I don't really see this as an FF issue. And if it HELPS FF, why continue to justify the penalty? This isn't the type of game where classes are prevented from soloing in order to force them to team. -
Quote:Why should a set that can do that NOT be permitted to solo as well as some of the other sets? Especially since Force Field Controllers have exactly the same advantages as other Controllers when soloing.Originally Posted by Frosticus
Why would a set that can do that be permitted to solo as well as some of the other sets?
I would also argue that Dark provides just as much protection as Force Field, albeit WITHOUT the ability to do this without "babysitting" them. But if the issue is the utility of the set, not its ease of use, then you will have to provide me with hard, conclusive proof that the protection of FF is vastly superior to every other Defender Primary. If not, then there is no reason why FF should be less soloable than Dark.
As for your claim that Scourge, while believed to be useful, is actually nearly ineffective, I must disagree with that as well. While the overall benefit is only around 5%, close to the effectiveness of Critical for Scrappers, that is in terms of damage done, NOT a measurement of the frequency of Scourge. While Scourge may not be doing as much damage as it could be, it is still defeating foes earlier than they would have been defeated otherwise. This means that:
1) Scourge provides Endurance efficiency for Corruptors' attacks when their foes are nearly defeated, when the need for Endurance is greatest.
2) Scourge speeds the process of defeat, reducing the amount of counter damage the Corruptor recieves. Particularly when the Corruptor would otherwise have to wait for a high damage attack to recharge before defeating a foe.
Neither is "useless", particularly when solo, and I think both are more important than the actual value of the increase in damage. It is not the increase in overall DPS, but the burst nature of the bonus.
Personally, I do agree that the idea that this buff is mostly a minor change, because Defenders are pretty much okay, is a valid one. Note, however, that while Defenders do have an Inherent that give them the equivalent of the Endurance efficiency I noted above, it does NOT give them the faster defeat. This would, just in a different form. As such, I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth. -
Quote:Yeah, IMHO it is not that Rest + PFF is overpowered, it's that you expect something from Rest + PFF, but would not get it. So the combination is locked out so you don't commit suicide by stupidity.Originally Posted by Twilight_Snow
Rest has a very strong defense debuff. So, even if you can rest while in your personal force field, mobs can easily hit you anyway.
In regards to your last post, Soundtrack, while I'm not sure whether or not the PBU buff would last through zoning, you would waste a good portion of its duration waiting on the loading screen anyway. So I would PBU after arriving in the mission and before bubbling everyone else.
I'm fairly certain that the team bubbles will not survive the zoning. (I believe self buffs in general do, but not applied buffs)
I agree with Fulmens on not being so obsessive with PBU, but a lot of that is because it is an offense buff and a support buff combined. I tend to use the offensive portion instead of the support portion unless, as I stated, it's extremely simple to just use it and buff everyone, as at the start of the mission. Once the mission is going, I tend to go with what is most useful to the situation.
Also note that since FF has no offensive buff of its own, PBU and Aim, if you have it, (Assault, too) counter that drawback. -
Quote:Silly, yes, but not entirely unexpected. The problem is that Buff/Debuff sets are a combination of buffs, debuffs, and "soft" controls like knockback and slow. That's not really a problem, since Defenders and Controllers get the same modifier (now...) with knockback and slow, but harder controls, disorient, and holds, they are subject to the base laws of the ATs. Which is, "Controllers are the best at controlling". Period. Which is the Primary and which is the Secondary, despite what logic should tell you, doesn't figure into it.Originally Posted by MaxLongstreet
The point you make regarding the hold times of Controller hold times is an excellent one - that Controllers get longer hold times in a secondary power than Defenders get in their primary is quite silly.
Looking at the problem even further, the Control sets seem to specialize with hard controls, particularly AoEs, while Buff/Debuff sets have the same AoE capability, but softer controls. Their harder controls are typically single target. Blaster Secondaries have harder controls as well, but specialize more with single targets, NOT AoEs. So while the three original ranged AT obviously were designed around a combination of ranged attacks, buffs, debuffs, and controls, the way the controls were split up kind of gave Controllers the advantage.
It sounds like your point is basically that Dark Miasma is overpowered in any AT that it is given to, and thus it should not be given to Controllers just because it is best that for now it's the one AT that doesn't get overpowered by it.Quote:That the Secondary would be equivalent to a Dark Corruptor - well, exactly. Dark Corruptors are the best Corruptors there are, IMO, and Corruptors can't hold a candle to Controllers in either soloability or team effectiveness (a Corruptor's scaled down Blaster damage isn't better than a Controller primary, unless you're just a terrible Controller).
Not that I would argue the point. Although as I said, Dark is one of the least offensive Buff/Debuff sets available. I find it to be somewhat tedious for that reason, although of course it is well suited for a pure support role. -
Quote:The debuffing effects for Dark would be less for a Controller, and Dark, unlike Rad, has almost no offensive bonuses to offer. Defense is ALL that it does, outside of the -Res in Tar Patch.Originally Posted by MaxLongstreet
You're pretty much right here, Tex - I was just making a basically off topic observation about how Defenders simply aren't as good as Controllers. I do think Dark on Controllers steering into overpowered territory, not so much because it stacks control, but because it's just so darn good at debuffing. If you can control everything, and debuff everything, it's hard to see how your team takes damage. Yes, you can make the same argument for Rad (and Rad is obviously one of the top couple control secondaries), but Dark is even better, IMO. Who needs any other support? Just bring along an x/Dark Controller.
A /Dark Controller, as far as debuffs go, would be identical to having a /Dark Corruptor on the team. And all Controllers have the ability to stack control on top of the support capabilities of the Secondary. The only place that's unique to /Dark or /TA is where you can stack the control effects across the Primary and Secondary. (And the Controller would actually have stronger holds in either Dark or TA than either the Defender or Controller) -
While it may be argued whether or not Dark Servant is overpowered, the fact remains, there would be no way the devs would let you have TWO Dark Servants. And since Dark Control would have the priority for the pet, most likely it would be dropped from that version of Miasma and put into Control.
It's possible Dark Servant could be put on a large recharge timer, like with Masterminds, but that's where my argument comes from. The devs realized in Beta that the combination of Dark Servant and Lich was way too powerful because of the redudancy between the two. While they did have their differences, they were stacking effects to make them more powerful.
I consider it much more likely that Dark Miasma will lose some powers to Dark Control, and then gain some pure buffing/debuffing powers to replace them. Parylizing Gaze isn't really a problem, but Fearsome Stare is, as I can see that becoming a power in Dark Control. (Single target holds in Control Sets usually deal damage, and Parylizing Gaze doesn't. But an AoE fear is much more a Control Set power)
In short, I suspect that Dark/Dark Defenders, Corruptors, Controllers and Dominators will share many of the same powers, but not always in the same sets. Controllers and Dominators will have powers that Defenders and Corruptors have in Dark Miasma, and Defenders, Corruptors and Dominators will have powers in their attack sets (like Dark Pit or Tenabrous Tentacles) that Controllers will have in Dark Miasma. And Defenders and Corruptors will have their Dark Servant, while Dominators and Controllers will have something like Lich. (i.e., Dark Servant with damage) -
Well, one in-game explanation might be that the zones connected by the Yellow Line are much lower Security Level than the Green Line. (Of course, that seems backwards, you would think the Yellow Line would be the more dangerous of the two) Anyway, Security Level isn't as important since the zone restrictions were lifted (and the major zones were never restricted anyway) but it's possible that the average citizens are more restricted in their travel for their own safety.
Also, according to the game lore (as posted in ParagonWiki) there was originally a Red Line as well, but it was damaged in the Rikti War, and taken out of service. Parts of the line were transferred to the Yellow and Green lines, though, which suggests that there ARE connections between them, just not where we can see them. (Either that, or they can be connected easily by adding additional track) -
Quote:It seems kind of a waste to point out that my post was meant to be irony, except that in pointing out that I shouldn't point it out, that's irony as well.Originally Posted by Roderick
Except side-switching, which starts at 20.
And the new end-game system.
But nobody cares about those. -
Quote:It scales with level to 20, so no, you won't be a level 1 Defender with a 30% damage bonus.Originally Posted by Talen Lee
Idle thought, how much impact does this have to defender damage before enhancement? Ie, before level 22, is the defender outperforming the corruptor?
Corruptors do get Scourge from level 1, but then they do greater damage in proportion to their foes' HP, and thus there is more potential for Scourge to be wasted. I'd say it likely comes out even.
I like the comparison that solo, a Defender will do about the same damage as a Corruptor, and on a team, he'll lose some of that bonus for a small team, and all of it on a large one. The Defender is still slightly lower, but then as previous comparisons between Defenders and Corruptors show, the higher the Defender's offensive buff, the closer he comes to a Corruptor anyway. So for Offenders, they would likely exceed the Corruptor by a small amount, while defensive builds would trail a little behind. -
The ability to combine inspirations is really the most useful thing to come along in this game in a long time. I have plenty of characters that go through greens like crazy, but whose Endurance bar never moves. I have others that burn blue constantly just trying to maintain normal combat, but which never take damage. (Tankers, I'm lookin' at you) Before I would have to drop my excess in a base to pick them up on my other character. Now, I just take the blues I have in abundance and turn them into greens, and vice versa.
I personally find it useful to save Inspirations for Bosses, and for other emergencies in which you suddenly need them. Once you get past level 25, though, you should have enough room in your tray to save one of each kind of Inspiration, with room on the top row for those that you can use as you earn them. Never let your tray stay full, but I usually only use the ones in the top row until I get ready to spend my reserve.
On a team, I almost never feel the need to use my reserve, but there's no reason to go ahead and use whatever's in my top row as I get them.
If you run into something REALLY tough, nothing can get you past it like going to the store and buying up a tray of nothing but Lucks. However, keep in mind that more than four Lucks is a waste. You should be able to make do with three, two if you have good defenses of your own. Rather than spending them all at once, spread them out so you can keep the fight going if the duration isn't long enough to finish off the foe. This is the secret to taking on EBs and AVs, too.
Awakens are kind of a mixed blessing. It's nice not to come back from the hospital, but if your foes are milling over you while you're dead, the Awaken won't help you. You have two choices, either make a run for it when you see you're about to die and hope you get far enough away that your foes will walk away when they lose aggro, or hit a Break Free and then a green and blue so you can get back into the fight right away. The period between where the Awaken revives you and you hit the Break Free is the critical period, if you can get out of the stun quickly enough, you might survive, but even that's no good if you're surrounded and outnumbered. Still, I always carry Awakens and Break Frees in pairs.
Actually, if you're doing well with combining and getting good material to work with, (i.e., you are high enough level to have a large tray) it can help to spend your big Inspirations to combine into a single Restoration, and then combine all your Awakens into Respites. -
I like that everyone needs to get to 50 before Going Rogue hits. Because of course there will be no content in Going Rogue for anyone below level, oh, I dunno, 20.
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Quote:True. Nothing is taken away if you are not Dark/ or Traps/ then. (Unless the psuedo-pets were counted, such as Oil Slick and Lighting Storm, but somehow I doubt that. I also would make the guess that VS didn't count)Originally Posted by StratoNexus
Technically, there is a change to how Vigilance works with the end discount. Currently, Vigilance counts pets, Dark Servant, Acid Mortar, teammates pets, etc. This little loophole is closed once I17 comes out.
I would say that even with Traps there is a benefit, as Acid Mortar is not a 100% of the time damage boost. Unfortunately, I'm guessing the Inherent won't apply to the mines. (or any other psuedo-pets) -
Quote:That's the way I'd explain it. Vigilance means you're holding something back so you have it ready the moment a teammate needs it. That explains both the lower End cost and the lower damage.Originally Posted by Straightman
Maybe you do less damage because you're vigilant.
The more teammates you have to keep an eye on, the more distracted you are & the less damage you do.
You are LESS vigilant when you're solo, because the only one you have to look after is yourself. -
Quote:It is in addition to it. The idea is in effect that Vigilance gives a damage boost solo or on small teams, and a Endurance discount on large teams.Originally Posted by Dagmo
I didn't read this whole thread (11 pages by the time I started). Does this damage buff replace the current Vigilance, or is it in addition to it? If "in addition to," then perfect. If it replaces, then does that leave Defenders without an operating inherent on a full team?
The mechanism of the End discount hasn't changed, which is still a shame in some ways, but the change does not take away anything. -
If you are using IOs to come close to softcapping your Defense, then certainly that's the best plan. However, for the general or low level build, you have the potential to simplify certain encounters due to the very specific resist. Since these are support powers, and not merely personal defense, then you can make the argument that your power will help support the team for certain enemies, while other support ATs may be able to provide protection for you where your own defense does not apply.
It can also be thought of as higher protection for ranged attacks, since those tend to be of non-physical damage types more often than melee attacks.
I agree that the best course of action is to slot for both. However, I know that on my Dark Miasma characters, being able to trivialize the Negative damage of Circle of Thorns helps take a lot of the sting out of them. If I could just do the same to their Fire it would be perfect. -
Quote:Well, when you get down to it, there are only two Buff/Debuff sets that fit that bill, and Corruptors get Pain Domination instead of Empathy, which corrects that limitation. It is true, however, that without a +dam, +acc, -res or -def buff in their Secondary, they have no power in their Secondary which directly benefits their Primary. (+recharge as well, but usually the Sets that have such a power already have +dam or -res)Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
The theory I've seen banded about is that with Corruptors the devs are deliberately only giving them sets with strong -res debuffs or +dam buffs in order to try and minimize the problem Defenders have where the soloing ability of different defenders varies wildly. No clue if that's true or not.
I suspect that we will either:
1) Never see Force Field for Corruptors. Masterminds do get access to it, and there have been some ATs shut out of various Power Sets for concept or performance reasons (Stalkers with Sheilds, Brutes with Ice Melee/Armor)
2) Introduce a redesign of Force Field when it is given to Corruptors
3) Introduce a new variation of Force Field, similar to Pain Domination varied from Empathy, for Corruptors
Don't forget that a Whatever/Sonic Corruptor can make a good substitute for Force Fields with the right color customization. I use that for my Electric/Magnetic Sheilds concept villain. -
I would say Poison is to Radation Emission as Empathy is to Thermal Radiation.
What folks are probably looking for is more Empathy to Pain Domination. A name like "Chemicals" or "Neurotoxins" might take away some of the connotations of "Evil".
Poison hasn't even been proliferated to Corruptors yet, though. Give it time, there's still quite a few Power Sets left to go, although some Archetypes are going to be running out soon. -
Quote:rotflOriginally Posted by spittingtrashcan
besides, it's way too good! And it's not good enough! And it's not equally good for everyone! They should have given us a worse better different buff!
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Um... that would pretty much neutralize the effect of nerfing something, wouldn't it? To put out something else that's nerfed and leave the original alone? That would be like, I don't know, trying to make people eat healthier by putting smaller portions on the menu, but making them cost the same as the full size food. Everyone would just keep buying the full size items.
I have not heard of any other Sets being nerfed in the near future, although of course changes always happen. -
They can't all be FREEEM!!! You've got to expect that once in a while.
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I think I remember seeing that, but I can't remember what I did. I think I had to turn resolution scaling off, and just go fullscreen at a lower resolution.
It showed up as a bug, and eventually disappeared, so it's possible the bug has simply shown up again. Making sure your graphic drivers are up to date can help, too. -
Quote:Oo, that is cool...Originally Posted by Derangedpolygot
For the second, perhaps a Sonic/DP Defender? Use the Steampunk Armor(with Piston boots, they're rather Steamy-punk). The Armor collects the echo from all the gunshots, and shapes it to new purpose.