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I'm excited! Really excited! Really...really excited!
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Quote:I'm sure the people they help respect them.I have more respect for EMTs, police, and fireman than I could ever have for these people since it is their job to put their life on the line to protect other people. Now if they stopped a nuclear reactor from blowing up, stop a serial killer, or any of the plausible stuff that superheroes do, then I would have respect for them.
I respect anyone putting themselves out on the line to help others period. I've seen the ugly of the people who do nothing to help because they're afraid, or its not their job or not their problem. Yes, I've watched someone murdered in a crowded parking lot of 30+ people in the vicinity and hundreds in the area and no one but me attempted to help nor would tell the police anything about what happened, instead some took pictures of the dead body intending on posting it online or selling the pictures, or they complained about being detained, and those who took pictures were pissed when the police took their cameras. The police showed me, I was the first to call 911 even after a couple of minutes talking to and trying to help the guy who was shot before I made the call, and even several months later told me I'm the only person to come forward with information on the crime.
So if this percentage is what is normal in the world we live in, then I'm glad there are people out there breaking the status quo, because being normal sucks. -
Quote:Other than the action scenes, I didn't really like Sucker Punch. I thought it lacked in editing and better story telling in the between scenes, so I'm really not a fan of the movie. I don't mind when people state their opinion on Snyder's other work that they've seen. It just irks me when someone acts like an authority on a film that they've only seen the trailer of, and then in turn quote other people who's only seen the trailer of the same film. It only serves to undermine the positions of those with real opinions of a film...especially those that may appear to be in the same side on the matter. Its a vicious cycle of stupid that must be crushed...with prejudice!If someone wants to enjoy Sucker Punch for its mindless spectacle, then that's fine. But that doesn't mean I have to keep quiet about disliking Snyder's other work.
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Quote:They just released the the first six minutes of Sucker Punch so you can see for yourself if you want.I missed the first 5 minutes came in at about the point where jon hamm was about to lobotomize babydoll but I surmised that there was misconduct of perhaps a sexual nature going on before the lobotomy can anyone shed somelight?
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Didn't Elizabeth Taylor do a voiceover for Captain Planet?
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The Ultimate Cut has adds all the scenes around the Newpaper Vender that was missing from the other cuts plus the Tales of the Black Trader put into it. They also changed a few scenes and the ending. It's really the only way you can see the movie as it was meant to be, and the closest cut to the Graphic Novel sans the Psychic Rainbow Squid.
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Quote:From the trailers, Super doesn't appear likely to devastate anything. However, I'll probably still see it though (I grew up around people involved in entertainment be it on stage, tv or making movies, so its basically been my life), but not before Source Code, then I'll give my honest view on it.
At least every reviewer I've read stated that Zach really knows how to make the pretty. So if Nolan and Goyer has his back where he's weakiest...the storytelling, Man of Steel should be something to behold.
Oh, if you haven't seen the Ultimate Cut of Watchmen, you haven't really seen Watchmen. -
They just released the the first six minutes of Sucker Punch to those who are still on the fence about watching it.
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It wasn't so much the woman he drew that I liked. There were these panels he drew where Wonder Woman has trying to hold up something beyon her regular super strength, and he drew her legs cracking litteraly under the strain like a clay or stone column would crack under that pressure. That imagery was sooo powerful, and my mind went...oh crap...I totally forgot she isn't human! I was floored!
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My favorite depiction of Wonder Woman is Alex Ross's, in which he depicts her as what she actually is...a lifelike clay golem, like Pygmalion.
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Quote:I took it as Zach making a Christ allegory (spoiler not that it matters if you've read the above).I have no problem with well done, straight forward, sad endings. Most of the movies listed have those.
Sucker Punch, in my opinion, doesn't have that. See, I read a lot of promotional material for the movie, and everything I read swore up and down six ways to Sunday that SP is Baby Doll's story. So I was actually annoyed at the big "revelation" more than anything. Don't get me wrong, I'd been wondering -why- the movie was called "Sucker Punch" since I heard the title, but I just feel the twist ending was poorly done. For me, the two girls getting killed suddenly, and Baby Doll getting lobotomized -anyway- overwhelm any happy endingy closure of Sweet Pea being the lone survivor of the whole thing.
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The powers that be (the guardian angel/mission handler/bus driver) led Baby Doll through the missions, however she and other girls weren't who he was ultimately trying to help/save, instead he was trying to save Sweet Pea. It may have mainly Baby Doll's mission, but it wasn't her guardian angel leading her, she was just his weapon. -
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Quote:Actually, I don't really disagree with you. I do disagree with the people (well mainly one person) you defended.Ultimately I think you've let yourself get too hung up on the words used to describe whether Snyder was "inspired" by Brazil and/or if he "ripped it off". None of that matters because we have the actual words of Snyder to go by.
The real key here is to accept the fact that Snyder, by his own admission, has told us that Sucker Punch is not a 100% original idea. He was "inspired" by something else - the degree of that inspiration is immaterial. The degree to which Sucker Punch is more like Brazil or Pan's Labyrinth is immaterial.
What is material is that in this case Snyder bears the responsibility of creating "something inspired by something else" that is not an IMPROVEMENT on that which came before him. In fact his derivative work it clearly something LESS impressive than what came before him. That's the core problem here.
It doesn't bother me that Snyder "ripped off", "borrowed", "was inspired by" or anything else.
What bothers me is that whatever he did he ended up doing BADLY.
Tossing up smoke and mirrors about who inspired what is not going to change that now. -
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Quote:I could have gone more into the ending showing how it actually likens more to the ending of Pan's Labyrinth than Brazil, but I was trying to limit the spoiler damage.As someone who HAS seen the movie I will vouch for everything TrueGentleman has said related to Sucker Punch as significant and germane to the conversation. Ironically enough TrueGentleman seems to understand the movie much better than others here who've actually seen it. Go figure...
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Quote://Spoilers/// Not that it means anything at this point.Although someone else can have the final word here, this is my summary: For Snyder's first original movie, Sucker Punch displays far too much debt to Brazil, from its visuals and themes to its finale, without showing he's fully understood his inspiration, a pattern in his career that has ripped off George Romero (and Dan O'Bannon) and knocked off Alan Moore.
Your arguments on this has always been hearsay, and sided to unfounded opinion. Other than having giant Samurai in one dream sequence and having a theme of fantasy escapism it does not borrow heavily from Brazil, and the final was an act of defiance and self sacrifice...she did not beg for her life...she let it happen, nor was there any scene of her fighting it off to a bad end. The sequences even the samurai one is very different from those in Brazil. Sure Snyder admited he was inspired by Brazil, but that doesn't mean he ripped it off. And really he did not rip off Moore nor Romero, he was paid to make films based on that material which has never been denied by anyone. -
Quote:The studio put the buget at 209 million factoring tax breaks in Australia where the film was made. EW put their guess of a total cost of around 363 million, (still not breaking even) but that hasn't been substantiated.Your info is incorrect. The official production budget was $270 million. The actual budget was $295 million. (Some costs were charged against other projects or written off to previous attempts at making the movie.) Many people in the know claim the REAL budget was closer to half a billion dollars, due to all the years of trying to get the thing off the ground. Tim Burton reportedly had a pay-or-play contract (meaning he was paid regardless of the film getting made) to the tune of $10 million, maybe more.
Striking a 35 mm print costs somewhere in the neighborhood of $1,500. The film was shown in about 5,000 theatres. That's seven and half million dollars just to make the actual reels. Throw in things like shipping, dubbing and/or subtitles for overseas markets as well as advertising which increase your costs, minus the distribution fees in all those territories, which cuts deeply into your profits.
End result: barely breaking even with a global box office take of $391 million. -
Quote:I'd be interested in that discussion if you had actually seen Sucker Punch, instead of knocking it as a "rip-off" from the get-go.It doesn't seem to mean anything substantial if it shrugs off the director's own admission, the shared themes, and appropriated imagery (i.e. giant armored samurai antagonists that spew light when hit). There's a potentially interesting discussion to be had comparing Sucker Punch and Brazil, but you've resisted even embarking on it and instead tried to change the comparisons to other films that have less in common with the one under discussion, which at this point has been exhausted.
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Quote:I thought I was pretty clear that my argument has always been that "inspiration" does not mean "based on", "knock off", or "rip-off".We're reasonably confident about where we stand on the distinction between an inspiration and a knock off (just as there's a difference between an influence on a film and the basis for it). Bringing other movies like V for Vendetta, Inception, and Pan's Labyrinth into the discussion for the sake of sarcasm hasn't clarified yours.
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It made $200,081,192 in North America and $191 million internationally, earning $391,081,192 worldwide. It had a budget of US$209 million. I don't think anyone considers that breaking even.
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Quote:I was being sarcastic, and Snyder didn't say he based Sucker Punch on Brazil. He just said he was "inspired" by Brazil when making it.Gotta call a spade a spade here: that's just a stupid comment.
Del Toro claiming Brazil is one of his favorite movies is NOT the same thing as Snyder saying he based Sucker Punch on Brazil. Stop making straw men to try and diminish the actual, real fact that Snyder based his movie on another movie and completely missed the point. You like Sucker Punch, fine. Stop trying to pretend that Snyder didn't say and do what he said and did. -
What's hilarious to me, is I think me, Lothic, TrueGentleman and Ironik have been going around for nine pages basically saying the same thing.
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Quote:But's its you that's playing it out to be, not me.One last time it's obvious that Snyder was "inspired" by Brazil when making Sucker Punch.
Does that mean Sucker Punch has to be a shot-for-shot copy of Brazil? Of course not.
Does that mean Sucker Punch can't have elements inspired by other sources? Of course not.
Does that mean Snyder wasn't allowed to put his own spin on Sucker Punch? Of course not.
Quote:But frankly your strange attempt to down-play or "disconnect" the obvious relationship between Sucker Punch and Brazil is borderline laughable at this point, especially when you consider you're attempting to disassociate Sucker Punch away from the BETTER movie of the two.