Hyperstrike

Flawed? No. Merely something you don't want to hear. That never goes down well.

Opinionated? Of course! I've never exactly pretended to be a "neutral" voice of reason on this subject.

No. I understand completely. I'm just saying that the "fix" being pushed here as a "market correction" isn't what they need.

What they need is a fix on the PVP mechanics to destroy what is essentially creating an FOTM.

The problem is you're discussing this in the marketing forum. The original point being argued about was "why is stuff so friggin' expensive".

What you're looking for is a fix in the mechanics of PVP. Not a marketing fix.

Now maybe (probably) I'm being obtuse, but I'm militantly indifferent to the concerns of "players" who simply want things with no effort.


But that's the way the game is set up. It's like playing Unreal Tournament and screaming about how you're being "prevented from role-playing".

There isn't. I'm sorry, but PVP is an afterthough in this game (always has been, always will be). And the PVP crowd has essentially abandoned all the lower level PVP zones given to them in favor of high-end PVP. As such, they've curetted their choices down to almost nothing.

If they want to maintain a hard core PVP community, first they need to choose a game with a hard core PVP system.


It's also what helped drive the market to the point it's at.

Essentially the devs would have to divorce PVP from the PVE game entirely. In effect, making two games. I don't see this happening.

In other words turn PVPers into nothing BUT a drain on the market, as they'd effectively never put anything back into it. Pretty sure you can guess what I think about this...

If it's so broken that people feel compelled to build for 40+ points of KB, then yeah, something is severely screwed.

Sorry, but I still take a stand when people use "need" or "must". It's incorrect. You do not NEED to. Nor MUST you. There are strategic ways to handle KB-heavy foes. It's that it's much more dangerous and inconvenient (and usually unpleasant).

It's simply easier/more convenient to stack on godlike levels of -KB.

Agreed.

Yes. But I'm someone who doesn't mind a modicum of challenge and isn't looking for "a sure thing".

You still have the ability to compete.

What is stopping you from building a similar KB-centric build (not KB-proof)?

Because you "want to play what you want to play" right?

This comes down to choices. If you choose to play in a certain way, then you're choosing to assume responsibilities of setting yourself up to play that way.

Again, you CAN, it's just not guaranteed that you're going to be successful.

And while I agree, to a certain extent, about being able to play what you want, the realities of PVP kinda...well...put the kibosh on that notion doesn't it?

And I still fail to see an inherent promise that you'd be given quick, cheap, and easy access to whatever IOs you need to overcome the current FOTM.

Again, NOT the same thing as "not able to PVP".

And I repeat my question, why should such a player who "doesn't want to" do anything but PVP be given cheap and easy access to said enhancers?

WRONG!

Maybe you cannot PVP against other people with multi-billion builds. But you can still PVP.

Flippers don't raise the price, bidders do.
What flippers raise is the price FLOOR.

Essentially, in a VERY small number of transactions in an unflipped commodity, some buyers will get away with a lower price. The majority of them though will wind up paying more.

Steady pressure at a price floor will smooth out the wild swings from occasional low to much longer periods of high pricing.

Part of the reason salvage has gotten so much more volatile is due to the changes in base storage. Buyers don't necessarily have a massive reserve of stored items to fall back on anymore. These massive stores removed some of the pressure to buy at any cost from the market and helped keep prices lower. Now that that's no longer an option, that market pressure is driving up prices.

No. They are NOT. Simply because the tactics you choose to utilize leave you wanting for this form of mitigation doesn't mean they are REQUIRED.

I'm really sorry that you're having a hard time acquiring stuff you want for specific purposes, but it still doesn't mean the stuff is required. Highly desirable? Sure! Game-changing? Sure! Required? Not on any day of the week, and twice-no on Sundays.

If you want to continue with GearQuest so you can compete against someone else with a 30-billion Inf build, you're inflicting it upon yourself.

Does it mean you couldn't work with a bunch of friends and go after PVP at the SO/Common IO level while avoiding the IO set fiends?

There's no "problem with availability". There's a market of 100K+ people in the game. PVPers are 1/2% to 1% of this population (or less). Yet this doesn't mean the IOs are less enticing to the other 99+% of the players. And for the most part they're purposefully scarce. Especially since everything but purples and certain holiday-specific recipes are purchasable by Merits now.

And, while you're in PVP thumping an opponent, there are players out there just like you who're earning inf in PVE at a rate that dwarfs yours.

Why exactly do you deserve to get one of these desirable IOs more than someone else? Because of some mistaken notion that you NEED them more?

Correction, it's not working FOR YOU because of choices you make in how you play.

Then you don't want the stuff or *ahem* NEED it that badly. Again, at no point were you ever ENTITLED to get the stuff easily or cheaply.

If you want it, work for it. LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.

It's called patience. Do without for a bit while and spend a little time multiplying your wealth. Saying "I don't want to do that" is simply asking for stuff to be given to you. And that's never going to happen.

I hate to be blunt about this...well, no I don't especially since it's necessary.

TOUGH NOOGIES.

The way you are choosing to participate in the game pretty much mandates that you do some long-term planning and inf building and stop expecting stuff to simply be available and cheap the second you finish PL'ing to 50.

I DO understand how you feel. I merely don't sympathize, because an alternative that'd make you happy would bork the game. BADLY.

The one "forcing" you to do it is...wait for it...wait for it...you. Nobody else.

Again, you were never promised anything in this game would be cheap or easy to obtain.

Another thing, how long did you take to acquire your "necessary" enhancers?

How much of what you paid can be attributed to the "Gotsta buy is NAO!" tax?

You're choosing to participate in an activity that pushes the notion that you have to be heavily augmented with IOs to be "competitive". If you wish to participate in it, you're making the choice to move into a very rarefied style of play and, knowing the market conditions, needing to accumulate either large quantities of inf, or be lucky enough to pick up PVP IOs.

Saying "I don't want to" is essentially you telling people that you want to not have to do the same exact things they have to do to come to the same end.

Putting price caps on to make things "cheaper" will simply result in stuff being generally unavailable (as stuff either just sells immediately at the price cap, or people hoard them and sell them off market via trade).

I could tell you, but I'd get banned from the forums...

Man. And here I thought you didn't have an ounce of humor in you.

THAT was funny as hell!

Technically, the game is a collection of communities.

So it's my problem that my neighbor is offended when my wife appears outside without a burkha?

(Note: I'm single, the question is just formulated to give you the proper perspective.)

Unlike droning in PVP, the buyer has zero direct interaction with the seller. Hence it's a "consignment house".

Yet it needs to be done. You don't stop telling the truth simply because some greedy jackhole doesn't want to hear it.

Moreover, aren't they effective trying to tell the marketeers the same thing?

But this is a MARKET, not a store.

Unlike them, I'm not telling them they have to.

As most of these people are supposedly "casual" players, they're not the ones setting the norms for the community. They may attempt to influence them, but they aren't the ones codifying proper behavior.

You lie! Your model has no fingers! Just mitten hands!

Uhm.

...


...

No comment.

Note: Not all marketeers are flippers.

Many of the marketeers can bring crafted IOs to market more cheaply than Random Player #71931 can. This means they can list product on the market at a lower price which, if

I can honestly say that I don't.

I'm at work right now. It's slow, and there's exactly ZERO demands on my time at the moment.

As such, my bosses don't mind me playing Forum Gladiator while on the clock.

Bah. Typing isn't a cardio workout.
And, according to him, I don't HAVE a heart.

Carpal Tunnel FTL!

*Florid bow*

No more than simple market forces give them.

If more people were generating them, you wouldn't see the same level of control.

You and every other person suggesting that price caps would "fix" the "problem".

I honestly don't give a damn WHAT motivates someone else's greed.
You're the one that seems fixated on the assumption that everyone is turning to RMT. Maybe it's guilt or something.

Essentially you're going to simply hint that because someone CAN buy inf, they will.

And, again, you can get your account locked and all your neat stuff deleted. So, if RMT is such an obvious "answer" please, don't let me stop you.

Because a miniscule sample of dishonest douchebags = The Whole Market.

Right. Remind me never to sit a statistics class with you.

Ah. Assumption of guilt.

Ask the devs. Not me.

The devs can't do a whole lot about RMT as they have no legal jurisdiction over them. All they can do is ban accounts when RMT is made evident and kill address blocks of known RMT'ers.

From a single transfer? No. From a pattern of transfers? Yeah. Cross-reference it with the account's payment information and geographic location of the originating IP and yeah. You can get a pretty good idea when an account is doing something illicit.

Again they've done about everything they can to hinder RMT. They've made it so that you an turn off your in-game e-mail. You can Ignore people. They quash accounts they can show are engaging in RMT.

I'm not going to flagellate myself simply because there are still a few dishonest people left uncaught. There always are and always will be. Is it an IDEAL situation? Nope. But being a zealot about it doesn't make the problem go away either.

And there's nothing wrong with farming. It's simply another playstyle.


The sellers? Yeah, by transaction patterns. You can then derive customers from the list of transactions.

Why should I go into an extensive dissertation on your and others faults when simple descriptors like "greedy" and "lazy" cover the necessary territory effectively?

Go ahead and pretend some modicum of control then. Sure, not participating IS a modicum of control. For you and you alone. Of course, why EXACTLY are you whining about the prices then if you're not participating?




No. Way to fail English 101.

My point is not that "these people shouldn't have access to the best stuff". My point is that these people should not simply have this stuff given to them or the way to obtaining them eased simply because they want it and want it now. The entirety of the game is about time sinks and subscription retention. If someone can play for 100 hours and wind up with every accolade, temp power, ultimate enhancer, and all the other assorted "bling" in the game, where is the impetus to keep playing?

They CAN participate in it. It doesn't necessarily GUARANTEE that they'll be able to get stuff. That's what you're really looking for. Capping the price at a suitably low level so this stuff IS guaranteed.

Never mind that the price cap won't work. Stuff that exceeds the price cap in value move off into the grey market of trades. If you take away trades, and the stuff is still generated, it simply means the supply will get consumed that much faster. It still won't guarantee that people will be able to get it when they want it.

[]quote]'Cause, y'know, it's a lot easier for people like that to buy inf.[/quote]

You've obsessed with Inf buyers. Again, is it guilt talking?

Please stop with the armchair psychobabble. It's not advancing what you're trying to purport as a point at all. It's merely you dancing around the hard reality of the situation.

Only if you don't know any better.

Sorry, I thought you were talking about something you could actually prove. Not an unsupportable theory.

Well, he shouldn't use any US currency either due to the cocaine content.

I'm wondering if it's Freudian Projection. Seriously.

Okay *BLEEP!* easy! You were never EVER promised that the game would make it EASY for you to get stuff like what we're talking about. If you want easy, go buy a single player console game and get a list of cheat codes!

Obtaining ultra-rares is difficult. Legitimately obtaining the Inf to buy them is slightly less difficult but still not something that can be done overnight. THIS IS AS IT SHOULD BE!

Random drops MEANS RANDOM.

You're still missing the fact that what's generated is a drop in the bucket compared to the demand.

Again you betray your lack of knowledge about how the market works. It the commodity was finite, you'd be right. As the commodity isn't finite...


Maybe not lied to. Misinformed.

Ah. Now it's conspiracy theories.

But IRL you don't generate capital from essentially nothing. Think of it as a grant.

They scrimped and saved.

Christ, give me strength...

If you want to associate with the lowest common denominator here, that's your prerogative. You seem to look at what was, in reality, the LEAST common behavior as the MOST prevalent.

Sorry, but your view is INCREDIBLY skewed.

And it's prone to someone simply up and "going away". See "EVE Online".

And again, here's your problem of perceiving ultra-rares as a "need".

Sorry. Attempting to blatantly Godwin a thread generates an Anti-Godwin force exactly equal to the Godwin's magnitude.