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Granite Agent

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  1. Granite Agent
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Werner View Post
    Note the conditions of the comparison - Eviscerate with Musculature vs. Slash with Spiritual. Since I compared Eviscerate at +274% to Slash at +296%, that means the Eviscerate chain would actually be HARDER to get the recharge for, not easier.

    Let's see, what should I put the Slash chain at for a "fair" comparison... 274% + 32.25% = 306.25%. That brings the Slash chain for this particular build up to 221 DPS. Oh, even better because it gets another Follow Up on Slash itself. Now we're at 229 DPS.

    Calculating the other chain instead of just guessing, tier 4 Musculature adds +32.25% base damage. Plugging that in, I get 235 DPS. So better, but only by a small margin, and I suspect that Spiritual is more generally useful to most builds.

    And as Rad Avenger says, archetype matters. Not only do we not get criticals on Brutes, but there's a much higher percentage of damage coming from buff instead of base damage, which means that Musculature is less useful. So chances seem good that the Slash chain is better on the Brute, though that's not a calculation, just a guess. Still, even calculations are only just good guesses, in that they depend on build assumptions that won't likely match anyone's specific build.

    (Edit: Oh, and it's Follow Up -> Eviscerate -> Focus.)
    Is "the Slash chain" FU->Focus->Slash?

    Or are you saying "the Slash chain" is one with Slash & Evis?

    I'm asking because in my brute's tests of FU-Focus-Slash, you only get the 3rd FU on Focus -- it doesn't last through slash afaik.

    It is striking me that the Brute fury nerf really hit harder than folks think if now Brutes are lagging 20-25dps behind scraps (similar builds)? Plus scraps are burstier due to crits. Hmnnn.

    Last night, running a relatively seamless FU-Focus-Slash chain, I only pulled about 195dps on my brute. That's with explosive strike and armageddon procs in Focus, heca's inc proc in FU, and the -RES in Slash. Started fight at close to 75% fury, used Aid Self once, and had about a 3-cycle downtime after hasten wore off (filled with shockwave).
  2. Granite Agent

    Very Best Farmer?

    POST-ACTION

    For the record I tried the Fuzzy Kitten fire ambush map at +2/+8 on my soft-cap Shield/Fire Tank. It was painfully slow and I probably died 3-4 times before giving up. Even with chugging inspis (I have no other heals). So certainly some of these farms are optimized for Fire Armor toons (who take minimal fire dmg). Surprised me, kinda.

    Any suggestions on SS/Fire/Soul builds?
  3. Granite Agent
    See Scrapper forum recent thread.

    Conventional wisdom said top claws chain was

    FU-Focus-Slash (think -RES achilles and procs in focus)

    But there is a thread now with some people suggesting

    FU-Evis-Slash or FU-Evis-Focus (with -RES in evis)

    and we are waiting for the powers that be (Werner, Iggy, Nihili, JP) to make some definitive clarifications.
  4. Granite Agent
    Wait wait wait ....

    Are you saying (Werner and others) that

    FU-Evis-Slash

    is going to do better DPS than

    FU-Focus-Slash

    at less recharge?

    And this requires the Glad Armor -RES in Evis and what n slash (maintain the -RES achilles)?

    Or that the chain should be FU-Evis-Focus?

    This is news to me. I just busted my chops to get enough recharge to run FU-Focus-Slash on my brute (see Pylon thread near the last posts).
  5. Granite Agent
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BL00DBATH View Post
    Edit:that came off defensive but seriously why wouldn't I want it in my chain?
    For what you describe, lots of exemping etc. for TF Commander, you probably should keep it.

    If you were just looking at 50+ content and trying to maximize DPS, the consensus appears to be that FU-Focus-Slash is superior as a single-target chain. But it's up to others smarter than me to explain the math.
  6. Granite Agent

    Question about DP

    POST-ACTION

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Magentrix View Post
    Why bother when you can just debuff them into irrelevance anyway? If you're soloing your /Dark, you're not likely to be meeting double boss pulls solo, in which case just throw out Fearsome Stare, Darkest Night and Twilight Grasp to heal back any health you lost from the alpha. The boss is basically reduced to 6% of his normal damage, and if they get a lucky mezz off, you pop a break free.

    You're going to have Fearsome Stare and Darkest Night slotted up for To-Hit debuff anyway. Slotting Petrifying Gaze and Suppressive Fire just to take away the last 6% of threat that a boss presents is just kind of a waste, in my opinion. There's better places to burn those slots.
    I slotted them for key set bonuses in my build (referenced above). I almost never use them.
  7. Granite Agent
    Well you have 192% global recharge but didn't slot FU with enough recharge to be able to run FU-Focus-Slash chain, for starters. See my thread further down the first page here titled "180dps is not enough" for some tips.
  8. Granite Agent
    You can see my quest to optimize my Claws/SR brute here:

    http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showt...=253346&page=2

    Last post has the most recent build.

    I would say overall I was oversold on the "goodness" of Brute claws ... Scrappers get more out of FU, a lot more. Brutes do have the bigger bag of HP and I think higher potential damage buffs ... I am at just over 2K hp on my Claws/SR. Also brutes get a taunt in Evasion I think (taunt aura).

    If I had to suggest a different course to you, I'd say look at /Shields over SR or a set like Inv. For a brute you might get more mileage out of FM vs. Claws? My FM/Inv. has about 195 dps vs. my Claws/SR clocking at 187.

    Or go scrapper and break the 200dps barrier (sans /Shield).
  9. Granite Agent

    Very Best Farmer?

    POST-ACTION

    at the risk of sounding completely n00b, can someone explain

    1) What exactly is an ambush farm?
    2) Do you have to make them yourself in the AE creator?
    3) Everyone does this with Fire-only mobs to make running Fire Armor toons easy?
  10. Granite Agent

    Thinking DP/Dark

    POST-ACTION

    Haven't really seen a problem. The cone fear tends to help things stick around.
  11. Granite Agent

    Question about DP

    POST-ACTION

    Right on this very first page:

    http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=250862

    Empty clips is useful on teams for a cone application of the -RES proc from Achilles Heel.

    DP/Dark can soft-cap S/L/E/N with headroom, and pack in enough recharge to keep HOB up pretty quick. And to chain Pistols-DW-Pistols-Exec, or Pistols-DW-Exec, which is OK dps.

    Plan on running Fire Ammo all the time and using your Dark powers to deliver control. That is all.
  12. Granite Agent
    Pretty interesting rebuild, JP.

    Made me wonder if I use your slotting for Slash what it does to Iggy's build, and it actually adds 5% recharge. Without, as far as I can tell, any downside. Which means I think I can get 1 level lower of incarnate ability up the spiritual chain and still run the attack chain. Which is interesting.

    Man, you guys are good. Thanks!
  13. Granite Agent
    Thanks for the input on the endurance / Focus-slotting issue. I guess I will see how it goes -- not like losing an endo IO or even an explosive strike proc is that expensive, if I try it and want to replace w/o respec.

    I just want to raise up my other question, which kind of got lost. So I'll quote myself:

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Granite Agent View Post
    It's unfortunate that the build seems to need the absolute top Spiritual Boost to run the FU-Focus-Slash chain. I thought other Scrappers had been running that chain already before I-19. Is it through more global recharge from other means? Or is it because Scrapper claws has faster recharge than Brute claws, and thus can get to the chain with less global recharge?
  14. Granite Agent
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by StratoNexus View Post
    The pylons are not the goal, they are just a means of build testing. Will you be turning off those toggles in regular missions? Against AVs?
    Generally on teams in these other cases that have some kind of +End power or enough damage that I don't draw on my endo. Plus even solo in these situations I would feel OK using blues. It's only v. pylons with no temps, no inspis. Hence the question
  15. Granite Agent
    Man, JP & Iggy, you guys are awesome! It's like you see things there in MIDS that I can't even see

    I actually don't mind losing Swipe -- I prefer simpler builds/chains, and if I don't need it, I'd rather put the slots somewhere else. I think Iggy's build stays just over 2K hp as well, which I like a lot.

    It's unfortunate that the build seems to need the absolute top Spiritual Boost to run the FU-Focus-Slash chain. I thought other Scrappers had been running that chain already before I-19. Is it through more global recharge from other means? Or is it because Scrapper claws has faster recharge than Brute claws, and thus can get to the chain with less global recharge?

    I don't know how long it will be before I can really get enough shards & drops to get that top Spiritual boost.

    Question re Focus & follow-up: There's an endo IO in Focus, and another IO (different) you both put in FU due to endurance/recharge issues.

    If one assumes one is turning off all toggles except Tough and Focused Senses to DPS the pylon, then is it worth putting an explosive strike proc in Focus instead of the endurance IO? I know you keep talking about the endo use of the chain, but perhaps it would be OK with only 2 toggles running?

    Thanks guys!
  16. Granite Agent
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Syntax42 View Post
    That changes things then. I recalculated it and came up with 181.70 DPS for the original attack chain. Basically, you are using the best attack chain you can use. When Fury is low, Follow-Up makes your first attack chain better DPS than the one I proposed. When Fury is high, using Follow-Up does not make as dramatic of a difference in DPS as I originally thought.

    If you want to do more DPS, make a Scrapper instead. Using the same enhancements and attacks in a blank build, I came up with 182.02 DPS on a Scrapper. The build only had 6.5% global damage bonus instead of the 11.5% in your complete build, so that would boost it a bit more. A Scrapper would start off at high damage without having to build Fury. A Scrapper would also have critical chance which is not factored into the DPS calculation, but would be a significant boost. If you don't have great kinetics teamed with you who can keep your Brute at the damage cap, a Scrapper would do more DPS than a Brute with some damage buffs from teammates.
    Thanks. Actually the question is

    (i) which attack chain to use of the 2 alternatives I posted, and
    (ii) how to adjust the build to get there (in recharge times) without having to sacrifice the soft-cap or much else.

    I thought people here would have some insight on that again.

    Attack Chain Options:
    1) FU-Focus-Slash (adding procs to Focus as detailed)
    2) FU-Focus-Evis (adding procs as detailed above)

    Or perhaps there is another chain that would be better?

    So, overall, looking for build tweaks to reach the better attack chain, preserving soft-cap and HP etc.

    Here's the build again.
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  17. Granite Agent
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Syntax42 View Post
    I think you should get rid of Follow-Up in your attack chain. As a Brute, your damage bonus from Fury makes Follow-Up's damage bonus almost a negligible damage increase.

    Without FU:
    100 damage attack X (150% fury damage + 95% enhanced damage + 100% base) = 345 damage

    With FU:
    100 damage attack X (150% fury damage + 95% enhanced damage + 60% double-FU 100% base) = 405 damage = 17.4% increased damage


    The best single target attack chain for you would start with Focus, then include 2-3 of Shockwave, Strike, and Slash because they are basically the same DPA.

    All calculations were done with 75% fury.
    Your current attack chain, FU -> Focus -> Slash -> Strike is 137.13 DPS with FU double-stacked
    Focus -> Strike -> Slash would be 185.72 DPS in your build

    Follow-Up is definitely LOWERING your DPS.

    I'm not sure how you got 180 DPS out of your attack chain. Did you include the -res proc? Did you use Arcanatime or the listed animation times?
    You raise an interesting thesis. The build is indeed a brute. I'd like to get Werner or Nihili or Shred's take on dropping FU.

    FU definitely gets double-stacked, and it does add + to hit. Could it really be lowering DPS on a Brute build at the Fury limit (75%)? That's interesting.

    180dps was calculated on time to take down a pylon -- average of a few tries. So includes the -RES proc, and the +dmg procs.
  18. Granite Agent
    Since the Fury changes, I believe Scrapper Claws > Brute Claws for single-target DPS. AOE for Brutes still may be better due to Spin having a higher base dmg (if that's true).

    I know my Claws/SR Brute doesn't get the same performance vs. Pylons with an identical chain as scrappers.
  19. Granite Agent
    Hello Scrapperdom ...

    I need some advice on respeccing my Claws/SR build to pump out more DPS. Right now he's running FU-Focus-Slash-Strike for about 180dps. That's with -RES proc in Slash, TOD proc in Swipe, Heca's (inc proc) in FU, and Armagadden proc in Focus.

    I think the way to accomplish this is either

    1) FU-Focus-Slash chain, with an added explosive strike proc in focus, or ..
    2) FU-Focus-Evisc chain, with the added PVP -RES IO in Evis and the added Explosive proc in Focus

    I'm not sure which would be more DPS. But I do know both will require more recharge than I currently have in the build. So I'm very open to suggestions to crank things up while remaining endurance sustainable and not losing much HP.

    I'm a few shards away from the Incarnate boost I have selected in the build presently.

    Thanks!

    Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.92
    http://www.cohplanner.com/

    Click this DataLink to open the build!

    Sharpened: Level 50 Technology Brute
    Primary Power Set: Claws
    Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
    Power Pool: Leaping
    Power Pool: Fighting
    Power Pool: Medicine
    Power Pool: Speed
    Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

    Villain Profile:
    Level 1: Strike -- T'Death-Dam%(A), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(3), T'Death-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(3), T'Death-Acc/Dmg(5), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx(5), T'Death-Dmg/Rchg(7)
    Level 1: Focused Fighting -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(7), LkGmblr-Rchg+(9)
    Level 2: Slash -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(11), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(11), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(13), Achilles-ResDeb%(13)
    Level 4: Focused Senses -- RedFtn-Def(A), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(15), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(15), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(17), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(17), RedFtn-EndRdx(19)
    Level 6: Spin -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(19), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(21), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), Oblit-%Dam(23), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23)
    Level 8: Follow Up -- Hectmb-Dmg/Rchg(A), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(25), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg(25), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx(27), Hectmb-Dam%(27), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(29)
    Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A)
    Level 12: Agile -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(29), LkGmblr-Rchg+(31)
    Level 14: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(31), LkGmblr-Rchg+(31), Zephyr-Travel(33), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(33), Zephyr-ResKB(33)
    Level 16: Dodge -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(34)
    Level 18: Focus -- Apoc-Dmg(A), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34), Apoc-Acc/Rchg(34), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx(36), Apoc-Dam%(36)
    Level 20: Evasion -- RedFtn-Def(A), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(36), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(37), Ksmt-ToHit+(37)
    Level 22: Boxing -- Empty(A)
    Level 24: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(37), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx(39), Aegis-ResDam/Rchg(39)
    Level 26: Weave -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), DefBuff-I(39), DefBuff-I(40)
    Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(40), LkGmblr-Rchg+(40)
    Level 30: Aid Other -- RgnTis-Regen+(A)
    Level 32: Eviscerate -- Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(42), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(42), Armgdn-Dam%(43)
    Level 35: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
    Level 38: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(43)
    Level 41: Superior Conditioning -- P'Shift-End%(A)
    Level 44: Shockwave -- Ragnrk-Dmg(A), Ragnrk-Dmg/Rchg(45), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(45), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(45), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(46)
    Level 47: Physical Perfection -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx(A), Numna-Heal(48), P'Shift-EndMod(48), P'Shift-End%(50)
    Level 49: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A)
    Level 0: Born In Battle
    Level 0: High Pain Threshold
    Level 0: Invader
    Level 0: Marshal
    Level 50: Spiritual Partial Core Revamp
    ------------
    Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Sprint -- ULeap-Stlth(A)
    Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Fury
    Level 4: Ninja Run
    Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
    Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
    Level 2: Health -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(46), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(46), Mrcl-Rcvry+(48)
    Level 2: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(50), P'Shift-End%(50)



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  20. Granite Agent
    Claws are good but I can't get my Claws/SR Brute past 180dps on a pylon running FU-Focus-Slash-Swipe.

    I should probably cram in more recharge -- to run FU-Focus-Slash or FU-Focus-Evis (w/ -RES proc) -- but it's expensive and hard in an already tight build.

    I would suspect the BF-AV chain on DB, or DM's chain (Smite-MG-Smite-SL) would deal higher DPS at same sort of medium-purpled kit-out. Also Iggy has been getting stupid DPS (300+) out of a SS/Fire/Soul brute using a chain of something like Gloom-Haymaker-Burn-Gloom-KO (see pylon thread in scrapper forum).

    So it sort of depends what you're after.
  21. Granite Agent
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Atomic_Woman View Post
    Well, the build I settled on only has 42.5% global recharge so it can't quite squeeze out that attack chain... But it does have 44.8% defense across all types (S/L/F/C/E/N; 21.1% Psi), does that help a bit?
    I guess it depends on what attack chain you are using, and what pylon DPS you are getting
  22. Granite Agent
    Did the Devs ever explain why they hard-coded a 999,999,999 inf cap for trades??
  23. Granite Agent
    Great analysis. I'm having the same questions -- not sure what to alpha slot. Here's my current build.

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|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
  24. Granite Agent
    First pylon test was about 193 dps with this chain: Gloom - Incin - Crem - FS. Had some mis-clicks and what not. Might be able to hit 195.
  25. Granite Agent
    bought. thanks.