Frosticus
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Posts
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Joined
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http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=191965
take a look at this dude's bots/traps. Pretty impressive. That combo can also cake walk through most AV's and even solo GM's.
I think it gets my vote, but I've never really looked at thugs that closely. -
hmm No IO's.
I'd take weave and 2 slot combat jumping for defense. That + FFgen will put you at ~32% def. So 13% away from soft cap vs an even con. If both seekers hit even unenhanced you will be at the softcap. If you slot seekers and lead with tentacles you should be more or less softcapped vs +1's, maybe even +2's depending on whether both seekers hit, which if you are facing more than 5 or so enemies they probably won't. -
Quote:It wouldn't even do that as it doesn't boost -rech. It would make the immob last longer and would boost the movement slow portion. It would probably boost the -speed of caltrops along with their damage for the duration of pbu.Originally Posted by Adelie
Would power buildup be of any use to a trapper at all? Maybe for web grenade's -rech?
IMO the app of choice for defender traps is Dark.
Oppressive gloom stacks nicely with seekers aoe stun.
Your usually up close anyway deploying traps so soul drain and dark consumption can both be used to full effect, the latter if for some reason you have end issues on your trapper.
You even get a self rez if you want it cause I've heard mature traps can die, though I've yet to see it on my own traps corr heh. -
Quote:On the other hand, a purple insp goes a lot further in adding defense than a red insp does in adding aoe damage, especially if you don't have the attacks.Originally Posted by Machine_Man_X
From my experience on Shield scrapper, I'd recommend the more defensive build earlier.
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I feel like a power has to hit for a proc to do anything. So I'm not sure that slotting of fault would work very well in play.
And while I've never played /elec armor I have messed around with stone a bit and a fault spec build can easily stack the power and aoe stun bosses, while continually bouncing everything.
There is a reason that people have said that fault alone is > some secondaries.
Just a thought. -
This looks like a seriously tight build. Hope you don't mind but I'm going to save this one in the event I ever roll a bots/traps.
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FF proc works out to be about 20-30% recharge on my fissure spamming plant/kin. If you spam the hell out of fault it will probably work out similar for you.
IIRC it can suppress itself or something so I dunno if there is an optimal frequency to use it to get the benefit up higher (I've heard it is 5 sec on, 5 sec off), so I guess in theory it could get up to 50% recharge...maybe. I dunno.
Heck even if you only get 15% out of it over time that's as good as two lotg's and you should be able to get that much out of it. -
Quote:Now I'm more confused. If it is that good why would some builds not have it but advocate the importance of extra-extra hp (as in like hp is the most important goal). It would appear that in a matter of seconds the regen ontop of good hp would surpass any extra hp bonuses you might be able to fit in there.Originally Posted by ConFlict
It suppresses but not alot, and pain is one of the stoutest builds in the game. Damn near impossible to kill a good one solo.
Just doing some quick and dirty calculations, but a 1350 hp w/ soothing looks to be about as tough as a 1500hp w/o soothing in a matter of like 5 seconds of surviving and that's with me using soothing at 60% of power to simulate what I guess it would be after DR and suppression hits it.
If you have close to 1500hp AND soothing that is about the same as about 1700 hp (which you can't get) in a matter of seconds.
I don't know and that's why I'm asking, but I would have thought if surviving kb and incomming damage is the goal so that you can support better than soothing would seem pretty important. But the builds posted by Tox and Silit don't use it and they seem to be pretty up to speed.
I'm sure there is a reason for it, so any info is appreciated. Share your secretz! -
1. Yes
2. Yes, but it was poorly implemented and has been reduced to trivial levels where it may as well just be deleted. IMO it was poorly thought out as a pvp idea regardless of whether it was implemented under the "old" system or the "new" one.
3. Yes
4. Yes, already asked in 1.
5. A lot. Most people suggest anything beyond 40% global is wasteful w/ hasten. I'm not sure how heavily they have slotted their powers though. I haven't tested it on my own yet.
Not sure if I'm following your last question, but arena has options to disable many of the gameplay mechanics introduced in i13. If you really want you can even turn off DR, though it has a lot of drawbacks to doing so. It is however common to shut of heal decay and travel suppression in arena which can have a pretty large effect from what I've seen. -
/elec should have access to thunder-strike in SC with how the zones work now meaning you can probably ruin people as they have less protection/survivability at that level, but you now have all your damage that you previously didn't have access to.
The burst that /elec could throw out at that level would be unparalleled for doms. Most people should be susceptible to levitate at that level so you should be able to set up for TS easily enough.
Not that I support it, but fire/elec dom would be a fiteclubzor master in sc now with imps and TS available.
Can't go wrong with /fire though. I took my earth/fire dom for a quick RV spin the other day and it still does really solid damage. Not sure how I'd like it without blaze available, but blast+flares+incin is pretty solid damage too. -
Quote:Forcebolt should be 51.5kb 3 slotted, and 53.6 4 slotted. I posted 53.5kb w/ pvp IO's and 47.5 w/o (still good vs powerpush though).Originally Posted by Silit
47.5 isn't enough to take a well slotted forcebolt - you'd need somewhere around 56.
Set bonuses are important, but more important is functionality - You need to enhance your heals and buffs for range, and your travels should be well slotted so you can better evade/get to a team member who is being attacked.
Try to get around or above 1500 HP, at least mag 35 KB res, and make sure you have enough recharge to heal effectively through spikes.
I have no idea if people are using FF or energy blast/assault to set up spikes though, or if levitate is all you ever see, or if once levitate becomes obsolete if people will upgrade to FB or powerpush.
One thing I'm curious of though is I've seen a few builds with no soothing aura. I would have thought ~45hp/sec regen would be "important" for surivivability. I mean if you are attacked for 2 seconds that is like an extra 90 hp. If you are attacked for 5 seconds like and extra 225 hp. Like I said though I have no idea as I've been out of pvp for so long and that's why I'm now asking.
I'll ask the same question I posted when /pain was first added to the game. When you are in combat mode does your regen get cut off like happens to a regen scrapper making Soothing aura really only affective if you are out of combat which happens to be when you least need it?
I ask becaues ~45 hp/sec regen is about the same as nullify spam in terms of health and I figured adding the too together would make you pretty tough.
Anyway, thanks ahead of time.
Everything else you said makes a lot of sense. -
Ya I thought about mu aoe immob after I posted and pieced together that bots do tremendous kb and it would be essential pretty much every battle when you dont' want kb. I suppose you learned that some time ago hehe.
Ya pets still "show" they benefit from recharge, but they aren't supposed to anymore. I think they said they lack the tech to prevent it from being displayed, but it should be shut off.
(if it isn't, then awesome as I hate hate hate that mechanic).
A really easy way to test would be to get say a cold corruptor to cast some -rech on your Bot and see if it slows his attacks down to a crawl. Might be a bit more visible than timing whether he attacks faster and accounting for ai retardedness. If his attack rate can't be slowed, then it can't be sped up either.
Anyway, cool build man, it was awesome to watch. I do similar things with my fire/traps with rain of fire+aoes, but I can currently only handle +1/8, so I'd say it is pretty clear your toon is a lot tougher and from the looks of it you melt +2's faster than I can do +1's while being safer. I'd like to switch to mu mastery too for that toon, but currently need scorp shield's defense until I can dump some more IO's in. I also sort of need an aoe immob as they can sometimes get away from caltrops+rain of fire alone and webenvelope is the only targeted aoe one for corrs
. Makes me want a bots/traps though.
I'm also jealous of MM caltrops and being able to accept so many procs, corr version only takes 3.
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Quote:Well only one way to find out. I tested with unslotted arc fog (15% res), that should be close enough to WoP, which 2 slotted gives 16%.Originally Posted by macskull
Oh yeah, I wasn't taking DR into consideration. Base resists + slotted epic shield will get you to about 40% after DR kicks in (plus or minus a few percent based on AT). Given how DR works I'd expect base resists + WoP to be somewhere in the lower 30s after DR.
Free res = 28.6%
WoP = 35.x%
WoP+epic shield = 42.16%
DR res "cap" = ~48 (half tray of oranges ontop of everything already running). -
cool vid, you kill them so fast I wonder if just the hold from PT would keep them in the patch long enough. Though I can see the aoe immob being important for higher cons.
Impressive. I like how everything goes from full to dead in the blink of an eye once you set it up.
Your build is very effective, the only thing I'd change is pulling the FF proc out of assault bot and moving that slot to poison trap as the Lockdown proc.
Pets don't benefit from +rech anymore and the lockdown proc in PT is very good and would look awesome when paired with electric fences as it uses the telsa cage vfx.
nice work.
Edit: and would stack nicely with the hold proc in your aoe immob. -
If I were doing an earth/earth I'd go with something like this (see below). Earth assault has very anemic ranged damage so I'd just say F-it and play it as a pure melee damage toon, but control from range when necessary. If you start to slot IO's I'd remove salt crystals, but up until you have enough recharge to have one of - quake, VG, or stalagmites up all the time you might actually find good use for it.
Click this DataLink to open the build!
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Quote:I've taken my BS/shield up to 39 and took a dm/shield brute up to 35. I like the BS a lot more. The only thing I don't like is that shield charge causes redraw. Ya it only happens once every ~40 seconds for me, but I like to SC then whirling sword, so the redraw sticks out like a sore thumb in that scenario.Originally Posted by Call Me Awesome
I'm coming in late to this discussion, but for my money it's hard to beat the classic BS/Shield combo... mine's 50 and softcapped to all. I used Parry to make up the difference in Melee defense so I could cut down on the set bonuses I needed. That opened my build up so I could focus on other bonuses instead of melee defense.
That scrapper is by far the most effective scrapper I've played; it's far superior to my other two 50 scrappers, a BS/Regen and a Spine/Regen. Raw survivability actually rivals my tankers and the damage output is phenomenal. He's become my character of choice for anything challenging; thanks to AAO I can tank with him decently well, thanks to the defenses I can survive most anything I run across and thanks to the AOE and ST damage I can drop anything in my path.
Personally I can't play toons with no, or very minimal, aoe damage. Much like Windenergy21 Dark Melee always gets flat for me once my mitigation gets up to speed. I love it in the beginning because you are unstoppable with ToF and siphon life and even shadow maul feels decent when you have next to no recharge on a build. But once I get a toon up to the point it can survive I want AoE damage.
I look at it this way: IO's can increase survivability and damage a lot, they can make you survivable even when you had nothing to begin with, but they can't give you damage powers where none exist. -
Maniac Slammers live up to their name now, that's for sure.
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Ya I think I'd probably do a kat/elec myself for a scrapper and probably a elec/stone melee for tanks.
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Quote:You do whatever you like in pocket D and AE, I'm just glad the game caters to people of my mindset more than yours.Originally Posted by ChaosRed
I had assumed Frosticus was being sarcastic, stunning to me, that perhaps he was not.
I find Level 1, is often the most fun you can have in any game. Certainly, in old table tops, level 1 was the most "dangerous" and "exciting" adventures of all, because of the fragility of your character. Entire campaigns are sometimes sculpted keeping characters at level 1, because the mortality that is ever-present at that level.
My beef with *some* power gamers is their alleged love and claim of "skill", when in fact, they go out of their way to experience the safest and least-challenging content of all. In COH in particular, power-leveling is not only devoid of skill, it is devoid of risk or challenge. Making really, the whole thing just an exercise of "push button to make noise and character go whirrr", the kind of game an infant plays.
So as a result, power-leveling in a boss farm, in my mind, is therefore akin to this:
http://www.pixietoyhire.co.nz/images...exersaucer.jpg
Not that role players don't deserve their fair share of mockery - they do - all gaming culture does, but power gamers and PvP players are especially fun to mock, because they are so utterly convinced they have "mad skilz", when in fact, they are the exact lemmings gaming companies love to cultivate because they are so easily appeased with "phat lewt". Easy customers, easy revenue, so easily led down whatever garden path the gaming company wants them to wander...all for 15 dollars a month of course.
It's a riddle WOW figured out a long time ago, and now caters to the power-gaming lemming almost exclusively.
Role players, get stuck with games like (shudder) Eve Online. No fair!
Still, if you'd like me to mock role players with equal volume, I can gladly do so.
And while I don't play EVE I'm pretty sure a large portion of the population is very goal oriented and pulls up spreadsheets to tweak things to the infinite degree. Don't get me wrong I'm sure some of them are out there pretending they are part of the Romulan Empire...
Looks like he is roleplaying
Edit: in the pic you posted I'm more confident to say that child is roleplaying than powergaming. You can tell because powergaming is serious business, there is no place for smiling and having fun. -
Quote:Fair enough, it was actually just to reverse the comment ChaosRed made about a child being as capable of a power gamer as anyone. That said, I'm much more comfortable roleplaying with my 6 and 4yr old Nephews than I am with my Doctor...unless I'm playing doctorOriginally Posted by ZNRGY_XERONUS
I disagree with this statement because role play is in some part because it tries to lessen role play as child like. Role play is tied to creativity and creativity is not only "child-like" it is a fundamental characteristic throughout the life of a person. Role play or imagination is one of the cornerstones of thought in many disciplines: literature, art, business, medicine, science and technology. The same mechanisms used to create a RP arc is the same used to visual "role play" the design of a art, music, a structure or a scientific theory.
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Dark lends itself to filling the holes that shield has.
Elec lends itself to leveraging the strengths that shield has.
Both (and many other scrapper pairings) can be great/amazing if built for it, they just focus on doing things in a different way.
Basically, if I wanted to crush massive amounts of foes I'd strongly consider an elec/shield/blaze. The combo is the epitome of a walking nuke. A person can say all the aoe they need is sheildcharge, but come on... You lose out on some st damage, but fireblast is one of the higher dpa attacks scrappers can get (scrapper version of gloom for brutes basically).
If I wanted to be massively survivable, do huge st damage and the occassional big burst aoe I'd strongly consider a dark/shield. I'd add blaze, or dark app to improve on the sustained aoe output.
Elec/shield doesn't need to be as survivable as a dm/shield because it will clear spawns much much faster. If you were to say that DM can extend the survivability duration of shield then you'd say that elec reduces the duration that is necessary to accomplish the goal.
Anyway, different builds with a different purpose in mind. If someone asked me for a farming scrapper I'd never recommend dm/shield. If someone asked me for an AV killing scrapper I wouldn't recommend elec/shield. Though I wouldn't be surprised if either one could do the job to someones satisfaction. -
I'd roll with mind or grav if you want any ranged damage (don't take propel though) and I'd roll plant if you want to be a melee centric earth assault. Plant because seeds will bunch things tight enough to actually use fissure and mud.
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Quote:So you guys play with DR off then if you are talking about capping at 75%.Originally Posted by macskull
Free base resists + slotted WoP will get you to something around 55-57% resistance, which still leaves 20% to cover from other means. Mace would be a good choice for a /Pain but I think the reason many choose to go the Power Boost route is because in the zone environment, PB'd Share Pain is one of the only effective heals once heal decay's really started to kick in.
I though the usual set up was
Travel Suppression: off
Heal Decay: off
DR: on -
Quote:No, "levels" are only attainable through mob defeats. "levels" allow you to unlock powers which help you traverse more areas of the game, which in turn helps you obtain badges, accolades, achievements, etc.Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
You make the incorrect assumption that "levels" equal "progress" or "winning". Since there is no winning, farmers are no better (or worse) at the game than anyone else. You win by enjoying yourself. If you get that enjoyment from farming, or RPing, or Task Forces, or raids, or anything else in the game, you win just the same.
Whether AE sees more or less use for farming or RPing or anything else doesn't affect my enjoyment, as I can still use AE as I like it either way. I never teamed with random strangers anyway. Y'all are weird.
You really can't progress very far as a level 1 in any sense of the word. And in turn the amount of "enjoyment" one can have at level one through actual use of anything other than the chat/emotes is very limited compared to as you "level" up. -
How can you kill that which has no life?