EvilGeko

We've had appearance items as rewards for a long time now. We've had appearance items as ACTUAL LOOT for four years. I'm not sure why you believe we haven't.

Just because you were right doesn't mean you aren't a conspiracy theorist! It just means you're not a kook as well!

This MMO does it. I don't need to use that argument. You all have given NO reasons why every single costume piece needs to be available at level 1 other than, "I'll be mad if they don't."

They don't annoy me and I don't think you have any evidence that they annoy an especially large number of people. Better to just say they annoy you. I can't argue with that.

But whether they annoy you or not is wholly irrelevant. It's not a reason to give every costume piece away. There's plenty of precedent for having costume pieces unlocked in various ways. I personally, and I don't really expect or care whether you agree with me, believe that it's more fun when SOME costume pieces are gated. The majority shouldn't be and aren't.

As for when we'll get new pieces, we just got a costume pack that's available to all characters at level 1.

No they don't. Hyperbole doesn't serve your argument well.

I disagree. Visual cues can provide a very nice reward. The game isn't ALL about customization.

Champions takes customization to a ridiculous extreme; DCUO locks 90% of the costumes away. City of Heroes takes a nice middle ground. Allow folks access to a very broad range of costume pieces, but lock a small amount behind various unlock mechanisms like vet rewards; content; microtransactions.

You're acting as if there's no precedent for this. There is and has been since the day capes were added to the game.

lol...you're probably right.

Well, now that you mention it....

Seriously, it makes no sense for pieces that are supposed to graphically represent the splendor and power of the Incarnate be available to level 10s. Having certain auras and pieces available only to Incarnates would be great IMO and provide an immediate (but optional) way to show that a character has ascended.

Yes. Incarnate pieces should be restricted to Incarnate characters.

*runs*

Decent idea. I'm not sure the devs are really thinking that way, but not bad at all. However, since you asked.

Why?

I have taken a powers path all the way through. However, if you go to Paragon, Cole still tells you to bug off, even though you all were best buddies ten minutes ago.

Didn't go redside, but if it's any consolation it's makes even less sense when you go blueside.

There's a point to this. I preface with that because I don't want you to think I'm jerking your chain.

Let's say that the leadership of this rebellion had the following rules of engagement:

1) Don't target civilians;

2) Any member of the PPD, Seers, or IDF is not a civilian whether armed or not;

3) Any building, installation, or area is fair game for attack notwithstanding the presence of some civilians where: A) a substantial number of Praetorian troops or robots are stationed, B) they create weapons or other implements used to subjugate the population, C) torture prisoners or hold captives.

4) The elimination of extremely high value targets (i.e. Cole or a Praetor) justify targeting places where civilians are likely to be.

You joining up?

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The point of those questions is this: before you've seemed to argue that those who oppose Cole must be held to a standard that seems well beyond even what a real life military would hold itself to. War is nasty business and civil wars even more so. These conflicts almost always take place in areas where civilians are put in harms way. It seems unreasonable to suggest that Cole could be unseated without there being no harm or disruption to the civilian population of Praetoria.

We've talked about this before so I won't rehash it. I'll just say that while I don't think an armed insurrection is unwarranted, I can see why the leadership of the Resistance and some of their tactics put some people off. But let me ask, let's say there was a third faction that was trying to instigate a civil war, one where civilians would be killed, but not targeted. Would you join up with them?

I didn't see the Responsibility path that way. Certain arcs, absolutely. Let's go through them all:

Chief Interrogator Washington's Arc - I agree with you. This is a cop doing the best he can for the people.

Cleopatra - Same

Nova Morality Mission - Extrajudicial killings? You're starting down the dark path.

Kang - You're aiding and abetting slavery in the service of creating a thought police. At this point, the responsibility path lost me completely. Anyone who has anything to do with these monsters from this point onward is a villain in my book.

Parson - You're back to protecting the people.

Whitworth - You're supposed to be a cop not an executioner.

McKnight - This is more like spy work, which can get dirty, so I give the character a break here.

Imperial Morality - With someone this dangerous, I'll give the character a break and say that I can at least understand taking out Yin.

Ivy - This is fine, back to Police work

Mother - Working for this madwoman should drive any decent person to defect immediately. Even villains could have problems working for this psychic vampire. It's nice they give you the ability to let Vanessa go.

Keyes - This arc is OK, it fits exactly what you say.

Neutropolis Morality - The only legitimate choice IMO is to allow Kang to live. Even this guy who allowed his child to go into slavery has turned from Cole at this point. You are nothing more than a monster if you stay with the Loyalists by this point.

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That's how I feel. Certainly most of the Responsibility storyline is as you say, but as I said above, I think the devs made it just too obvious that Praetoria is evil. A good person needs to oppose that system, not try to work within it. Cleopatra is the kind of 'loyalist' I can support. Someone who facially works for the system, but is subverting it.

I'll disagree with you on that. IMO, being a despot is per se irrational. It rarely ends well even for the despot as several in the Middle East have found out recently.

I disagree. Chief Interrogator Washington, by his actions, presented you with the following choice:

1) Commit vigilante murder;

2) Defend a potential (as guilt has not been proven legally) criminal from an extrajudicial execution.

This exact choice is presented in hero tip missions where a Longbow Warden is attempting to kill Polar Shift. Washington should have worked within the system. He was the person who forced the choice onto you. Killing him is justifiable as an act in defense of others (if not defense of self.)

Why did YOU assume that I was talking about a RL police force? Chief Interrogator Washington is a cop. And your character is a cop (a conscripted member of the PPD's powers division.)

It's not a dumb question either, you stated support for the responsibility character committing a summary execution without trial. You deemed Cleopatra a 'traitor' which is a legal conclusion that at that point in the story had not been established in a legally cognizable way, even given Praetoria's limited freedoms.

You're not getting my point. Cole doesn't want your help. Once you get to a certain level of power, you are too dangerous to keep around. He barely has control of the Praetors as the high level hero arcs shows. He doesn't need another level 50 meta-human who may even pull power from the Well on his side. If you believe in Cole's ideals, then you can try to assume his mantle for yourself. But loyalty to him isn't welcome.

That's how I understand both the end of the Loyalist storyline (when you go to Primal Earth) as well as the rest of the story. I don't disagree with your desire, but I do disagree with your contention that the devs haven't sufficiently explained this in the story.

And Calvin Scott is a hero.

Didn't make an assumption, I asked a question.

Not sure why folks feel the need to flame others who disagree with them.

Oh, I get that. I play Loyalist characters too, but they are all villains. What I meant was that people try to play Loyalists characters like they are they are good people trying to 'work within the system.' I can't understand that because the game is throwing every hint it can at you that 'wherever you start' you're a villain if you stay down the Loyalist path.

I see now what you meant. My apologies.

Only despotic regimes allow any individual cop to be judge, jury and executioner. As Major Decoy stated, she's not a traitor, she's a citizen of Praetoria. A high-ranking citizen at that. Your Responsibility Loyalist took it upon themselves to kill her without giving her a chance to defend herself before the authorities. Your character rationalized this murder by stating that she would have used her connections to Praetor White to save herself.

Your comment that she isn't a citizen is really frightening. Do you believe that it is proper for a police officer to take the law into his or her own hands?

Well, there's the first morality mission at the end of that path. Summary executions without trial tend to fall into the bucket of "kill a citizen."

I had to cool down a bit before I responded to this. All I did was repeat what the story written by the devs. Why did you feel the need to say I was sounding "self-righteous and uptight?"

Right, but they aren't in opposition to each other. More on that in a moment.

Those other followers (the Praetors) are his closest confidants. They've been with him since the Hamidon wars or are his blood relatives. He trusts them implicitly. Responsibility Loyalists who amass too much power are a threat to his regime. I don't care how loyal you think you are, but despots do not want to keep around potential rivals.

The thing you keep waving away is that Cole is an evil man. He is a tyrant. He is not the savior of the world. You might want to RP that your character believes that he is, but the character's writers (the devs) have said over and over and over than he is not. His story is a lie. You cannot continue to grow in power and influence but still believe the lie. That's bad RP on your part. You're willingly ignoring the cues the game master is giving you.

The Responsibility Loyalists work for a despotic regime that tortures and kills its citizens. The whole point of that path is to show you that you're working for an illegitimate government. That you have chosen tyranny for the illusion of safety.

I've never understood this need that people feel on these boards to defend this path.