EvilGeko

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Let us go back and redo the arcs!!

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You'd think it'd be pretty simple to do too. Autoexmp the mission owner to the mission level, add a mission flashback option to all contacts that lets you continuously cycle through a contact's missions and voila. Flashback.

They should probably not give you temp power rewards because then you could like do the blackwand/wedding band/whatever missions over and over and never run out, but I think all other rewards would be pretty kosher.

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I agree, the temp powers should only be available once ala Safeguard/Mayhems.

Give us Flashback devs and make this the best Issue of all time!

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I've had some discussions with the team yesterday about what we could do instead, and still keep the flavor of the four pool system, because having the extra three pools allows us to not only reward risk/reward, but time/reward as well.

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Let us go back and redo the arcs!!

Forget Jack and his stupid ideas about whether or not all the content should be experienced by one lone character and let us go back with our level 50 Characters and redo the arcs that we missed as well as do the arcs over again.

Give us the damn content!

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Can good sense be repeated too often?

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Minus 1 billion coolness points for not calling the thread Drops II: Electric Boogaloo.

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I actually wanted to go with Drops II: Drops Harder

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Lame, what kind of nerds are you people:

Drops II: The Wrath of the Boards!!

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So, why not just add in a level 50 Arc that can be repeated as many times as you like.

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Or just remove the Story Arc pool from the last levels in exactly the same way as the Trial pool is removed from the first levels!

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That's still unacceptable. Some of the early sets that don't exist at the high levels have added effect enhancers (like KB protection) that high levels need.

To my mind there are only two acceptable solutions:

Distribute story arc recipes to the general loot tables (they can still drop from the story arcs)

OR

Flashback.

Flashback is the best solution. Content for all, drops for all. No more outleveling nonsense. PUGs will do fine because people stop worrying about outleveling their content.

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Inventions has been touted as something that shelved level 50's can partake in. Level 50's that have completed all their story arcs already. Please, how can both of those occur? Level 50's can not experience IO's if they are locked out of acheiving specific rewards because they happened to hit the level cap before I9.

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It's like I said, we are looking into other options that keeps the mechanic of the four pool system. Our intention is to not make people feel "gimped" for previously completing all their story arcs.

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FLASHBACK

FLASHBACK

FLASHBACK

FLASHBACK

FLASHBACK

It's not a difficult problem.

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Now I hear you guys... you all seem to dislike the Story Arc aspect of this system. I've had some discussions with the team yesterday about what we could do instead, and still keep the flavor of the four pool system, because having the extra three pools allows us to not only reward risk/reward, but time/reward as well. Takes longer to do a Task Force? Here's a nice bonus you can't get anywhere else. Finish the Respec trial, but already have all your Respecs? Here's a nice reward that carries with it some good inherent value.


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WHY STORY ARC EXCLUSIVES ARE BROKEN:

Because they are the ONLY thing you can't repeat. The only. Think about everything else on the list posted by Dr. Brainstorm:

TF - Any character 12+ can do Positron's TF (if a hero, obviously) ANY TIME THEY WANT.
Trials - Any one 24+ can do a respec trial ANY TIME THEY WANT.
Killing mobs of all levels - With exemplar you can do this ANY TIME YOU WANT.

You might need a team, that's OK. But story arcs can only be done once. Fix that or no recipes be available only from story arcs. All you're going to accomplish is creating:

ULTRA RARE LOOT

Which goes against everything you said you wanted to accomplish. It will make the game more hardcore than WoW or Everquest II.

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Please note, this is totally divorced from whether it's fair to people who've already done the story arcs. Even if the game launched with inventions, it would be wrong to gate loot to content that cannot be repeated.

Devs, this must change. Every single recipe and piece of loot must be available from content that's available to all characters. Otherwise, you're going to have a system where people monopolize the most rare loot and charge exorbitant prices for it.

Seriously, this is exactly what you don't want. The best solution is to allow use to flashback and do any content we want anytime we want. Stop gating content by level and stop locking story arcs. I would prefer this because it would allow my main to reexperience some of the great story arcs and changes made to the game.

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Now I hear you guys... you all seem to dislike the Story Arc aspect of this system. I've had some discussions with the team yesterday about what we could do instead, and still keep the flavor of the four pool system, because having the extra three pools allows us to not only reward risk/reward, but time/reward as well. Takes longer to do a Task Force? Here's a nice bonus you can't get anywhere else. Finish the Respec trial, but already have all your Respecs? Here's a nice reward that carries with it some good inherent value.


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WHY STORY ARC EXCLUSIVES ARE BROKEN:

Because they are the ONLY thing you can't repeat. The only. Think about everything else on the list posted by Dr. Brainstorm:

TF - Any character 12+ can do Positron's TF (if a hero, obviously) ANY TIME THEY WANT.
Trials - Any one 24+ can do a respec trial ANY TIME THEY WANT.
Killing mobs of all levels - With exemplar you can do this ANY TIME YOU WANT.

You might need a team, that's OK. But story arcs can only be done once. Fix that or no recipes be available only from story arcs. All you're going to accomplish is creating:

ULTRA RARE LOOT

Which goes against everything you said you wanted to accomplish. It will make the game more hardcore than WoW or Everquest II.

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I fought Snappy (finally) last night, and as I noted the futility of popping any small number of purples, something occurred to me--Based on both of your MoG experiences, I don't think that Snappy and his gang got the message about the I7 changes to Defense.

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The only problem with that is that I would have saw better performance on the before the Mob accuracy changes.

My MoG is slotted with two membranes (I have a lot of slack slots OK). So my total defense buff is 99.75. I was also chaining Parry which is three slotted for defense. Let's just use one buff that's 23.4% Total Defense buff 123.15.

Pre I7, even con Snappy's to-hit was 65%, so he'd be capped at 5% and get his 1.1 acc from his bow/knives for a total of 5.5%. +2 Snappy would have had the same chance to hit.

His final to-hit today was 5% * 1.4 = 7%. That's the even con. The +2 was at 8%. There were some bosses around maybe one or two and their final to-hit would have been similar.

Like I said in the OP, the I7 changes hurt MoG and this was a particularly good place to show it.

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Actually for this particular content. BS >> DM

Parry gives you a Defense buff to everything hitting you. DM is mostly single target and so the -to-hit only works on what you have your attention one. Additionally BS has better AoE.

My DM/EA had to use Lucks as well as sturdies, but Snappy was missing quite a bit because of ToF.

During the Winter event Snappy DM >> BS because of the damage type and the lesser number of mobs.

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I guess, EG, but against that many mobs, Soul Drain>>BuildUp and Shadow Maul becomes a mowing scythe...meanwhile, ToF neutralizes the EB long enough for you to dispatch his help.

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Shadow Maul's tiny cone just doesn't do it for me. When you hear the CRUNCH of Slice and the BOOM of Whirling sword connecting 13 times, you feel all tingly inside.

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I certainly can't dispute the coolness of or the tingly feelings brought on by swinging a Broadsword...I was just talking about winning the fight.

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BAH!!! What's the point of winning the fight if you don't get all tingly inside. What the hell kinda Scrapper are you!?!

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Actually for this particular content. BS >> DM

Parry gives you a Defense buff to everything hitting you. DM is mostly single target and so the -to-hit only works on what you have your attention one. Additionally BS has better AoE.

My DM/EA had to use Lucks as well as sturdies, but Snappy was missing quite a bit because of ToF.

During the Winter event Snappy DM >> BS because of the damage type and the lesser number of mobs.

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I guess, EG, but against that many mobs, Soul Drain>>BuildUp and Shadow Maul becomes a mowing scythe...meanwhile, ToF neutralizes the EB long enough for you to dispatch his help.

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Shadow Maul's tiny cone just doesn't do it for me. When you hear the CRUNCH of Slice and the BOOM of Whirling sword connecting 13 times, you feel all tingly inside.

FYI: Snaptooth is not an AV. He's an EB no matter what setting you put it on. I beat him on Invincible, just not in the "Moment of Glory".

Actually for this particular content. BS >> DM

Parry gives you a Defense buff to everything hitting you. DM is mostly single target and so the -to-hit only works on what you have your attention one. Additionally BS has better AoE.

My DM/EA had to use Lucks as well as sturdies, but Snappy was missing quite a bit because of ToF.

During the Winter event Snappy DM >> BS because of the damage type and the lesser number of mobs.

I'm in the same boat as Gangrel. I actually use MoG sometimes, like with Snappy when I know it's a gamble. I just wish the gamble would pay even money.

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Testing update.

Heroic spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in MoG in 50 sec.

Invincible spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in 13 sec.

That's all damage MoG is supposed to protect you from, folks. Same spawns with inspirations and or IH/DP led to victory.

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Worth noting: assuming you used dull pain inside of MoG (and I presume you would), the death in 13 seconds implies an eluded scrapper would have died in even less time, unless they immediately used respites. Even with fully slotted health, an SR scrapper would only recover about 130 health in 13 seconds at level 50. A MoGed scrapper with dull pain has the equivalent of 789 health more than a conventional SR scrapper.

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Going on with your next point, I used it against Snappy and his gang because I knew the accuracy was so high they probably would have been able to wear me down. But cripes 13 seconds? I was surprised how easy it was for them. But an SR would have had an advantage I lacked in MoG. Sturdies.

Elude + 5 Sturdies = Beatdown for Snappy.


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Snappy!

With all three Passives, five sturdies would help, but adding a couple or four reds would help more. If they ate through MoG that fast, Elude would be a complete nonfactor as well, unless you just click it for the endo recovery.

My memory must be fading...is this the same Snappy that I repeatedly beat down in the winter event, often using no inspirations at all? Even my gimp AR/Eng pounded that wuss.

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The difference was that was Snappy by himself and he is a wuss. The Valentine's day Snappy calls in his boys to help beat you down. They all have an accuracy bonus on their attacks. Having twelve Redcaps and an EB hitting on you wears you down quick.

With MoG, because you can't heal and can't really get benefit from any inspirations you're stuck.

With an SR with Sturdies, the defense + resistance would have give the SR breathing room to leisurely take Snappy down. That's how my DM/EA Brute did it and she didn't even have Overload yet.

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Testing update.

Heroic spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in MoG in 50 sec.

Invincible spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in 13 sec.

That's all damage MoG is supposed to protect you from, folks. Same spawns with inspirations and or IH/DP led to victory.

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Worth noting: assuming you used dull pain inside of MoG (and I presume you would), the death in 13 seconds implies an eluded scrapper would have died in even less time, unless they immediately used respites. Even with fully slotted health, an SR scrapper would only recover about 130 health in 13 seconds at level 50. A MoGed scrapper with dull pain has the equivalent of 789 health more than a conventional SR scrapper.

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Going on with your next point, I used it against Snappy and his gang because I knew the accuracy was so high they probably would have been able to wear me down. But cripes 13 seconds? I was surprised how easy it was for them. But an SR would have had an advantage I lacked in MoG. Sturdies.

Elude + 5 Sturdies = Beatdown for Snappy.

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I think actually that one thing you might be seeing here is accuracy cap-out. The combination of invincible, and AV accuracy, and archery accuracy, is applying so much accuracy to those foes that they might more than drive Regen to the ceiling. In effect, Regen outside of MoG doesn't get hurt proportionately as much as an Eluded or MoGed scrapper because the accuracy that is boosting Elude and MoG off the floor gets partially capitated by the tohit ceiling. Was Snaptooth even, or +2 in the invincible mission?

I haven't had a chance to try this out yet: it'll be interesting to see how Invuln, SR, Regen, and DA all work out.

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Snappy and his boys were 52.

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Testing update.

Heroic spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in MoG in 50 sec.

Invincible spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in 13 sec.

That's all damage MoG is supposed to protect you from, folks. Same spawns with inspirations and or IH/DP led to victory.

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This will probably be taken poorly, but from what minimal details I see in these results, I'm not surprised at the conclusion.

Let's throw some more details in there. While fighting this same AV spawn, IH and DP are trucking along just fine while you have inspirations to complement them. But you don't always have optimal inspirations and situations come up when nothing in your tray will help. The chips fail and your IH + DP are not keeping you out of the red; activating MoG just gave you 50 more seconds to try and finish off that AV.

Hitting MoG before a fight is silly. That's what the other tier 9's do. Regen gets the benefit of fighting the big battles to the brink of death and then using their tier 9's.

Also, I know this isn't a comparison thread, but... you said this was all damage that is defended against by MoG? No other tier 9 (in my experience) would have handled that any better. They all have a lower defense buff as well as a lower resistance buff, if any. Granted, they can still heal themselves if they have inspirations or healing powers within the set, but if they don't... they don't have another emergency button.

MoG is a true panic button. Not a "Oh, this fight looks like it will be tough" button, like the other tier 9's end up being. MoG can extend the fight - by 13 seconds, 50 seconds or by its full duration.

Also, I love the suggestion that MoG give a +recharge, also.

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I didn't use MoG before the battle. I used it at the time I would have went to the inspiration tray. I was at low health, recon was down, DP was up, IH was down (used it last battle). If I hadn't planned at stopped at the bartender for inspirations, I wouldn't have had any options.

So I hit MoG. MoG didn't allow me to finish the fight. For me, that's the rub. Even if I had killed snaptooth and died to his minions, at least the mission would have been done.

A power that just lets you get in a hit or two before dying is a crappy power. And this is further evidence for my theory. MoG's defenders use the power when you would easily survive out of MoG. It's the only thing that makes sense.

When do you use MoG? I've tried using it when people say use it and it fails. I'm not making this up. This power has no reasonable use I am able to ascertain.

Testing update.

Heroic spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in MoG in 50 sec.

Invincible spawn of Snaptooth AV and minions - Died in 13 sec.

That's all damage MoG is supposed to protect you from, folks. Same spawns with inspirations and or IH/DP led to victory.

Only thing that ticks me off is that I have to burn a respec on my brute to get some slots in.

Nice work Iakona!!

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I have a feeling Powers like Stretching, Climbing, Swinging, Shield throwing, Shapechanging will not likely ever be in CoX though they will probably be in the Marvel Universe MMO. I'm also pretty sure, that the Marvel Universe MMO will also have ponies and pie.

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And keeeeeeping in mind that this game is going to be on the console.

I mean come on. It's probably going to look good but it's on a console.

The game just ISN'T going to be as BIG as CoX. I don't think they'll get the cool character customization that we have because its ON A CONSOLE.

It's going to look pretty, like every game on the 360, but lack the depth just like the rest of the 360 games.

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I don't think there's any reason to believe that's true. Final Fantasy 11 gives you more customization options (less costume of course) than CoX. Just because it's on a console doesn't mean there's any reason to believe that it's going to sacrifice anything.

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I would also boost blaster fire consume, if simply because blaster /electric power sink also has a 60 second recharge timer. There is precedence that should this change happen, it should cover all versions of consume.

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What he said. I think though we should take Castle at his word and let inventions come out and then open the floodgates folks.

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Personally, I'm going to stand back and watch MUO for a while before I make any choices on it. I'm pretty wary of online games that have a big name attached to it. World of Warcraft and Final Fantasy XI are good examples.

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I'm hopeful that Cryptic will give preferential beta access to CoH players. It seems likely, so perhaps we'll all get to see what its like in MUO Beta.

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That would be freaking sweeeeeeeeeeet. I am so hopeful and excited about MUO. The devs have shown us how much they have learned with things like the new Faultline and how powers are slowly being better balanced.

I don't get all the fear-mongering that CoX is doomed. That's not liable to happen. Sure, I doubt there will be as many of us, but doomed? Pfff. Then Ultima Online, Everquest 1, and all those other ancient games never should have lasted as long as they did/have/are. Actually, it seems once an MMO has really established itself and settled in, like CoX has, it just doesn't one day on the way to the proverbial fridge have a heart attack and die.

=. .=

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Its not so much that CoH is doomed. I don't think that, and I don't think its a useful discussion really. That said, the article gives a heavy impression that Cryptic's energy and innovation will be directed primarily to the new game. And given the recent history of six month waits between updates to CoX, it makes me wonder how much respect Cryptic is giving the the game that made them what they are today.

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I thought it had more to do with the 40 hour work week and 1 1/2 hour lunchtime Warhammer sessions. Lazy nerds need to get to work!!

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This game is gonna bite it the minute MUO is determined to be a success (if it is a success) ... If MUO flops, the CoH/V will still survive.


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I'll be cancelling my CoX account if MUO is any good. I can say that with 100% certainty.

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Ditto. There's no question in my mind. But the devs had better well had learned their lessons well from CoX. If I see something like ED again, I'll be happy to go into the arms of SOE. (No I didn't play SWG, nor do I care about NGE).

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Hey dude, people make mistakes and do things developers didn't intend. Can people ( in general, not you ) please get over the ED thing? It's been over a year already. Sheesh.

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Not likely. Changes like ED make you feel like you're in a beta test. And the fallout from that change is still around. I don't want to derail the thread, but I'm not willing to accept a change of that magnitude again from Cryptic. It's not even specifically about ED, it's about changes like ED.

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This game is gonna bite it the minute MUO is determined to be a success (if it is a success) ... If MUO flops, the CoH/V will still survive.


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I'll be cancelling my CoX account if MUO is any good. I can say that with 100% certainty.

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Ditto. There's no question in my mind. But the devs had better well had learned their lessons well from CoX. If I see something like ED again, I'll be happy to go into the arms of SOE. (No I didn't play SWG, nor do I care about NGE).

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Can we fix Consume now that we're normalizing timers?

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There will be NO CHANGES to Consume at this time. Why? There are some essential datapoints I need to confirm which I have not had the opportunity to do yet. I *should* get my hands on the raw data after the Invention system hits.

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Thanks for the reply. I really don't understand why one endurance drain has to have 3x the recharge of every single other endurance drain that exist in armor sets, but I'm willing to be patient until after Inventions come out.