Caulderone
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:Yeah, I know better than to jump ship too early. The increased Proc damage from Lightning Field (assuming the period is 10 and not 2) may make up for it, along with some tweaking.Originally Posted by UberGuy
Well, I'd advise at least waiting to see how it plays out in the end. Your total lost DPS, expressed as a percentage of your total, may not be that bad that it is worth abandoning your concept.
edit: LF looks to gain only 2-3dps if my AoE modifier guesstimate is close. blah
edit2: Now, I seriously wish I hadn't used (wasted) all those enhancement boosters on him.
As an aside...
Proc-Brawl is officially dead. -
Quote:I understand the oddness you perceive. I built the character into it's theme, and then eked every ounce of performance I could out of it. So, the theme came first, then I maxed it out.Originally Posted by UberGuy
I have to say that this statement confuses the tar out of me. Why are you agonizing over a change like this in a concept/theme build? Maybe it's just me, but that brings to mind the whole "casually purpled Warshade" shtick.
I'm seriously not trying to make light of the unpleasantness that comes having something you've worked at building be changed downward in effectiveness, but I have a really hard time reconciling that feeling with concerns that you need to abandon a concept/theme character in order to go with a min/max one.
It still falls well short, damage-wise, of what the powerset is capable of. And, now, it will fall further or abandon theme. -
Quote:So, those who use Shadow Punch, Scorch, or pretty much any other tier one attack will be penalized.Originally Posted by Synapse
So, you're going to see an increase in performance against the current IO version of Hecatomb and Apocalypse in this particular instance. There are quite a few instances where your powers will have a greater chance to proc than they currently do with IOs. So, some people are calling this a "nerf" but in actuality there's also a good amount of buffing going on here too.
Regards,
Synapse
I new I took a damage hit using Dark Melee and not going for the uber chain (Sm-MG-Sm-SL). Guess I need to consider scrapping my concept/theme build and joining the min-max crowd.
Except, that I hate the animations for SL and MG. My main character will have to see a massive revision in his attack chain Look-and-Feel in order to get his damage level back near acceptable (he was already well below min-max levels - WooHoo 130-140dps pylon time w/ tier 3 interface proc).
Tankers, who use their tier 1 attacks for bruising, won't be able to shore up the pitiful damage they do with procs. I'll be interested to see some math on that. Blaster tier 1 attacks don't come out much better, if any.
Guess I need to join the people who ignore or skip tier 1 powers now. Too bad most of my favorite attack animations are in that category.
I ... am not in a happy place now. -
Quote:Hrm, good question. The Aura itself pulses every 2 seconds, but the proc only checks every 10.Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
Isn't the Period for pulse & aura powers 10 seconds, to match when it actually runs the checks?
If the PPM uses the 10 second period, damage auras will actually get a big increase in proc chance. -
Quote:Doh! You are right!Originally Posted by Draeth Darkstar
The Hecatomb PPM is currently 4.5, not 6, so you're going to lose more than that. Assuming a 25% increase it will only be 5.625.
And, my poor Lightning Field will be even WORSE off.
5.625 * 2 (act.period) / (60 + AoE Factor)
Even with an AoE factor of zero (which isn't right), that's going from 33% chance to proc (Armaggedon proc) to 18.75% chance.
Gah! Minimum Proc Floor please!
All damage auras will see HUGE proc chance/proc damage decreases from this.
Edit: My poor SP will go from 33% down to ~13.3% proc rate, almost a 20% reduction. That takes the average damage from procs from ~35 to ~14.2. Not cool!
Edit2: Non-purple proc rate in fast activating/recharging powers (especially near 100% recharge enhancement) and in Damage Auras becomes absolutely worthless. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Synapse
There will be cases where your performance will decrease. That is by design. Speaking of which, it was never the DESIGNED intent to have SBEs consistently grant a superior benefit than their IO counterpart. However, there are instances where this has occurred. Again, my goal here is to create balance and address some issues with IO procs and Attuned procs.
Also, this PPM change will have no affect on Interface Incarnate powers.
I'm using the normal Hecatomb proc, not the SBE. The new formula penalizes my Shadow Punch less than the original posted one. But, I"ll still lose ~3.7% proc chance (33% down to ~29.3%; assuming 25% PPM increase from 6 to 7.5).
I can't say I appreciate the idea of being nerfed ANY to fix the broken PPM SBEs that you introduced that I'm not even using.
However, this is far nicer cut on my proc chance than the original formula was going to be. So, there is that.
I still advocate a Floor proc chance at the existing rate. No nerfs for anybody, and some long recharge powers get a more proportionate increase from procs. -
Quote:Originally Posted by UberGuy
Please consider this in the new design - clicks and auto/toggle powers may need different behavior. Otherwise, you're going to have a terrible time balancing things like the Ragnarok damage proc between slotting in click attacks or in something like a damage aura.
Oh yeah, in addition to my post above, this too! -
Quote:Originally Posted by Synapse
3) Procs Per Minute will use modified recharge instead of base recharge. The reason for this is that the whole idea of Procs Per Minute goes right out the window when we keep the base recharge even though that value can be dramatically altered.
I agree with these changes in principle. Leveling the playing field with SBEs makes sense.
However, this worries me a small bit. My main uses Dark Melee. Shadow Punch is slotted with Hecatomb Proc (normal, not SB). I have SP down around 1.08 seconds recharge time currently (from base 3).
SP is literally every other attack for me, and Heca's Proc makes for some excellent damage add here.
The possibility of a massive nerf to this functionality is a very real worry for me. This is a concept/theme build I am very happy with (my main) and having his damage gutted would not make me happy.
(PS. He's a Tank, so it isn't like he's doing uber pylon-soloing damage as is.)
In addition to the 90% chance Cap, there should also be a minimum chance Floor at the existing proc rate. -
Another oddity:
Accolades, when selected, are overlaying/overwriting Brawl in the lower section. -
Quote:In addition, Musculature still boosts the Damage Resistance value granted bye the Tanker ATE proc.Originally Posted by Auroxis
- Musculature and Intuition increase global damage as well as modifying enhancement bonuses, causing double damage benefits.
Anyway, Thanks for the Update! -
Or, even better, per the post yesterday (scooped?):
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=288182 -
Quote:Originally Posted by Bosstone
I haven't played Beam Rifle seriously yet, so I'm not familiar with the animations, but that looks more like a sword stance than a gun stance.
Either way, new weapon models of any kind are always awesome.Quote:Originally Posted by MajorDecoy
I'm positive it's not Beam Rifle because his right hand is empty, and even if the image is reflected, it's not being held the way a Beam Rifle would be.
I'm nearly positive it's a Katana.
On further exam, I agree that can't be Beam Rifle. It just looked like a beam/ray coming out.
There is a hard to make out hilt/guard section, I think. It's too big to be a Katana, imo. Methinks it's a Titan Weapon laser/beam blade thingy. They did mention new weapons for the set, so that has to be new for the pic. -
Quote:I'm pretty sure that's Beam Rifle.Originally Posted by Bosstone
omg squee
omg third pic is that a titan weapon squeeee -
One of the Knives of Vengeance bosses has a nasty little buff called Rallying Cry:
http://tomax.cohtitan.com/data/power...S.Rallying_Cry
That looks to be about +20% To-Hit in a 30foot AoE. That can cause some issues on occasion for Defense sets.
It could be worse, it could be the buff the Awakened get (+40% To-Hit) that I talked about here: http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=278684 -
My suggestions:
Alpha - Musculature Radial (damage, endmod, run spd)
Judgement - Void Radial (-50% dmg debuff) [dmg boosted by musculature]
Destiny - two choices:
A - Ageless Radial (end refill, minor recharge buff, nice debuff protection)
B - Rebirth Radial (moderate heal, massive +regen)
Interface - 75% chance of damage proc, any style but Cognitive -
Quote:Looks good to me. As you noted, Health would give a slightly bigger gain for that Heal slot in PP. But, it's a very minor difference.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
And that's pretty much the extent of it. I moved some slots around here and there, but the numbers are pretty much the same and the build is about the same as it was when suggested. Let me know if I've made some horrible error.
Since you went with the Stalker ATE set, I feel compelled to warn you about converting them with Enhancement Catalysts. DO NOT CONVERT THEM PIECEMEAL. As you do DA content, if you end up with 6 Catalysts, convert the whole set at once. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I considered just dropping a slot (probably the Proc, since that looks like it's the most expensive) and putting something else in there. However, Mids' says the defence bonus which is the entire point I'm even messing with Mako's Bite to begin with comes from having all six enhancements, so that doesn't look like it's an option. If it weren't for that defence buff, I'd stuff a Crushing Impact in there and walk away smiling.
Of course, it's always possible I'm wrong or I saw wrong or I interpreted wrong, so feel free to correct me.
You aren't wrong. The Mako's defense bonus is for slot 6. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Bosstone
But there's more: Mako's Bite also includes a 3% damage buff as part of the set bonus. That means that the drop in damage from CI to MB isn't 7.83% but 4.83%, and also buffs the damage of those attacks for which you aren't compromising damage enhancement (IOW, the attacks with CI will effectively be 104.47% instead of 101.47%, or more if you slot additional MBs). That's going to make your high-damage attacks hit much harder.
Also, since there will be TWO attacks with Mako's, you get +6% damage (+3% times 2). So, it's really only 1.83% less damage each for those two attacks. And, the two attacks left with CI will actually go from 101.47% up to 107.47%. Not too mention that SS and OTC both get +6% damage, too. -
Quote:Uberguy and others have already mostly covered this, but I'll chime in, too.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Do you think you can break that down for me? I can see the totals for defence, and they come up remarkably even for melee, range and AoE, but how did you manage that? I tried tracing set bonuses in Mids', but that won't tell me where they're from. I really am not comfortable with the Makos, but if the result is like what you're showing me, I might be convinced to try to get them. I'm sitting on 30-something converters, per chance those can help. I just need to know where the defences are coming from, because the result is actually pretty appealing to me.
Also: Why is Web Grenade 6-slotted and why is Combat Jumping 3-slotted for defence? I can't imagine that third slot is doing anything meaningful.
I just stuck the 3rd slot in Hide and CJ because I couldn't think of anything else that would keep it simple. You could easily switch the 3rd Defense IO in CJ to a Jump IO if you like.
You could move the 3rd slot in Hide to Elude for recharge, too, if you like. Neither change will be all that huge for your total defense. The final defense values will still be way better than your current build.
Breakdowns:
6-slotted Makos = 3.75% Ranged Defense
6-slotted Multistrike = 1.88% AoE Defense, 1.88% Melee Defense
6-slotted Enfeebled Operation = 4.38% Melee Defense
(btw, this set is yellow/uncommon and VERY cheap and also has a small global recharge bonus)
If you decide to keep the Makos, and want to do the ATO set, put the ATO set in AS and replace one set of CI in whichever attack you please (makes no difference) with a Mako set. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Finally, I'm down to the actual, practical, final question about build in general. If you've seen me post recently, you've probably seen me mention "Kim," my Stalker. I even wrote a story about her. She's a favourite character of mine, she's currently level 49, and she's running about 35% defence against everything. I'm well aware that this is insufficient for Dark Astoria, so I want to know if there's anything I can do about it without reshuffling her build too badly (i.e. without having to take all of Fighting). Specifically, I want to know if it's possible that Enhancement Converters can help me in doing this.
As before, I'd like to stick to level 50 Uncommon Inventions, which means Crushing Impact for single-target attacks, Multi-Strike for the couple of cones and probably a bunch of Red Fortunes for the defences, in case it's not better to just leave them with Commons. I'm also interested to know if the passives and the toggles really benefit from those third defence slots, though I wouldn't want to lose any defence in the process, even a single percent since I have precious little as it is.
The build I have right now isn't great, and it's still all commons, but as before, I'm not looking for perfection. More than anything else, I'm looking for a build that I can be comfortable with making, and a way of making that build that I can feel comfortable repeating for the next level 50 character I make. Apparently, uniqueness of character build doesn't interest me all that much. So long as it works and it's not a pain in the *** to make, I'm happy. Well, and so long as it fits the concept.
Speaking of which, why Challenge on a Stalker? Oh, right, you can't see it. Well, the Mids' build is at the bottom of the post, and it contains Challenge as Kim's level 49 power. Well, it's a power I didn't need to slot, and it fit her cheeky, provocative nature. It was either that or Shuriken, but I couldn't spare five slots for it since I wanted more recharge in Elude. If I can spare the slots and take Shuriken instead without compromising my defences, I probably will, but for the moment, Challenge is not a terribly important power.
Try this as a place to start. I stuck to Crushing Impact, Makos, Multistrike, Thunderstrike, and Enfeebled Operation (immobilize). I put in the Shuriken and got it +3 slots and it has good enhancement value. All 3 defenses (melee, range, aoe) are much improved.
edit: If you aren't comfortable with the Makos, Crushing Impacts will work in their place, but the Ranged defense will suffer some.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.954
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Kim Navar: Level 50 Technology Stalker
Primary Power Set: Dual Blades
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Weapon Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Power Slice -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(3), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(3), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(5), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 1: Hide -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(21), DefBuff-I(48)
Level 2: Ablating Strike -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(7), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(7), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(27)
Level 4: Nimble Slash -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(11), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(11), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(13), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(13), Mako-Dam%(37)
Level 6: Assassin's Blades -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(15), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(15), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(17), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17), Mako-Dam%(39)
Level 8: Focused Fighting -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), DefBuff-I(19), DefBuff-I(19)
Level 10: Focused Senses -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), DefBuff-I(21), DefBuff-I(23)
Level 12: Build Up -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(25)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(23), DefBuff-I(42)
Level 16: Practiced Brawler -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(25), EndRdx-I(46)
Level 18: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A)
Level 20: Placate -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(27)
Level 22: Vengeful Slice -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(29), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(29), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(31), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 24: Dodge -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(39), DefBuff-I(48)
Level 26: Sweeping Strike -- M'Strk-Acc/Dmg(A), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx(31), M'Strk-Dmg/Rchg(33), M'Strk-Acc/EndRdx(33), M'Strk-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(33), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 28: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 30: Agile -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(39), DefBuff-I(42)
Level 32: One Thousand Cuts -- M'Strk-Acc/Dmg(A), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx(34), M'Strk-Dmg/Rchg(34), M'Strk-Acc/EndRdx(34), M'Strk-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(36), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 35: Evasion -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), DefBuff-I(36), DefBuff-I(36)
Level 38: Elude -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(40)
Level 41: Physical Perfection -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(42)
Level 44: Web Grenade -- Enf'dOp-Acc/Rchg(A), Enf'dOp-EndRdx/Immob(45), Enf'dOp-Acc/EndRdx(45), Enf'dOp-Immob/Rng(45), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob/Rchg(46), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob(46)
Level 47: Targeting Drone -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(48)
Level 49: Shuriken -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(50), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(50), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(50)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Heal-I(A), Heal-I(43)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(37), EndMod-I(37)
Level 1: Assassination
Level 4: Ninja Run
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The "damage shield" absorb proc looks kinda interesting, but the other set bonuses don't do much for me.
I might try to fit the proc in, but I'd probably have to give up a damage proc, and I'm not sure that's worth my while since my survivability is huge already. -
If you depend on Defensive Sweep for Melee defense (one stack), you could tweak that some. Using what you had, here is an example so you have some alternatives to consider.
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General advice would tend to say ~32.5% is the target when going for positional defense. This puts you one small purple away from softcap.
I have been very happy with 20%+ to every vector on my Elec/DM. That puts me one medium purple from softcap to every defensible attack. Medium purples tend to be very cheap on the market, so I buy them up and store them in my base (140+ stored).
Resistance-wise, slot all your toggles up to ED-cap and try to fit in an ATO resistance proc (fairly cheap on the market now). If you feel like spending a chunk more, the +3% resist PVP IO has come down a ton, but is still fairly pricey. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Justaris
The real reason I went with Ageless Radial tier 4 is because of the debuff resistance. Of course, as a resistance-based set with Defense from Inventions, you have no Defense Debuff Resistance... well, now you do.
I agree. Most folks massively undervalue this. I talked my friend into taking it on his /WP brute, and he raves about it now.
It helps versus quite a few other debuffs too. -
A small oddity I noticed today...
I have the Tanker ATO proc slotted in Smite. The resistance bonus is being enhanced by the Musculature Alpha for some reason.