BrandX

Originally Posted by Heavensrun

Anyway, I might as well throw my 2 cents in here.

Suggesting that the devs would kill anyone off "out of spite" is kind of simplistic and ridiculous. This is a company we're talking about, run by people who have bills to pay and dreams for the future. They have obligations to investors, and decisions are made by getting groups of the head poo-bahs together to have discussions to work out a plan of action to decide on a modus operandi to blah blah blah. Decisions do not get made for simple, selfish reasons, and they certainly aren't made out of animosity for the player base that ultimately pays the dev's salaries.

But for the sake of argument, let's suppose, for a moment, that the devs -did- decide to kill off the characters they chose because they were Jack Emmert's characters.

Spite is not the only possible factor in that.

There is something legitimate to be said about taking the reigns of a world like this and making it your own, turning things to focus on characters -you've- created, that you understand, and that you, ultimately, control the destinies of. And there are also good reasons to clear the "old guard" out of the story if you want to do that.

Killing a character off is not always an act of disdain, either. These AREN'T REAL PEOPLE, and acts committed against them don't necessarily carry the same emotional motives that acts against real people would carry. Many, -many- writers like to kill off their -favorite- characters, because their goal is to invoke an emotional response, or to convey to the reader that bad things can happen to good people. It's entirely possible that Psyche and Statesman were killed off because the person writing the story thought they were cool, and iconic, and that their deaths would have an impact. And this thread, in point of fact, seems to suggest that they succeeded. To assume that they were killed off out of spite first assumes that killing a character off is a spiteful act.

It also means assuming that Jack would care if his characters got killed off. Jack -is- gone from this game. He -did- basically abandon it to chase what he seemed to think were more lucrative opportunities, and he cannibalized this game in the time he was here in order to chase those opportunities. I do think there's legitimate reasons to resent him, and I can even see how those could spin out into reasons to want to excise his influence from the game. But the thing is, they're not -doing- that. Hell, they're not even digging them out from the game to the extent that they replaced the column with the council, (an act which had plenty of conspiracy theories of its own at the time). And even if they were, there's no reason to just -assume- that he would care, or that they would think he would care.

As for the deaths themselves, Statesman's death sequence made me care more about the character than several years worth of in game content ever did. It certainly painted him as more sympathetic than the comics did. Psyche's death actually gave a noble, selfless end to a character who had had more than her share of selfish, bickery little moments in the various media that have given us glimpses into her personality. And, on top of that, it was shocking. I honestly suspect the biggest reason so many people were upset about Psyche dying was because it caught them flatfooted. "Who will Die?!?" "Statesman." "Oh, okay." "And Sister Psyche" "I-wait, what? How did? When did?"

Some people do -not- like those kinds of surprises. Some of us do. (In fact, some of us were really annoyed at the spoilery promotional material that basically broadcasted the deaths of the other past and present Phalanxers in the arc. I got a much bigger emotional charge out of the deaths of Malaise and Psyche specifically because I didn't really expect them)

As a random aside, has anybody noticed that Manticore has a tendency to shoot his friends and loved ones dead through the chest with an arrow? I mean, okay, Statesman got better, but still. This is a worrisome trend, Justin. ;p


Anyway, Did they "need" to kill the characters off, as some people have suggested? Well, a good writer doesn't -need- to do any one thing, he just tries to take the story somewhere that will entrance the readers. Did they succeed at that? I'm sure it depends who you ask. I have my issues with the arcs, but it -did- deliver some surprises and some shocking twists to me, and so I can't complain about that. But just because they didn't -need- to kill them off doesn't mean they didn't have good reasons, and what constitutes a "good reason" is largely subjective. But I think it's silly to suggest that a company with a vested interest in trying to entertain their player base enough to continue gathering money from them would do something as silly as throw their intellectual property to the wolves just to spite someone who isn't even around the office anymore.

Originally Posted by RiverOcean

I'm playing a DB/ELEC stalkers (concept reasons) and I'm pleasantly surprised. I lucked into 4-pieces of the Stalker ATO set, including the hide proc. I slotted them in my assassins strike. The hide goes off enough to grant regular critical strikes.

My new stalker is only level 18, but things I've noticed.
- Seems much more durable than past Stalkers I've played.
- Dishes out a lot more damage than I'd expected.
- The Hide proc is probably the best paired +proc among the various ATO sets. It very much fits the play-style of the set.
- For the first time, I've skipped placate. I might pick it up later, but I didn't feel forced to take it.

Scrappers and Stalkers seem very much evenly matched now. At least in terms of PvE, I don't PvP much so I can't speak to that area of the game. I've played the game for a while, and this seems to be a very well-thought out AT revamp. On par with the Dominator revamp a few issues back.

Originally Posted by Kangstor

Fine than stay away from my easy to play and fun scrappers will you? I don't understand this whining anyway. If you want something unique than there is 3 other melee focused AT to play. Do you want more survivalbility and team focus? Go play a tanker. Do you want more AoE? Go play a brute. Do you want more ST damage? Go play a stalker and LEAVE MY DAMN SCRAPPER ALONE PLEASE.

Originally Posted by EricHough

I am not even sure they need to do that - have you looked at the set bonuses for the taunt sets? Mocking beratement gives you 2.5% S/L def, 3.13 F/C def and 7.5% global recharge. Perfect Zinger gives 10% regen, 5% recharge, 2.5% damage and 3.13% S/L def. Those are awesome set bonuses for some of the cheapest sets in the game - there are tons on the market and almost no one buys them, so you can get the pretty easily.

Still, it costs 1 power selection for a power that has limited use and you generally have to want S/L def or the slots aren't worth it

Originally Posted by firespray

Other than the self heal, isn't this basically willpower?

Originally Posted by Siolfir

There were several reasons that EM used to be the answer for the "go-to" Stalker primary, and they're all made moot and EM is, if not the worst Stalker primary, really close to the bottom.

EM has a reduced damage critical on Total Focus, but TF still hits for scale 3.56 and Energy Transfer hit for scale 4.56. The hardest-hitting attack in each primary was limited to scale 4.56 on a critical, which ET hit every. Single. Activation. And it did so in a one second animation, which you could tag onto a hidden Assassin Strike and/or follow with a Total Focus without locking yourself down.

Stalkers only received criticals on held or sleeping targets when you were not hidden and had a lower damage modifier on top of that, so having powers that hit that hard outside of hidden status was essential for keeping up. EM had the distinction of being the only set that really let you do that.

Since then, Dark Melee received buffs with Siphon Life being turned into an actual attack (and thus following the dam/end/rech formula, look at the Warshade version for a comparison) and Midnight Grasp having more damage front-loaded with faster DoT and allowed to critical for full value (scale 5.62) rather than arbitrarily capped to 4.56, being the first Stalker power other than Assassin's Strike allowed to critical for more than Energy Transfer's base damage.

Electric Melee was ported with exotic damage type and good AoE damage. Kinetic Melee was created, also with exotic damage and a decent AoE that's still bugged to a 100% critical rate from hidden status. Martial Arts had several powers altered allowing you to fill an attack chain with powers that are all equal or better than Total Focus for DPA, giving it much higher potential and every power has a full critical. Street Justice allows you to hit harder than Assassin's Strike on a level 3 Crushing Uppercut (Shin Shouryuken?) critical, and the new Stalker hide proc and unhidden Assassin's Strike allows you to do this every 10 seconds.

And now with i22 every Stalker primary gets a scale 2.76 attack with a 0.67-1.67 second animation time that is incredibly easy to get a 67% or 100% chance for a full damage critical which surpasses Energy Transfer's old DPA.

You also now have a base 10% critical outside of hidden status which increases on your team size, so the reduced critical on Total Focus hurts; on even small teams Energy Punch surpasses its DPA. Energy Transfer is still a good DPA attack but loses the edge as your critical rate increases because other sets close the gap because ET's only critical effect is that it doesn't hurt you to use it.

And that's just going into the single-target nature. The other huge change is the difficulty slider, allowing you to easily add more mobs to fight to maximize your use of AoEs. When your highest difficulty was essentially "+2/x1" at the time, and AoE sets went to "+1/x2", fast single-target damage could keep up with AoE damage when solo or on small teams. It doesn't anymore.

On top of that, Stalker EM has reduced stun chances compared to the Tanker and Brute (or even Blaster) versions of Energy Punch, Bone Smasher, and Energy Transfer. It's hard enough to find a reason to recommend a less-nerfed version (Tanker or Brute). There's simply no reason to recommend EM on a Stalker because every set does what it used to do, better than it used to do it, and all but one are not as limited in AoE while doing so.

Originally Posted by Reppu

Perhaps Psychic Shockwave IS good (and it is!), but we all know the MAIN draw is most definitely the sheer power of Drain Psyche compared to every other power the other secondaries, and Mental, offers. ;P



I am not 'thin skinned' so much as to not be able to take jabbing, I simply just have zero tolerance for it. The difference is that; zero tolerance versus not being able to take it. If I want to improve as a person, I have to stand against what others scorned me for. If we can't be professional in a discussion like this, then what's the point?

Regardless, acknowledged. Apologies for assuming you were being a derp.

Originally Posted by Reppu

Perhaps Psychic Shockwave IS good (and it is!), but we all know the MAIN draw is most definitely the sheer power of Drain Psyche compared to every other power the other secondaries, and Mental, offers. ;P



I am not 'thin skinned' so much as to not be able to take jabbing, I simply just have zero tolerance for it. The difference is that; zero tolerance versus not being able to take it. If I want to improve as a person, I have to stand against what others scorned me for. If we can't be professional in a discussion like this, then what's the point?

Regardless, acknowledged. Apologies for assuming you were being a derp.

Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel

So randomly: gathering up some interesting points some folks have made, I'm starting to think that it wasn't a question of "why Kill States and Psyche" but rather "why not?" if we are to assume just about ALL guesses are actually right.

-States and Psyche had become honestly stagnant characters, and while good writing could have saved them it wouldn't have also opened up a lot of development for EVERYONE ELSE if they died.

-Statesman and Psyche were not just among the best of the old vanguard, but were literally some of the oldest known heroes alive. (Dream Doctor, Dark Watcher, and Lady Grey as well) killing them was sort of, since they could not die naturally, probably meant to be like watching your grandfather or mother pass away and show you the old world is rapidly fading (For the times, they are a'changin'~!)

-They likely wanted someone to die who would have impact on the players, going completely opposite of the wishes of the playerbase to achieve maximum shock.

-The heroside signature roster has more than 20, well known, signature heroes who regularly show up in the lore and writing, many have redundant roles, powers, ATs (like the FP being bloated with defenders). Redside is represented by only 9, ten counting Doctor Aeon, each one tends to uniquely represent an AT and an origin. Killing of States and Psyche may have been a way to mildly reduce the overswollen blueside hero signature NPCs.

-Spiting Jack Emmert may have also been A factor, but not the only factor.

So, these four factors, if all are assumed to be correct, basically make a hard case against States and Psyche's continued existences.

Originally Posted by Megajoule

Some "secret" anyway - people open Oro portals right in the middle of Atlas Plaza, and even the newsies seem to know about 'em. I haven't seen such a badly-kept secret since the true nature of the Rikti, known only to those with Omega clearance... or the Malta Group... or the Circle of Thorns... or the Clockwork...

(face it, there are no actual secrets in this game. at best, there are spoilers, and those only for a limited time.)

Originally Posted by Zombie Man

Oh, I see. If it's either the case of X or the case of not-X, then you're right anyways.

I see very clearly now.