Biospark

Sorry to paraphrase you GP

I totally agree with you on this thread and THAT OTHER THREAD.

Here is one thing that I have meant to say to those folks trying to prove that Scrappers infringe too much on Blaster territory. For "certain" combinations, this may be true and all the efforts through numbers and calculations (if presented correctly) could very well pursuade the dev crew of just such a case(s). BUT...

If they think that will somehow translate into an improvement for Blasters in a general sense, they will be sadly disappointed when all that happens is that the "offending" scrapper combinations get "normalized" to the general scrapper performance levels.

Personally, I do not want to spearhead changes which will cause a particular AT or powerset to be nerfed. If I wish to crusade for anything in this game it will be to bring the "under-performing SETS/ATs up to speed with the rest. Much more satisfactory for the players as a whole I believe.

Perhaps though, there are players that don't think there is a problem calling for nerfs.

Who knows

I think a better question would be Dark Melee/Shields or Martial Arts/Dark Armor

But of your two choices, it will probably have to come down to personal flavor or concept.
Martial Arts is really nice now with the cobra strike change. But it will still not impress anyone looking for an AoE powerhouse or even AoE capable set. Both of your choices will help out in the AoE department, but I think Shield Charge + AAO is going to be more impressive (as far as AoE dmg goes).

Both /Shields and /Dark Armor are going to take alot of influence to be really strong end game, but if you spend that time/influence the rewards are really there. /Dark is going to be reliant on a click heal until everything starts falling into place at the end-build, whereas /Shields is a little more "set-n-forget". One of these playstyles will appeal differently for each individual.

For instance, I prefer a "set-n-forget" playstyle on my melee characters, which is why I love the Willpower set. So from this you can see why I have dabbled in /Dark but never committed to going all the way with one. Most of what I know on /Dark comes from duoing with my guildmates Dark/Dark scrapper and helping him IO it out.

Hope that helps a little Tex

Spines/Dark would benefit from +Def and +recovery the most. Empathy or Cold Dom would be my vote.

Spines/Electric would still benefit a great deal from +Def but not sure how much +recovery you would need at the higher end. Spines can still use alot of endurance, especially if you go AoE happy. So again, I am still leaning toward Empathy or Cold.

Another set to seriously consider is Radiation Emission. You get great debuffs which can make any scrapper tougher, plus Acc Metabolsim is a great +recovery buff (in addition to what else it buffs).

Kinetics is a nice set for +recovery also, but it offers +resist which would be less useful for resist based sets like Dark/Fire/Elec. But with that being said Scrapper + Defender is one of my two all-time favorite Duo strategies. The other being Controller + Blaster.

Here is an interesting thing to consider though:

+Recovery buffs (Defender power by level)

Cold Domination ---> heat loss ----> level 32
Empathy ---> Adrenaline boost ----> level 32
Empathy ---> Recovery Aura (50% uptime) ----> level 18
Kinetics ----> Speed Boost ----> level 12
Radiation ----> Acc Metabolism ---> Level 2

As far as I know, there are no other primaries with any +recovery powers.

Have you considered going Villain long in order to choose Black Scorpion as your Patron ?

Scorpion Shield is ridiculously good Smash/Lethal/Energy defense.

If you are opposed to going this route, you can build 20% defense with a solid investment in IOs, but I am not sure how well that will work for the RWZ. Beyond 20% is hard to get for Kinetics unless you focus on certain types of defense like Ranged/Energy and in that case I have seen soft-capped (to Range) possible.

As far as Siphon Power goes, It's worth keeping for AV's/EBs/Bosses. You can stack it on FS and itself to really weaken them. also don't forget to spam Tranfusion on AVs even when no one is getting hurt because of the -regen in that power.

This QFE is exactly the first things I thought of.

For an AT that gives up AoE for Burst damage, to also lose HPs and have lower than scrapper damage seems like extra lemon juice on the wound. The game may be designed around +0/x1, but who ACTUALLY stays at that level of performance for any length of time.
SO-only Empaths ? Maybe ?

I would vote for leaving them just as squishy (seems like a good incentive to use Hide and strike techniques) but raise their Global ACC considerably. An Assassin that misses is not a very good Assassin. The added flexibility on slotting and early career benefits might just push them over the top (Single Target only).

I applaud you EG for your suggestions. Something needs to be done about PBs, but not having as much experience with them as others (most even), I cannot really say much to your ideas. But here are my thoughts anyway.

Gleaming Bolt : Please do something for this pathetic power. I cannot think of anything except Brawl that is as pathetic (damage-wise) as this power. I like the fast recharge, but please, PLEASE up the damage a little.

We need something to control with. Anything. I like the suggestions that have been made here to allow stacking effects. So it would be great to have PBAoE Hold to stack with the Melee Hold, or a single target Stun to stack with the AoE Stun. Anything would be good.
Heck, change solar flare to a Stun, then we could stack 2 AoE stuns.

Also, I really like the idea of Changing Light Form to EG's suggestions. But I wonder if that would make Human-Form just too good. I personally prefer Human form only, so I am biased. Others who prefer Tri-Form may not agree with the buff to Lightform.

Hmm, that does sound good. I am not planning on the Leadership toggles, but will be running Tough/Weave/CJ/Hot Feet. Maybe with Hasten and good use of IOs I could squeeze more toggles, but I will probably just stick with Hot Feet because of its larger radius. The big down-side is that Hot Feet will go away alot when doing exemplared stories and TFs. Might have to consider having Blazing Aura for just those times.

You should always play the one that you have the most fun with. And who says you have to pick one. Keep em both for awhile and see which one stands the test of time.

For me, its all about concept. My character Sunforge is a mutant who has the ability to harness the power of the Sun (Fusion). I colored the Radiation powers all to match the Orange/Yellow of the Fire powers, so they have a cohesive look, and wow do the Rad powers look good like that. The original character was planned to be Fire/Fire, but having played that combination in the past I knew there were no "hard" control powers like holds. This is what led me to look at other sets with actual "controls" in them.

Dual Pistols has a control in it, so you will have that added benefit, along with a "crashless" nuke and the whole set seems geared to play "in melee range". Odd for a Gun powerset, but eh, it looks cool.

Let us know how these (this) character progresses for you.

I have been playing around alot with mids regarding Blazing Aura and Hotfeet. Its not looking very good from solo standpoint but maybe Consume will make it all be fine. Burn OTH, definitely.

Neutron Bomb will replace combustion once I get there because the cast time of Neutron Bomb is 1.67 sec as opposed to Combustion at 3.0 sec. NB does less damage but will easily fit under the Aim or buildup, whereas now I spend alot of time in the combustion animation taking fire. Depending on when I popped Aim/Buildup I can miss the buff window for combustion (which is why it is last in the chain).

Ultimately while solo I am figuring Hot Feet + Blazing Aura(maybe) + Aim(or buildup) + Irradiate + FSC + Neutron Bomb :: then move to next spawn. For a really tough fight you could do both AIM and BUILDUP together, but most normal combats only requires one, so I like to alternate them.

I don't have any experience with Rad/Ice, but here are a couple of things about Rad Blast that make for very interesting synergy (with just about anything).

-DEF had always been a good thing. Good solo, Great on Teams. It makes higher-con villains easier to hit. Now put this with a Blaster who survives by taking down their enemies BEFORE losing all their hps and you see how this is a match made in heaven. Misses are very serious for Blasters, especially at the start of a fight. My little Rad/Fire was running around Galaxy and then King's Row looking for orange cons. I even tried some solo reds.

Rad Blast on a defender was low damage at best. Probably got better at higher levels, but the trick is to get to those higher levels using only what you got. Porting Rad Blast over to Blasters could have been the best thing for the set. The improved damage makes NB still a low-powered blast, but Blasters can skip it. YAY! And with the upcoming I19 changes, X-Ray eyes can be switched to a hand-blast if you prefer (Hey keep your minds out of the gutter).

Radiation Blast as a set kind of reminds me of Spines. Great AoE potential, but rather limited on single target damage. When you are playing a Defender, having limited single target damage is a very big concern at lower levels. On a Blaster, not as much.

EDIT: One more aspect of Radiation, which I took into consideration when I chose it was that Fire/Fire (More conceptual for this character of mine) had no Hard controls, only soft controls in Burn and Hot Feet. With my experience playing Defenders and Controllers (and Blasters too I guess), I think its very important to have some means of dealing with problem critters. And Cosmic Burst seems like a good candidate, especially when you consider Villain epic pools ::cough::OG:::cough

One thing that you will need to work out, in regards to synergy is whether you will be focusing your AoE for PBAoE or.... for Edge of spawn (Cones). These are two very different methods of dealing your damage. Depending on which way you go, it will change which AoEs you will take. My original thought was to stay at the edge of spawn and use powers like Electron Haze and Neutron Blast, but looking at cast times and other factors (like how much I hate cones), I decided to heck with it. PBAoE works just fine for my empath. Just look at the cast times of Irradiate and Fire Sword Circle and compare them to any two other combinations and you will see what made me focus on those two AoEs as my staple shots.

sorry for the long-post. Hope you find a combination that you like.

Yeah my gut tells me that 20 dps sounds like a low figure. But we are talking even con minions here. LoL

YES ! Listen to Claws.

My latest blaster toy is a Rad/Fire. Holy Devastation Batman !

Aim(or Buildup)+Irradiate+FSC+Combustion = Every spawn combo (all available by 10th except Buildup (level 16))

Cannot wait to add in Hot Feet.

Thanks for the detailed response Arcana,

The charts I gave were just thrown together to show the shape of the data.
One thing that I am currently working on is the creation of counter curves that represent something more like your "sawtooth" idea. I want to vary the amounts based on a unit of incoming damage we can call "One Minion". These counter arcs would intersect the mitigation curves at different points. By seeing how each set performs against 3/6/9 minion arcs, we attach a time value to each powerset.

I have been messing around in game to try and average what damage and recharge values to assign for a "One Minion" unit. Recharge is fairly variable (4-12 seconds) across villain types, but I feel pretty good about using an 8 second recharge. Damage between Ranged and Melee is just as wild, but I feel pretty good about a Ranged/Melee ratio of 66%/100%.

Any thoughts on what a "One Minion" metric would be ?
I am having trouble finding where you broke this down in your comparisons.

EDIT: Ok I found it. Could have sworn you had more info explaining how you arrived at 4.47%/sec for three minions. Is it safe to assume this value is entirely related to scrapper hp values?

I have a somewhat different take on how MMOs became team-oriented from the outset. The first BIG team MMO was a trend-setting MMO. Of that there is no doubt. And it was also my first MMO as well. I first began playing Pen-and-paper games in 1980 and these are the kind of games which Everquest was patterned after. In games like Dungeons and Dragons, the whole experience is a group-cooperative effort to overcome encounters. These are very different from first person shooters which center on single person skills and PVP centric activities. So having the idea of "Teaming" built-in was just an extension of the genre.

If you carry this forward to COH when it launched, it attempted to follow the (until then) standard of teaming but went after the instanced based missions (much maligned at the time) and something completely new in the scaling missions to team size. Because it is based on a different Genre than games like Everquest, it really has been pushed (by the players) into a more "solo" oriented focus. Teaming is there, but many players desire and insist on "soloability".

As much as I am currently upset with how Warcraft developed over time, I left CoH back in march 2005 and spent 3 years in that world. CoH could take a lesson from Warcraft in ways to improving solo and team play. For instance, in solo play our missions scale and can include everything from minions to AVs. One of the coolest features of Warcraft (to me) was that Instances contained mobs of Heroic strength. Imagine a team in CoH choosing to set their difficulty to Super-Heroic (a new level) and when you enter the mission +0/x1 would be just like a one person solo instance, but every minion is an EB, every Lt is an AV and every Boss is a GM. That's how you challenge teams. You don't need a bazillion more mobs of "minion" stature. You need fewer mobs of Heroic stature.

I am not advocating a replacement of existing settings, just something new that would require teams to create strategies in order to overcome, not just Moar AoE, and Moar zerg-rush. Lets see more "pulling" and target calling. More tactics.

But as a "super-hero based RPG", there must continue to be ways for the "solo" hero to thrive. If the game doesnt preserve "Soloability" then it strays from the genre too much.

We shall see. If you consider my main (Empathy/Electric) as one of the worst farm-capable choices for defenders, Incarnate means that my difficulties should go up. Currently, I can run +3/x1, +0/x3, or-1/x4 without too much difficulty. Against non-mezzing villain types I can run +1/x4. The only thing standing in the way of +0/x8 is a little more defense (currently at 20%S/L and 23%E/N) and some way to improve my susceptibility to Mezz effects.

Darn you Arcana !!

Now you have given me more to consider for my Defender primary comparisons. LOL

My current work is geared toward a 30 second comparison, which I have always viewed as a limit rather than a sustainable value. But I also have gone ahead and done the same work for 180 seconds as (what I felt initially) being a more sustainable amount of incoming damage. But mostly because there are alot of powers which do not work very well with a 30 second window.

Now, thanks to you, I can clearly see that the whole time-sustainable damage picture will be a curve with zero seconds being the true absolute limit, but changing across each arbitrary time-frame chosen. I instinctively knew this, but looks like I am gonna need to rework some things and actually create graphs. I work in electronics and we do some testing of circuit boards using oscillascopes, and what we look for in these models are plataeus on the graphical representation of the data. I "suspect" that creating these same types of graphs using models like your 30sec/60sec time-frames, but across every interval from 1 to 180 secs will not have very distinctive "plataeus", so what are your feelings about how to analyse "slope" changes over time (in this context) ?

Thank goodness for Excel, cause this is fast approaching my math limits, hehe.

P.S. I take my statement back. It looks like there will definitely be a distinctive slope change (plataeu) when you graph each time-interval as its own point. The following are two representations of a hero on baseline regen 0.42hps shown. The first chart shows Y as DPS (%total health/sec) and X being the time to defeat in 10 sec intervals. As you approach 180 secs, you see that it is getting close to the immortality value for baseline regen, while at the front end it would approach 100% damage/sec for defeat (pretty obvious that if you sustain 100% of your hps before even the first regen tick, you will be defeated).

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/5013/rxclp5.png

http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/3572/rxclp6.png

The second chart is just a representation of the change in each interval relative to the previous point.

Ok I will concede this point. Not because I don't believe IOs are irrelevent, but simply because any mathematical comparison between the two ATs would have to be conducted on base power values, and survival mitigation amounts.

One thing that I have often felt about blasters is that as much as you CAN play them in melee range, they function so much better AT RANGE. What if their tier one power in the secondary was an AoE immobilize, and their version of AIM recharged fast enough to be near-perma with alot of slotting. Lets say bring the recharge down to 30-40 seconds base. I realize this does not address the concerns of some about their toughness in general, but by adding more ability to KEEP critters at range, it's a great way to point Blaster newbs in the right direction.